Success! UK Spouse Visa - Malaysia (via Manila)

[Casa]

I believe that if the entry is permitted for a very short period, the passport is held at the airport for collection on or before the given date of departure. I know that's what happened when my Croatian (now) daughter-in-law was given a concession of a few days entry some years ago and this was also the case according to a recent post by a forum member.
I also believe that she would be returned to Switzerland, which is why airline carriers are always nervous about accepting passengers without a valid visa. MPH8O may be able to shed further light on both circumstances.

As MPH80 has said, she may be lucky and have a 6 month stamp in her passport.

[MPH80]

First MPH80, you say that the ECO could give her a less than 6 months entry, how would they enforce that?

The stamp is marked with the number of days she's allowed in for - it's also recorded on the system. They know from airline records when some departs. So any overstay is easily tracked.

And as Casa's outlined - it's possible to be refused, but also be allowed a short entry - up to a week. In that case - the passport is normally retained.

And secondly, if she was bounced on re-entry, would she be sent back to her home country (Malaysia) or back to her last port of exit (Switzerland)?

It's a very good question. Reading what I've read ... the default is port of embarkation - but I think she could request to be returned to either. I believe the carrier has a liability if someone is turned around and they may well fight back if they fly someone from Switerland who decides they want to go to Malaysia.

However, please keep in mind that this counts as a refusal of entry clearance and will need to be disclosed on any visa form which requests it - it may also be shared with a number of European and other western countries. Thinking 'hey - we'll try it and see ... worst that can happen is she's put on a plane' ... well - yes - but the refusal will count against her in future and you may find those future trips not so easy to achieve.

[limey10]

The stamp is marked with the number of days she's allowed in for - it's also recorded on the system. They know from airline records when some departs. So any overstay is easily tracked.

And as Casa's outlined - it's possible to be refused, but also be allowed a short entry - up to a week. In that case - the passport is normally retained.

Okay, we could live with that.

It's a very good question. Reading what I've read ... the default is port of embarkation - but I think she could request to be returned to either. I believe the carrier has a liability if someone is turned around and they may well fight back if they fly someone from Switerland who decides they want to go to Malaysia.

However, please keep in mind that this counts as a refusal of entry clearance and will need to be disclosed on any visa form which requests it - it may also be shared with a number of European and other western countries. Thinking 'hey - we'll try it and see ... worst that can happen is she's put on a plane' ... well - yes - but the refusal will count against her in future and you may find those future trips not so easy to achieve.

I read somewhere on the UKVI site that a refusal of entry doesn't always result in a ban and that it would not affect subsequent applications for visas of another type. Having said that, I wonder if they would simply allow us to purchase a ticket back to Malaysia voluntarily.

Phil

Found it on the Transpondia website:

It is sad that lots of people (including the media) call this process 'deportation', which is wrong. Getting bounced is properly termed 'administrative removal' and carries none of the pejorative effects of deportation. Deportation usually occurs after a person has been sentenced in criminal court, served time in prison and then attends a specially convened session before a judge who issues a deportation order.

What happens after a person is bounced? It is certainly not the end of the world. In the absence of a ban, the person is free to try their luck again. Also, there is no prescribed time which must elapse between successive attempts (we have seen people try to enter on the next day). Generally, however, we recommend that the person spend some time sorting out whatever issues caused the bounce and then get an entry clearance visa from a British Consulate. People who have been bounced cannot use the premium service to expedite their application.

It is not necessary to hire a solicitor to make the entry clearance application, but sometimes it can be helpful if the solicitor has an established practice area working with administrative removal cases.

And finally, in all but the most extreme cases, a bounce has no effect upon a subsequent fiance or spouse application. This is because fiance and spouse applications are predicated upon an intent to settle in the UK whereas visitor applications (i.e., those that can result in administrative removal) are predicated upon an intent to leave the UK.

[Casa]

I believe MPH80 was referring to future visitor visa applications. An entry refusal wouldn't affect a later application for a spouse settlement visa but it should be disclosed.

[MPH80]

Absolutely - it won't affect, by itself, a spouse visa application - but it will probably cause a much closer dig through. You should then note that it may have to be declared for other countries and cause further investigations on their part.

Might not sound like a problem now - but I seriously wonder why risking all this difficulty is worth one Christmas when you plan to spend the rest of your lives together.

[limey10]

Absolutely - it won't affect, by itself, a spouse visa application - but it will probably cause a much closer dig through. You should then note that it may have to be declared for other countries and cause further investigations on their part.

Might not sound like a problem now - but I seriously wonder why risking all this difficulty is worth one Christmas when you plan to spend the rest of your lives together.

You make a very valid point, which is really why i'm checking now rather than feeling stupid later.

Over the weekend I have written a ton of emails, trying to get the house sale sewn up so that my misses can go back and get her visa. I think we will ditch the Switzerland trip - it's just not worth the risk.

[Rayking]

I believe MPH80 was referring to future visitor visa applications. An entry refusal wouldn't affect a later application for a spouse settlement visa but it should be disclosed.

Casa,why do you always say it won't affect future application, just want to know better really,if someone is found to have concealed an info and visa got refused,even if an appeal is won,hasn't that affected the application or are you saying refusal of entry due to being sent back can never cause spouse refusal in any way.

[Rayking]

Absolutely - it won't affect, by itself, a spouse visa application - but it will probably cause a much closer dig through. You should then note that it may have to be declared for other countries and cause further investigations on their part.

Might not sound like a problem now - but I seriously wonder why risking all this difficulty is worth one Christmas when you plan to spend the rest of your lives together.

You make a very valid point, which is really why i'm checking now rather than feeling stupid later.

Over the weekend I have written a ton of emails, trying to get the house sale sewn up so that my misses can go back and get her visa. I think we will ditch the Switzerland trip - it's just not worth the risk.

Remember the required amount needs to stay in your account for 6 months? Or am I missing something?

[MPH80]

Casa,why do you always say it won't affect future application, just want to know better really,if someone is found to have concealed an info and visa got refused,even if an appeal is won,hasn't that affected the application or are you saying refusal of entry due to being sent back can never caused spouse refusal in any way.

Reasonable questions.

By itself - a refusal of entry is not enough to deny a spouse visa. Nor is an overstay or deception. The refusal criteria for a spouse visa are very specific with the exception of 320(11). That's the catch-all 'discretionary' ban. If someone has overstayed AND worked for example - they can invoke that ban even on a spouse visa.

[MPH80]

Remember the required amount needs to stay in your account for 6 months? Or am I missing something?

Actually ... (my bolding)

(d) Funds held as cash savings by the applicant, their partner or both jointly at the date of
application can be from the proceeds of the sale of property, in the form only of a
dwelling, other building or land, which took place within the period of 6 months prior to
the date of application, provided that:
(i) The property (or relevant share of the property) was owned at the beginning of
the period of 6 months prior to the date of application and at the date of sale by
the applicant, their partner or both jointly.
(ii) Where ownership of the property was shared with a third party, only the
proceeds of the sale of the share of the property owned by the applicant, their
partner or both jointly may be counted.
(iii) The funds deposited as cash savings are the net proceeds of the sale, once
any mortgage or loan secured on the property (or relevant share of the property)
has been repaid and once any taxes and professional fees associated with the
sale have been paid.
(iv) The decision-maker is satisfied that the requirements in sub-paragraphs (i)-(iii)
are met on the basis of information and documents submitted in support of the
application. These may include for example:
(1) Registration information or documentation (or a copy of this) from the
Land Registry (or overseas equivalent).
(2) A letter from a solicitor (or other relevant professional, if the sale takes
place overseas) instructed in the sale of the property confirming the sale
price and other relevant information.
(3) A letter from a lender (a bank or building society) on its headed
stationery regarding the repayment of a mortgage or loan secured on the
property.
(4) Confirmation of payment of taxes or professional fees associated with
the sale.
(5) Any other relevant evidence that the requirements in subparagraphs (i)-
(iii) are met.

[limey10]

Remember the required amount needs to stay in your account for 6 months? Or am I missing something?

To the best of my knowledge, savings obtained from the sale of a house can be used immediately.

[Rayking]

Casa,why do you always say it won't affect future application, just want to know better really,if someone is found to have concealed an info and visa got refused,even if an appeal is won,hasn't that affected the application or are you saying refusal of entry due to being sent back can never caused spouse refusal in any way.

Reasonable questions.

By itself - a refusal of entry is not enough to deny a spouse visa. Nor is an overstay or deception. The refusal criteria for a spouse visa are very specific with the exception of 320(11). That's the catch-all 'discretionary' ban. If someone has overstayed AND worked for example - they can invoke that ban even on a spouse visa.

Interesting! There's nothing to worry about then,he can take the risk since it doesn't affect spouse visa.

[MPH80]

Interesting! There's nothing to worry about then,he can take the risk since it doesn't affect spouse visa.

Except it's not the immediate spouse visa I'd worry about.

The sale of the house still has to complete. What if he wants another tourist visa in the meantime? What if she wants to travel to Australia or the USA or Canada or other places that might ask about refusals ... What if the marriage breaks down? etc etc etc.

It's not worth it sometimes.

[limey10]

Interesting! There's nothing to worry about then,he can take the risk since it doesn't affect spouse visa.

Except it's not the immediate spouse visa I'd worry about.

The sale of the house still has to complete. What if he wants another tourist visa in the meantime? What if she wants to travel to Australia or the USA or Canada or other places that might ask about refusals ... What if the marriage breaks down? etc etc etc.

It's not worth it sometimes.

In the absence of a ban, the person is free to try their luck again. Also, there is no prescribed time which must elapse between successive attempts (we have seen people try to enter on the next day).

The whole reason for us moving back to the UK is that my son has educational needs that can't be catered for in Malaysia. My wife was working for Malaysia Airlines up until 2 weeks before MH370. She has lost around 45 colleagues/friends in the last year.

We are solid..... no Spouse Visa application is going to get in our way!

[Casa]

Sorry if we appear to be constantly 'throwing a spanner in the works'. We're actually on your side.

[MPH80]

Sorry if we appear to be constantly 'throwing a spanner in the works'. We're actually on your side.

Yes - just to clarify my 'it's not worth it sometimes' comment - that wasn't about relationships (especially yours!) - it was about the risk/reward of slightly risky visa scenarios.

We really do want to ensure you get the spouse visa in the quickest time possible.

[limey10]

Hi all

Just a quick update.

I spoke to UKVI and was pleasantly surprised at their willingness to help. Everything that has been said on this thread was echoed by them i.e., stamp on entry visa holders allowed to spend 6 months out of 12 in the UK. Furthermore, they gave me the phone number for immigration control at Heathrow terminal 4, and I was even more shocked when I called the number and it "was" immigration control at Heathrow terminal 4.

Spoke at some length to a gentleman there, explained my story as honestly as possible. The bottom line reply was: No guarantees, but given my wife's firm intention to leave the country early next year (reinforced by her holding a ticket to do so) along with our detailed paperwork that demonstrates that we fully intend to apply for her Spouse Visa from Malaysia (including a partially completed application with only the financial requirement information missing, plus she already has her IELTS pass certificate), he strongly intimated towards a positive response from any Entry Officer.

Subject to a miracle of our house sale completing within the next 2 weeks, I think we are going with Plan 1

On the subject of Financial Requirement, I will be asking a related question shortly in the correct forum location.

Regards, Phil

[Casa]

Sounds encouraging. Keep us updated.

[limey10]

Hi All.

My son was diagnosed recently with autism and is about to get his statement of special educational needs from the local authority in Wiltshire.

With this in mind, from what I have read, I believe that he (or I) will be entitled to DLA

My Malaysian wife is also about to apply for her Spouse visa. The major part of this (as i'm sure it is for many many people) is the financial requirement.

VAF4A Appendix 2, Part 3 asks: Is your sponsor in receipt of a disability related or carers benefit listed within the guidance notes?

From what I have seen on the forum here, DLA is one of the applicable benefits, but I couldn't find that in the forms guidance notes.

1) Can someone point me in the right direction for that list.
2) Could it really be this simple to solve the financial requirement, even though the amount claimed might be as low as 20 to 50 pounds a week?

Thanks in advance for any answers given, Phil

[limey10]

Sounds encouraging. Keep us updated.

As promised, here is an update.

My wife went to visit her friend in Geneva as planned.

On her return she carried all of her Visa application documents, a return ticket to Kuala Lumpur in January, and a positive attitude.

So Heathrow Terminal 2 immigration officer questions my wife, "where have you come from?" (Geneva) "I see you have already been in the country for 5 months; why don't you have a spouse visa yet? (before she could answer)..... i bet it's because of the financial requirement eh?" (yes, that's correct), "it must be tough being away from your family, especially your little boy".... "okay mam, have a nice stay" STAMP, entry clearance granted.

Not only did the officer not ask for her flight itinerary, he appeared to have a significant amount of sympathy for her plight. Such a weight lifted off our shoulders right now, I can not begin to say how relieved we are. She can now have Christmas with her family and then head out in January to get her spouse visa. Phew! Hats off to you immi man at Heathrow T2.

Phil

[Casa]

Brilliant! Have a great Christmas.

[vinny]

Good to see a compassionate Immigration Officer.

[limey10]

Has anyone got any experience of applying for a Spouse Visa using DLA?

Regards, Phil

[Casa]

Although as you know, I'm not the most knowledgeable regarding the financial exemption, it does appear that you may be OK going by the following (UKVI)

3.6.1. Where the applicant’s partner is in receipt of any of the following benefits or allowances in
the UK, the applicant will be able to meet the financial requirement at that application stage
by providing evidence of “adequate maintenance” rather than meeting an income threshold:
 Carer’s Allowance.
 Disability Living Allowance.
 Severe Disablement Allowance.
 Industrial Injuries Disablement Benefit.
 Attendance Allowance.
 Personal Independence Payment.
 Armed Forces Independence Payment or Guaranteed Income Payment under the
Armed Forces Compensation Scheme.
 Constant Attendance Allowance, Mobility Supplement or War Disablement Pension
under the War Pensions Scheme.
3.6.2. If the applicant’s partner is in receipt of one of the above benefits or allowances on behalf of
their child, the applicant will be able to qualify by meeting the financial requirement through
“adequate maintenance”.

[limey10]

Hi Casa

I did try to contact Amber, but no response yet.

I did find this at the March 2013 IMMIGRATION DIRECTORATE INSTRUCTIONS ANNEX F
CHAPTER 8 SPOUSES & CIVIL PARTNERS SECTION 1 & 2

They use the following formula to work out adequate maintenance
A – B ≥ C
Where A minus B is greater than or equal to C.
Where: A is the projected income (after deduction of income tax and national insurance contributions); B is what needs to be spent on accommodation; and C is the amount of Income Support an equivalent British family of that size can receive.
Example:
Mr X wishes to sponsor his wife and his two children from country Y. Currently Mr X receives £380.17 per week.
Details of Mr X‟s income must be evidenced in the following format:
Income Source Interval Received Equivalent weekly amount
Net (post tax) salary from employer Weekly £161.30
Working Tax Credit £364.71 every four weeks Divided by 4 = £91.18
Child Benefit £134.80 every four weeks Divided by 4 = £33.70
Child Tax Credit £93.99
Total £380.17

Mr X‟s rental accommodation costs £50 per week.
The sum of the formula A – B above is therefore:
£380.17 - £50 = £330.17
Income Support Equivalent Calculation
To assess whether the sum of C is greater than or equal to the level of Income Support a British family of that size would be entitled to receive, staff must in all cases demonstrate calculations‟ in the following format:
Element Interval Amount
Income Support Rate for a couple Weekly £102.75
Each dependent child from birth to age of 20 £57.57 x 2 Weekly £115.14
Family Premium Weekly £17.40
Total £235.29
In this example the applicant‟s net income less accommodation costs is more than the level a British family of that size would be entitled to under Income Support. This example would therefore meet the requirement to demonstrate „adequate‟ maintenance.

I have read stories from applicants who have met these criteria but still had their applications refused.

I am actually fairly close to these figures, although I wish I could find somewhere to rent for £50 a week. These figures are obviously nearly 2 years old now. Hopefully Amber will know the answer

Regards, Phil