Dutch/USA residence-card application: Dutch solvit response

[BigAppleWoodenShoe]

So, we complained at the Dutch Solvit about our predicament here in Ireland.

Our case: My wife is American, I moved here in Sept. of '06, she joined me in Jan. of 2007, our application for a residence card has been taken officially longer than 6 months.
A couple of days ago we complained to Dutch-Solvit, I received a detailed answer almost immediately. (I am used to have to wait for everything here).

Because it was in Dutch, I wont copy and paste it here.
But the next is a general translation:

I am sorry to inform you we cannot help you with your case.

The European law for a non-EEA member state spouse without previous residence in another EU country, which applies to your wife, is interpreted differently in certain European countries than how it was intended by the European commission.
Besides that, there are problems with the Irish gov't not keeping to the 6 month deadline.

The Solvit-network works on basis of informal inter-mediating. On this moment we have a similar case like yours ongoing with Solvit-Ireland, but that doesn't show any signs of progress. The reason for this is that the Irish Govt does not want to listen to Solvit-Ireland, and then there is nothing Solvit can do.

What you can do is complain to the European commission, but this can take a long time. The more people complain, the more visible the problem becomes and there will be a better chance the EC will do something about it. I figure this would be the same case with the Irish Ombudsman.

The fastest way ahead would be to hire a lawyer, but I cannot say anything about the costs involved.

Solvit Centre Netherlands



So, it was nice to read that the Irish govt is just not listening to Irish Solvit, but, they can't do anything about from their end.

[SYH]

Oh how cute, I just realized the signicance of your handle
It is awful this nonsense of countries not following or uniformly applying the rules. In any case, can't you just settle in Holland so your wife can accrue her time there before officially moving to ireland, thats not to say the dutch ind is any faster in processing residence permits so maybe setting up in another country to bypass this nonsense

[BigAppleWoodenShoe]

(one of) the idea(s) about going to Ireland first was to go more easily to the Netherlands. All the institutions we talked with made it seem very easy. But that came back and slapped us in the face.

The Netherlands is indeed not an easy country to get in to, but at least the regulations and rules are better stated.

After dealing with the Irish goverment for 6 months, I don't think I'll ever feel the need to live here again.

[SYH]

(one of) the idea(s) about going to Ireland first was to go more easily to the Netherlands. All the institutions we talked with made it seem very easy. But that came back and slapped us in the face.

The Netherlands is indeed not an easy country to get in to, but at least the regulations and rules are better stated.

After dealing with the Irish goverment for 6 months, I don't think I'll ever feel the need to live here again.

I heard Belgium or the UK were better countries to start off in.
Ireland and spain so far have been the leaders in being in the troublemaker

[BigAppleWoodenShoe]

I am aware of that now, however, I can't get very excited about Britain and in Belgium my wife still has that ol' language barrier.

The fact of the matter is that I am throwing the towel in the ring when it comes to Ireland amending their law to European directives. It is obvious to me that they will not do so in the near future. The only way out for us here is to get her a work permit, but there is not much work in her field (around 5 openings in 6 months, Cork+Dublin). The Public health sector is not that big in Ireland.

The issue is that when she is denied, whenever that may come, she will be told to leave, I rather not be dependent on this sword of Damocles, so we need to look elsewhere. Which is a pity, because I like the work that I do here.

[JAJ]

I am aware of that now, however, I can't get very excited about Britain and in Belgium my wife still has that ol' language barrier.

Is Northern Ireland an option?

If you do go to the Netherlands, your spouse can probably get Dutch citizenship after a few years (and not need to give up U.S. citizenship).

Naturalisation seems to be possible even living outside the Netherlands but it seems that language knowledge is needed:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_nationality_law

[SYH]

I am aware of that now, however, I can't get very excited about Britain and in Belgium my wife still has that ol' language barrier.

The fact of the matter is that I am throwing the towel in the ring when it comes to Ireland amending their law to European directives. It is obvious to me that they will not do so in the near future. The only way out for us here is to get her a work permit, but there is not much work in her field (around 5 openings in 6 months, Cork+Dublin). The Public health sector is not that big in Ireland.

The issue is that when she is denied, whenever that may come, she will be told to leave, I rather not be dependent on this sword of Damocles, so we need to look elsewhere. Which is a pity, because I like the work that I do here.

What background does your wife have. She can make it in Belgium, I have no Dutch whatsoever and I work at some really well paying jobs, albeit mind numbing comparative wise from the USA jobs I had. Besides you dutchies don't do us any favours by speaking only English to us. You have to help her become more marketable, get her Dutch skills up to speed. As for Britain, I think you have to be fair to your wife to get her started and if there is some sacrifice along the way for the greater good, then do it. Your life is on hold on held hostage anyway by doing this in half measures, believe you me.

[SYH]

I am aware of that now, however, I can't get very excited about Britain and in Belgium my wife still has that ol' language barrier.

Is Northern Ireland an option?

If you do go to the Netherlands, your spouse can probably get Dutch citizenship after a few years (and not need to give up U.S. citizenship).

Naturalisation seems to be possible even living outside the Netherlands but it seems that language knowledge is needed:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_nationality_law

The dutch systems is a bit wacky. She would have to pass a language test to be naturalized so far, and do some integration crap course when she registers, pain in the mule and worthless course.
AND the dutch govt is being quite difficult, for now, she can keep us citizenship if married to a dutchie but they try to change it all the time to deter foreignors who they find undesirable

[BigAppleWoodenShoe]

@SYH, thanks for your help, it is not me that has issues with GB, it is her. I wouldn't mind it so much, although I must say it is not my country of choice.

My wife's Dutch is actually pretty good, she understands what I say most of the time, and she can speak some words, but it is not 'marketable' yet as you have put it nicely. She'll need a few courses and some sort of a diploma. I have found that Belgium is pretty open to non french/dutch speakers, for instance, monsterboard is in En/Fr/Du in Belgium, while there is only a dutch version in the Netherlands. However, doing public health studies, speaking the native tongue is often required.

In the Netherlands she'll have to take a Dutch test in 5 years, because she is from an 'industrialized' country, the rules are more lenient (which is quite strange). The immigration rules were a mess in the NL, but I believe that has cleared up a little.

But like you two said, we are already looking for different places, she has applied back in the US, in NL, and in Germany.

If I would have to give any advice for international couples: if you move from country to country, have the person for which it would be most difficult move first. So for us it would be better if I(dutch) would get a job in the US prior to moving over there, and for here to get a job in Europe prior to moving over there.

[SYH]

@SYH, thanks for your help, it is not me that has issues with GB, it is her. American with a problem with Britain, interesting.
My wife's Dutch is actually pretty good, Good to hear. I have found that Belgium is pretty open to non french/dutch speakers. However, doing public health studies, speaking the native tongue is often required. "Her start off job doesn't have to be in that field" You want her to be productive. Once with job, then you can find better or more appropriate ones Anyway, you are just doing it for the interim to get to the country you really want to be in so the job doesn't have to hit the spotIn the Netherlands she'll have to take a Dutch test in 5 years, 3 years if she is married to a Dutchie The immigration rules were a mess in the NL, but I believe that has cleared up a little. yeah kind of, can only grunt on this one

But like you two said, we are already looking for different places, she has applied back in the US, in NL, and in Germany.
US doesn't help you European wise, the other two are better, although I'd still try BelgiumIf I would have to give any advice for international couples: if you move from country to country, have the person for which it would be most difficult move first. So for us it would be better if I(dutch) would get a job in the US prior to moving over there, and for here to get a job in Europe prior to moving over there.

Its quite hard to get a job unless you are present so as much as that is prudent it isn't pratical.

[Dawie]

Ireland needs to be threatened with expulsion from the European Union if they don't sort out their immigration laws.