Earning question for Seconded

[ank2007]

Hi All,

Can any one please help on the below case:

I am on deputation (i.e I am employee of Indian company and getting salary in India and paying Income tax in India) in UK since 2 years.
In UK I am not paying any tax, I am getting only allowance here.

To get Previous Earning point for HSMP, which country code I have to choose.

Many many thanks in advance.

Regards,
ANK

[Paulhsmp]

Answer to your question is INDIA.
See this link for more details.
http://ec-hsmp.blogspot.com/2007/11/ear ... ments.html

Cheers
Paul

[gordon]

Answer to your question is INDIA.

I think one would have to look more closely at the OP's situation to evaluate why an exception would be made for him to be considered in band D (India), rather than band A (UK).

In the main, the guidance notes suggest that seconded personnel would normally have their earnings evaluated in the country to which they have been seconded (para 42), in this case, the UK, not the country from which they were seconded (ie, India). The notes further reiterate that where they have been living and working is a key determining factor, rather than the country where their bank account is located, into which their salary has been paid (para 43).

AG

[gorajim]

Hi,

Since you have been living and working in the UK for the 12 month period of consideration, your country of reference will be UK, Band A.

Points will be awarded based on the GBP equivalent of your India salary (including what you receive in India and what is paid to you in the UK, if the equivalent amount is declared in your India payslips).

Convert your total INR salary (including UK allowances, if declared in your payslip) to GBP using the Exchange Rate of the last payslip and determine points based on the range for Band A countries.

Cheers.

[Paulhsmp]

Hello ank2007,

Are you in UK with a work permit?

In your bank statement, is the UK allowance is credit as salary from your employer? or Are getting it as cash/cheque?

Is the UK allowance mentioned in your payslip? Or will you be able to get payslips from your employer mentioning these amounts?

Just curious.

Cheers
Paul

[pinnacle]

Definately it would be Band A. Personally speaking, my HSMP got rejected because of the same reason. I am in Uk on the same model and didn't have any UK allowance proof's.

[ank2007]

Thanks for all reply,

But still I am confussing on it.....Today I met a layer in uk and he told me that my India salary band will get consider here i.e 45 points for 600000=£7500 uk equal. salary.

Any comments on this?

[ank2007]

Definately it would be Band A. Personally speaking, my HSMP got rejected because of the same reason. I am in Uk on the same model and didn't have any UK allowance proof's.

Hi Pinnacle,

But today I met lawyer and he told me that my country band will be India.

Then it got rejected for you?

[gorajim]

He must not have understood your status correctly.

If you confirm that you have been living and working in the UK for 12 months that you wish the HO to consider earnings, there is no doubt that you will be assessed on your UK (Band A) structure ONLY.

Any other representation will be false and may lead to your disqualification. Please note the caseworker guideline below and discuss this with your lawyer, after showing him this relevant section of the caseworker guideline.

Those seconded overseas from their normal country of work.Applicants who have been seconded overseas during the last fifteen months and whose salary continues to be paid in the normal manner by their employer should be assessed against the country where they have been working during their secondment. In order for us to establish which country code to consider their earnings against, the applicant should provide evidence of where they have been working and where their salary has been paid for the period they wish us to consider, up to a maximum of twelve months.
If an applicant is working in a country but having their income paid into a bank account in another country, their income will be considered against the country code where they are working.

Cheers.

[pantaiema]

This topic have been widely discussed about 3 weeks ago with some quatation from the guidance.

Use your common sense. If what u r saying is true, it would mean that almost everyone coming from developinf countries on secondment in idustrialised countries will qualify for earning criteria for HSMP

Keep in mind U might get very low income according to HSMP standard in Band A countries but if it is assessed against Band D countries it will very high ......

Answer to your question is INDIA.
See this link for more details.
http://ec-hsmp.blogspot.com/2007/11/ear ... ments.html

Cheers
Paul

[pinnacle]

ank2007,
Frankly speaking our case is not covered properly in the guidance..There is ambiguity in the guidance...I will explain how

1. Applicants who have been seconded overseas during the last fifteen months and whose salary continues to be paid in the normal manner overseas by their employer should be assessed against the country where they have been working during their secondment.

My Explanation---

First thing is thay we are seconded overseas but our salary is not normally paid in UK as we are getting perdium here.. So there is no way HO can compare our salary with a person living and working in UK.

2. If an applicant is working in a country but having their income paid into a bank account in another country, their income will be considered against the country code where they are working.

My Explanation--

We are definately living and working in UK but the fact remains tha we are not getting any UK salary or any UK component in out Indian Bank Account.. So how can they assess our Salary agaist Band A..

These guys should modify there guidelines to fit our case...

If we are not getting any UK salary we shouldn't be considered under band A..
Again the Guidance doesn't cover our case at all.. HO assume that if we are in UK we are getting UK salary and hence our Band should be A.

[pantaiema]

There is nothin wrong to express opinion. If U fully believe ur opinion, why do not give a try ?

ank2007,
Frankly speaking our case is not covered properly in the guidance..There is ambiguity in the guidance...I will explain how

1. Applicants who have been seconded overseas during the last fifteen months and whose salary continues to be paid in the normal manner overseas by their employer should be assessed against the country where they have been working during their secondment.

My Explanation---

First thing is thay we are seconded overseas but our salary is not normally paid in UK as we are getting perdium here.. So there is no way HO can compare our salary with a person living and working in UK.

2. If an applicant is working in a country but having their income paid into a bank account in another country, their income will be considered against the country code where they are working.

My Explanation--

We are definately living and working in UK but the fact remains tha we are not getting any UK salary or any UK component in out Indian Bank Account.. So how can they assess our Salary agaist Band A..

These guys should modify there guidelines to fit our case...

If we are not getting any UK salary we shouldn't be considered under band A..
Again the Guidance doesn't cover our case at all.. HO assume that if we are in UK we are getting UK salary and hence our Band should be A.

[gordon]

One might offer the counter-argument that the guidance notes actually cover situations like yours: allowances, if declared on payslips, may be counted as earnings, alongside salary. And rightly so, since those allowances are paid to enable your living and working on secondment in the UK, and you presumably would not have received those allowances on the same terms had you remained in the country of origin. But on that basis, the salary plus allowances of seconded personnel could be compared quite legitimately to the regular salary of everyone else living and working in the UK.
AG

[gorajim]

I believe it is covered. Remember that you cannot look at the secondment only in terms of an Indian in the UK. Like the example for secondment states, you could be a Nigerian national in China or an American in India. The rule has been created to hopefully address all such scenarios.

Take the scenario of a person seconded from India to Singapore. Now assume she decides to apply for HSMP and so does a Singapore national. Since our applicant is in Singapore, it is fair to assume she will benefit from an additional 'per-diem' while in Singapore.

Now, it will be unfair to judge her based on her total salary including Singapore perdiem, but as Band D since the marginally higher salary will definitely see her through, as compared with a Singapore national applying for HSMP.

The other aspect of secondment is that it determines the ability of an applicant to command the salary that is offered in the country of work.

Think about it. Cheers.

[ank2007]

Yesterday, I met another consultant and he told me that my salary band will be D India if I apply for the HSMP from UK a a Seconded.......Any comments...Any one is having such case

[gorajim]

Too many cooks spoil the broth... you should seek advice from one source and stick with it.

All the best, mate!

[pantaiema]

FYI
I have read a few people got rejected using the same assumption with you. But because your consultant tell U otherwise than U should try U will only loose application fee + consultant at the most.

Why do not just give a try and tell us th result so we couild learn from your expereince

Yesterday, I met another consultant and he told me that my salary band will be D India if I apply for the HSMP from UK a a Seconded.......Any comments...Any one is having such case

[PaperPusher]

Hello pinnacle

First thing is thay we are seconded overseas but our salary is not normally paid in UK as we are getting perdium here.. So there is no way HO can compare our salary with a person living and working in UK

If you are here on a work permit you should be getting the going rate for the job (it could be the total consisting of India salary & UK allowances), which should be on the work permit. Why can't the Home Office compare your salary with a person living and working in the UK? You are living and working in the UK after all!

Regards

[sriyab]

Hi All, I have a similar prob,
First 6 months in India & from Last 6 months in UK.
Get only basic(Not the whole salary) in India and Alowance in UK.
Get payslips for both in bank accounts in UK & India.
I am not able to qualify for points as both amounts individually are not sufficient.

Problem Big problem


Any Advice or experience to share

[quote="PaperPusher"]Hello pinnacle

[gorajim]

Hello Sriyab,

Your case is slightly simpler. When you spend equal amount of time in more than one country during the 12 period (e.g., 6 months each spent working in India and the UK, or 4 months each spent working in India, UK and say Netherlands), the rule is to prorate each pay separately to 12 months and then apply the earnings that is most favourable to your case.

So if you spent 6 months in India and 6 in the UK, prorate both earnings to 12 months separately. Now judge the India income against Band D and the UK income against Band A. The case that is most favourable to you will be applicable.

You should surely provide HO evidence of the full 12 months, despite that is has been earned in different countries.