Will traffic offence affect ILR application

[John]

The conviction is, as you say, "spent", and therefore there is absolutely no need for you to mention it on the application form.

[British]

Hi fairandsquare,

Did you have to declare it earlier on on your FLR applications, when the offense was "not spent" at that at time? or was it not mandatory at that time.

I am asking this because the FLR forms these days seem to have that specific column where you will have to declare it, just like in ILR application.

[John]

British, this is actually quite an interesting point because we are told that whilst points were put on to the licence, no fine was levied. Accordingly, looking at the details of when motoring convictions become spent, I think it became spent instantly! Had a fine been imposed then we would have been talking about a 5 year period before being spent, but no fine imposed here.

What is clear is the points remaining on the licence is not an issue about when a conviction becomes spent. So someone who is banned for a year and fined for drink driving will have that conviction showing on their licence for 11 years, but nevertheless the conviction becomes spent after 5 years.

fairandsquare, as well as the points on licence did the Court mention an absolute discharge or a conditional discharge, or something like that?

[British]

Cheers John, that is an interesting point!

So, in all, if a person was given 3 points and was asked to pay a fine in the court, then he will have to declare that in the FLR applications as well, and not only in ILR and citizenship forms?

So, what happens if somebody did not know this earlier and had never declared it in FLR forms, and came to know about this only later and declared it in ILR/Citizenship forms?

[nonothing]

what will happen to those have been caught by the cameras and fined and deducted points by the police but never been in the court? should they declare it?

[British]

But this is not a very clear area: If the points were imposed and fined, although the fine was not asked ot be paid in court, the offence is still not spend until 4-5 years ( i am not sure which one though).

In that case, it will become neccessary to declare it in the FLR/ILR/BC forms if the offense had not been spent on the date of application.

But as John says, if the fine was not charged, then it may be that the offense is spent immediately, in which case one may not need to declare it.

John may know more on this.

[fairandsquare]

Guys,

Thank you so much for your reply. Very appreciated.

I was not asked to declare on my FLR applications in 2002 when the offence was "not spent".

John, there was merely 6 points on my licence (and they are cleared now), I can't recall the absolute discharge or a conditional discharge by court, but no fine occurred for sure.

So, shall I mention it? Still puzzled. Many many thanks, friends.

[John]

Based upon what you have posted, the conviction is "spent" and thus can be omitted from the ILR application form.

[AlexCh]

Guys,

I hope husband's offences do not affect his wife's application for naturalisation?

I feel myself a complete criminal now - was spot-fined by the police “on the streetâ€

[tvt]

Alexch,

As far as I am aware , urinating in a public place but far from sight cannot be penalised with a social disorder penalty.

http://www.together.gov.uk/article.asp?aid=1178&c=83

Unless you define it as a "Behaviour likely to cause harassment alarm or distress". I really doubt this is the case.

See s. 5 to Public Order Act 1986:

5 Harassment, alarm or distress

(1) A person is guilty of an offence if he—

(a) uses threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour, or

(b) displays any writing, sign or other visible representation which is threatening, abusive or insulting,

within the hearing or sight of a person likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress thereby.

(2) ...

(3) It is a defence for the accused to prove—

(a) that he had no reason to believe that there was any person within hearing or sight who was likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress, or

(b) that he was inside a dwelling and had no reason to believe that the words or behaviour used, or the writing, sign or other visible representation displayed, would be heard or seen by a person outside that or any other dwelling, or

(c) that his conduct was reasonable.

[AlexCh]

Alexch,

As far as I am aware , urinating in a public place but far from sight cannot be penalised with a social disorder penalty.

http://www.together.gov.uk/article.asp?aid=1178&c=83

Unless you define it as a "Behaviour likely to cause harassment alarm or distress". I really doubt this is the case.

See s. 5 to Public Order Act 1986:

This is exactly what they did - they also wrote that there was a passing woman who could be distressed (looks like this is a standard phrase they use to justify S.5 usage) - I am pretty sure that there were not any women, but it would be my word against words of 2 officers and they do not have to ask the woman to be a witness. According to Google it is a new trend in police behaviour - they use Section 5 for many offences, where other Acts actually could be used - looks like it has something to do with improving their statistics . Basically what they said was - "if we could see you, public could see you".

I also could go to court and argue that I was behaving reasonably - but I have never been to court or police before and wanted to close this issue ASAP - especially as they said that it was not an arrest and did not count as a conviction or admittance of guilt - so I have paid the fine already. It is only after that I have realised that it still will be recorded on PNC and that in case of Enhanced Criminal Records Check police may disclose this event and that my wife is applying for citizenship in 2 weeks time.

To be honest I think I was the only person who was really distressed

I really hope my wife's application will not be affected? I did not tell her anything.

[AlexCh]

Sorry for chasing for the answer - but does anybody know if my wife's application may be affected by my penalty notice? I am really nervous...

[AlexCh]

Nobody knows?

[tvt]

No effect.

[ronnng]

hi guys, long time since my last post. My bf got his ILR !!! He did declared the traffic offence on his Set O form. No question asked whatsoever.. here's the experience. Booked the appointment, got a sms through mobile phone 2 days before the appointment date reminding to go for appoitment if not cancel it. Appointment at 11.30 am, Monday. Arrived 1045, q a little outside building, let in around 11.00am, passed documents check on ground floor, paid woooooping £950 at first floor. 11.15 am, waiting for number to be called. Till now, everything seems straight forward and hassels free AND running earlier than my original 11.30am appointment time. NOW, waiting game began. Didn't get called till 1.45pm !!! then interview took about an hour or so. By the time my bf was told 'you have been granted ILR, bla bla blah..' it was 10mins to 3 pm. We didn't leave the building, and was called again to collect the passport about 45mins later. During the interview, no many questions asked, the officer was just keep checking 'things' here and there. although we were not too sure what he was checking all the while, but he did took a great deal of interest on checking the absence in the passport as he keep flipping through all the exit and entry stamped on the passport against the absence period we filled in the form. We have at least two holidday out of the country eeach year, one long (3 weeks), and one short (4 days, weekeed away) for the past 5 years. No problme there either. So, this is it.. not many ppl there in the waiting lounge, but each interview seems to take forever.
Thanks a lot for all your input for me and my bf. any questions feel free to ask, hope i will be able to help.

Thanks again. Ronnng