UK Naric Letter-Important

[nikkyraj]

Hi

We applied for my wifes ILR (pre June 2012 rules) and just got a letter today from Home Office to say that they require a letter from UK Naric to confirm that her degree from India was taught in English.

When we applied for ILR , we sent her original Bachelors Degree from India, with a print out from the UKBA points calculator website to fulfil that requirement, in which she was gaining 10 points for her degree and English requirement.

We got a letter today saying that we acknowledge that you have submitted a bachelors degree from x university, which is confirmed by UK Naric as equivalent to a UK Bachelors degree, but we also need a letter from UK NAric that the degree was taught or researched in English.

As far as i was aware, if you can get 10 points on the points based calculator that proves that the degree is equivalent and has been taught in English. Bit stressed about this now, as they have given only 14 days to get a letter from Naric so any help will be appreciated.

Thanks.

[nks]

can you provide exact wordings of letter please?

[kommsu]

Hi Nikkyraj,

Sorry to hear your situation . As my ILR is due in 2 weeks , I have sent an email to [b]KnowledgeOfLifePolicyQueries@homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk[/b] to clarify myself on this , and got below reply on English language requirement .So, I would request you to send an email asap to above address (send email saying that you need to apply for ILR in 2 weeks) and get confirmation from them.
Other option is you need to apply for NARIC fast service and you will get certificates 2-3 working days (website information , I am not sure) .

========================================================
Dear XXXXXXXX

We will need to see evidence of your English language qualification, for both settlement and citizenship, even if you have submitted this previously.

You will see on page 16 of the ILR form in link below, that it asks if you have a degree qualification deemed by UKNARIC to be comparable to a UK degree and taught in English.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _04-15.pdf

The Home Office will accept a PBS printout providing you enter the calculator as tier 2 general (even if you were not) as Tier 1 general route is now closed(see our website for further details) and skip to the English language section, enter your degree details here. The PBS calculator is updated for our use by UKNARIC and therefore, providing you achieve 10 points on the calculator, then UKNARIC have deemed this acceptable to the Home Office.

https://www.gov.uk/english-language/degrees-in-english

If you don't receive 10 points, you will need to obtain a UK NARIC assessment.

Kind regards


Gemma Parle
Nationality and Settlement Operational Policy | Immigration & Border Policy | Home Office

==========================================================================

Please update final status , so that all forum members understand it.

Kind Regards,
Kommsu

[nikkyraj]

The letter says :

"From Oct 2013 applicants must demonstrate sufficient Knowledge of English and about life in the UK.

It is noted that you have submitted a Degree from X University which has been confirmed by UK Nairc to be equivalent to a UK Bachelor Degree.

However, in accordance with Appendix KOLL, where applicant has obtained an academic qualification abroad they need to provide evidence that such qualifications is deemed by UK Nairc to meet recognised standard of Bachelor's or Masters degree in the UK , AND provides the specified evidence to show:
1. The person has qualification
2. The qualification was taught or researched in English (in bold)

With this in mind , can you obtain the necessary documentation from UK Nairc to confirm the qualification is the equivalent of a UK Bachelor's or Masters degree and that the course was taught or researched in English as noted in point 2 above. "

Thanks

[nks]

confusing... The letter says NARIC has confirmed and then goes on to ask for letter from NARIC. The autoreply in post above also confirms that a PBS calculator printout with 10 points should suffice. I think you can go back with the reply from UKVI in post above and clarify that KOLL requirements are met per PBS calculator.

[nikkyraj]

Thanks that is what I was unsure as well, when I have submitted the original degree and a printout of the Point Based Calculator confirming 10 points, why do I still need a letter from Naric to confirm the same ?

I called Naric just now as well, and according to them if I need an English Language Assessment, I would need to apply for it and there is no fast track service for the same. They do fast track service for Statement of Compatibility, but not for English Language Assessment, so it will take around 10-15 working days for them to reply.
They also need a letter from the University confirming that the degree was taught in English, along with the degree certificate and mark sheets.
We have not got a letter from the University, and it will not be easy getting one either.

Home office wants a reply with 14 days, so it's all a bit mixed up.

Can you please confirm what you said in your last message , what should I do now ?

[cs95tdg]

You may also want to check the thread below, where the same has been confirmed by the settlement ops team. As suggested I would write to them and get personal confirmation which you can then present to them.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/indefi ... l#p1171246

EDIT - Since my original post I've re-read the text you posted and notice a difference in what they are requesting NARIC confirmation for. It's confirmation that your bachelors degree is equivalent to one in the UK. And also that it was Taught in English. What the PBS now no longer allows is for you do this, as they've removed the T1G option, which allowed you to do this in the past. All you are now able to do through the PBS calculator is confirm that the degree is taught in English & score 10 points.

[nks]

Did your wife use same degree for meeting English language requirements in past?

I would reply to this letter with reference to UKVI guidelines saying PBS calculator printout would suffice and insist that degree with PBS calculator output meets KOLL requirements. If same degree was used in past, that makes case stronger.

[nikkyraj]

Thanks guys.
Yes she used the same degree to apply for her visa from India to come to the UK after we got married in Feb 2012 and she came to the UK in May 2012.
We applied for her ILR in June 2014 and it was delayed because of a court case with some work related issues. When we applied, the Teir 1 G was still valid, and we checked everything and applied according to that.
Now that the rules have changed and Tier 1 G no longer exists, is it fair for them to ask for more information in such short space of time ?

[nks]

You may also want to check the thread below, where the same has been confirmed by the settlement ops team. As suggested I would write to them and get personal confirmation which you can then present to them.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/indefi ... l#p1171246

EDIT - Since my original post I've re-read the text you posted and notice a difference in what they are requesting NARIC confirmation for. It's confirmation that your bachelors degree is equivalent to one in the UK. And also that it was Taught in English. What the PBS now no longer allows is for you do this, as they've removed the T1G option, which allowed you to do this in the past. All you are now able to do through the PBS calculator is confirm that the degree is taught in English & score 10 points.

Interesting point but the letter starts with saying that 'degree confirmed by NARIC to be equivalent' and highlights (put in bold) that evidence for 'being taught in english' required. Would you still think they are asking for equivalence certificate? If yes, that can be obtained with fast track service.

With all this debate, and even if T1(G) calculator is removed, I wonder how difficult it would be for UKVI to verify that qualification is equivalent and taught in English just like they did prior to 6th April!!

[cs95tdg]

Interesting point but the letter starts with saying that 'degree confirmed by NARIC to be equivalent' and highlights (put in bold) that evidence for 'being taught in english' required. Would you still think they are asking for equivalence certificate? If yes, that can be obtained with fast track service.

With all this debate, and even if T1(G) calculator is removed, I wonder how difficult it would be for UKVI to verify that qualification is equivalent and taught in English just like they did prior to 6th April!!

I know, the 2nd point being highlighted in bold and the initial statement as it stands is confusing. Additionally I know, both points do seem to be things they should be able to verify (using the PBS option for T1G, unless this has completely been removed internally as well). I'm guessing they are pushing as much of the burden of proof to the applicant.

All that said and done, in order to cover all bases I would do the following first:
1) Write to the settlement ops team email address asking for clarification/confirmation highlighting the urgency.
2) Keep hold of the PBS printout where you score 10 points under English language for the degree.
3) Get a NARIC degree equivalency certificate. Do this if you will get it in time.. Possibly wait until you get a response to point 1) if time permits.

[KASHIF830]

The letter says :

"From Oct 2013 applicants must demonstrate sufficient Knowledge of English and about life in the UK.

It is noted that you have submitted a Degree from X University which has been confirmed by UK Nairc to be equivalent to a UK Bachelor Degree.

However, in accordance with Appendix KOLL, where applicant has obtained an academic qualification abroad they need to provide evidence that such qualifications is deemed by UK Nairc to meet recognised standard of Bachelor's or Masters degree in the UK , AND provides the specified evidence to show:
1. The person has qualification
2. The qualification was taught or researched in English (in bold)

With this in mind , can you obtain the necessary documentation from UK Nairc to confirm the qualification is the equivalent of a UK Bachelor's or Masters degree and that the course was taught or researched in English as noted in point 2 above. "

Thanks

Hi Mate

I give you advice please dont take hassle and ask your wife to give B1 as soon as possible and submit reference number to UKVI and better to ask UKVI about B1 if they accept fresh evidence as English language you definitely will get a earlier date may be On Monday.

Thanks
Kashif

[nks]

Looking further into this, it kind of appears that requirement is likely for 'equivalence certificate'.

Refer https://www.gov.uk/english-language/degrees-in-english

It says you will need original certificate and 1 of following:
-PBS printout showing both 'equivalence' and 'English level'
-NARIC equivalence certificate and letter from University saying degree was taught in English
-certificate that degree was taught in majority English speaking country

Point to note is there is no option for NARIC English level certificate. If your qualification is not on PBS, you have to provide NARIC equivalence certificate and letter from university. Since your PBS printout only confirms English level (though I wonder if equivalence is not a prerequisite of this), CW will need document for equivalence.

This perhaps went through in your wife's previous application as only 'English level' was the requirement and not 'Equivalence', while for ILR both are required. It perhaps won't affect Tier 1 General main applicants as 'Equivalence' has been proved in previous applications. All welcome to comment/critique on my thoughts.

[nikkyraj]

Thanks for all your replies and help.

If you read my earlier post where I have quoted the wording of Home Office, it clearly acknowledged that the degree and Pas calculator confirms the equivalence of the degree to UK Bachelor's degree, but not the English level.

What they're looking for is a letter to confirm that the degree has been taught in English.
This is so frustrating as they like to complicate things for people. I have just went through the PBS system again and it still awards 10 points for my wife's degree.
The title says "English Skills". If the degree was not taught in English, why are they still awarding 10 points under the title "English Skills" ?

[cs95tdg]

Thanks for all your replies and help.

If you read my earlier post where I have quoted the wording of Home Office, it clearly acknowledged that the degree and Pas calculator confirms the equivalence of the degree to UK Bachelor's degree, but not the English level.

What they're looking for is a letter to confirm that the degree has been taught in English.
This is so frustrating as they like to complicate things for people. I have just went through the PBS system again and it still awards 10 points for my wife's degree.
The title says "English Skills". If the degree was not taught in English, why are they still awarding 10 points under the title "English Skills" ?

Unfortunately the letter that you have received isn't something that fits the standard seen by others, where the PBS printout has been accepted to meet the English language requirement (therefore I doubt you will get the answer you need from anyone here as it stands) If its purely the English language requirement that needs to be proven, then you have several options to choose from to move forward.
1) Challenge what they say in the letter, by getting written confirmation from the settlement ops team that the pbs printout is acceptable. You should state your wife's exact circumstances when asking for confirmation. Then submit that.
2) Do what one of the other posters has suggested and have your wife take a English test and have it done with. You may consider that to be more straightforward and less aggravating/stressful. Do enquire if the HO will accept fresh evidence, if required explaining that you will not get the NARIC English language assessment within the stipulated time, if that's the case.

[cs95tdg]

Looking further into this, it kind of appears that requirement is likely for 'equivalence certificate'.

Refer https://www.gov.uk/english-language/degrees-in-english

It says you will need original certificate and 1 of following:
-PBS printout showing both 'equivalence' and 'English level'
-NARIC equivalence certificate and letter from University saying degree was taught in English
-certificate that degree was taught in majority English speaking country

Point to note is there is no option for NARIC English level certificate. If your qualification is not on PBS, you have to provide NARIC equivalence certificate and letter from university. Since your PBS printout only confirms English level (though I wonder if equivalence is not a prerequisite of this), CW will need document for equivalence.

This perhaps went through in your wife's previous application as only 'English level' was the requirement and not 'Equivalence', while for ILR both are required. It perhaps won't affect Tier 1 General main applicants as 'Equivalence' has been proved in previous applications. All welcome to comment/critique on my thoughts.

I've seen instances where a NARIC English language assessment has been accepted. While I see your point that they have not explicitly mentioned this under the second point above, I doubt that they would refuse this as it proves the same as if you had a letter from your university confirming the degree was taught in English. And also the same as what the English language section of the PBS printout is meant to do.

[nikkyraj]

Thanks.
I will call the Home Office again on Tuesday and also write an email to confirm.
I gave IELTS when I applied for my ILR, wondering if that is still acceptable. I live in Scotland and I'm not sure which ESOL test to take here, I only know of IELTS, but not sure if it is acceptable.
Even if it is still acceptable, the other problem is to sit the test my wife will need a photo ID. She has 9 not got her passport, and that is already with the Home Office so unsure how else can she take a test without a photo ID.

[lindafrancis]

Hi All,
Just to confirm.
I am applying for ILR using set(o). I am a PBS dependent at the moment.
I have ,
(1)statement of comparability from NAARIC and
(2)PBS calculator shows that I have a point 10 for English.

Are the above 2 enough to apply for the ILR as I have my appointment booked on 8th of May(I booked it after 6th of April).
Could you please confirm as I have to reschedule my appointment if I have to get a certificate from my college "Stating the course was in English".
Cheers,
Linda

[lindafrancis]

Can anybody help me please?

[noajthan]

Thanks.
I will call the Home Office again on Tuesday and also write an email to confirm.
I gave IELTS when I applied for my ILR, wondering if that is still acceptable. I live in Scotland and I'm not sure which ESOL test to take here, I only know of IELTS, but not sure if it is acceptable.
Even if it is still acceptable, the other problem is to sit the test my wife will need a photo ID. She has 9 not got her passport, and that is already with the Home Office so unsure how else can she take a test without a photo ID.

The latest requirements are here:
https://www.gov.uk/english-language/overview

in particular, this list applies since 6 April, 2015:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... uage-tests
- it includes various IELTS qualifications

Note the transitional arrangements valid only until November 2015 for tests taken on or before 5 April, 2015

Hope it helps.

[noajthan]

Can anybody help me please?

lindafrancis,
Gov UK website seems clear ...
https://www.gov.uk/english-language/degrees-in-english

You’ll need your original degree certificate and one of the following:

a printout from the points-based calculator with the equivalent level of your degree and the level of English

an original letter or certificate from UK NARIC confirming the equivalent level of your degree, plus an official letter from your university with your name and degree confirming that your degree was taught in English

an original and official certificate from your university confirming the degree was taught or researched in a majority English-speaking country (except Canada)

if the PBS printout you have shows the level of English you would seem to be covered;
if it does not it seems a certificate or letter from the institution is also required.

[lindafrancis]

Hi Noa,
Thank you,
I was confused because I had mix and match of 1st 2 options in their site.
So I am planning to take my original certificate together with the PBS calculator point printout as a proof of my knowledge of language criteria.
Linda

[noajthan]

Hi Noa,
Thank you,
I was confused because I had mix and match of 1st 2 options in their site.
So I am planning to take my original certificate together with the PBS calculator point printout as a proof of my knowledge of language criteria.
Linda

This chimes with the post from May 1 (above) quoting an email from an official (from Nationality and Settlement Operational Policy | Immigration & Border Policy | Home Office) that mentions the 10-point PBS minimum level for English.

Good luck.

[shah_pooja]

this is definitely interesting case.. pl do keep us posted.. - I am in the same boat/however ..did your wife not give the IELTS at the time of tier1- can that not help in this case?

[nikkyraj]

Hi guys

Thanks for all your help with my query. Just an quick update on my situation.

My wife got her ILR biometric card yesterday and today she got all her documents back as well. Thank God.
I did what one of the other member suggested regarding my situation. The Home Office were asking for proof that my wife's Degree from India was taught in English, regardless of the print out of the Points based calculator. I emailed the knowledge of life policy team asking for clarification on the matter and scanned a copy of the letter from home office for their reference.
Got a reply from them saying that according to the old settlement rules prior to July 2012, the points based calculator is valid . They said that the case worker has been notified to accept it.
Three days later, her ILR biometric card arrived, which put a big smile on our faces.

Thank you again to everyone who took time the time and effort to reply back and help us.

Thanks