Applying for british citizenship

[vp23]

My family and myself all have ILR and I plan to apply for BC on completion of 5 yr + 1yr ILR in April 16 for myself and my younger daughter who is 15 yrs ( to be registered as BC). She has been in UK since Apr 2012. My elder daughter (19) would apply once they meet their residency requirements of being in UK on date of application - 5 yrs and not being in UK for more than 450 days. For my wife I was looking to apply once I attain BC under the 3 year rule.

Can you advise if my thought process is correct and what do I need to be careful of ?

[CR001]

If your wife has the same residence/ILR as you, she can apply with you as she qualifies. It makes no difference which route you choose. One is not quicker than the other.

15 year old you can register on MN1 with you/wife.

19 year old will need 5 years residence.

[noajthan]

My family and myself all have ILR and I plan to apply for BC on completion of 5 yr + 1yr ILR in April 16 for myself and my younger daughter who is 15 yrs (to be registered as BC). She has been in UK since Apr 2012. My elder daughter (19) would apply once they meet their residency requirements of being in UK on date of application - 5 yrs and not being in UK for more than 450 days. For my wife I was looking to apply once I attain BC under the 3 year rule.

Can you advise if my thought process is correct and what do I need to be careful of ?

Sounds like you are on top of things.

Parents & adult daughter (19) can apply as soon as ILR has been held for 12 months.

As you appear to have noted, parents can apply in own right or 1 partner can apply as the spouse of the other.

If applying as spouse of the already-naturalised other spouse then no need for 2nd spouse to have held ILR for 12 months.
Use Form AN for adults.

If daughter (15) was born abroad registration is at discretion of Home Secretary under Section 3(1) of BNA; approx 3 years residence in UK for her is fine.

You can register minor daughter with one parent's naturalisation or after the parents' naturalisations (if risk averse).
Use Form MN1 for minor.

You are absolutely right to ensure every adult was physically present in UK 5 years from date of their application (or 3 years to the day for a spousal application).

Adults need to pass LITUK; minor daughter does not.

Adults need proof of English proficiency (check you have correct proof noting changes of November 2015);
minor needs no proof of English.

Make sure all persons' names in passports match names you wish to be naturalised in.

If all other requirements can be/have been met (including: sound mind, appropriate referees, good character, etc) then you are in good shape.

Suggest apply via NCS for a level of sanity-checking of the applications plus retention of your documents (useful in case a need to travel comes up).

Good luck.

[vp23]

Thank you for your quick and detailed response... some more information and questions.

1. Though all have ILR but my wife and children did not join me till Apr 2012 but came over during holidays
2. My wife has exactly 450 days of absence to date and both daughters 415 days to date due to the fact they did not move with me till April 2012.
3. As a result of the above my elder daughter(19) can only apply in June 2016 when she was in UK then on holiday to meet the 5 year rule
4. As my wife is already on 450 days absence, I am thinking of being risk averse and applying later.
5. My minor daughter will have lived in UK for 4 years and is an American national. You said that I can register my minor daughter with one parent' naturalisation or after the parent' naturalisations ( if risk averse)... Q . What is the risk ?
6. As part of the ILR application we cleared the LITUK and English Language. What are the changes I need to be aware of ?
a) myself - UK Masters degree and passed LITUK
b) wife - Degree accepted by PBS calculator and passed LITUK
c) elder daughter - Passed LITUK and iELTS (Academic)
d) younger daughter - minor
7. I got one PCN for wrong parking in June 2011. Do I need to declare this as a conviction or in notes ?

[noajthan]

Thank you for your quick and detailed response... some more information and questions.

1. Though all have ILR but my wife and children did not join me till Apr 2012 but came over during holidays
2. My wife has exactly 450 days of absence to date and both daughters 415 days to date due to the fact they did not move with me till April 2012.
3. As a result of the above my elder daughter(19) can only apply in June 2016 when she was in UK then on holiday to meet the 5 year rule
4. As my wife is already on 450 days absence, I am thinking of being risk averse and applying later.
5. My minor daughter will have lived in UK for 4 years and is an American national. You said that I can register my minor daughter with one parent' naturalisation or after the parent' naturalisations ( if risk averse)... Q . What is the risk ?
6. As part of the ILR application we cleared the LITUK and English Language. What are the changes I need to be aware of ?
a) myself - UK Masters degree and passed LITUK
b) wife - Degree accepted by PBS calculator and passed LITUK
c) elder daughter - Passed LITUK and iELTS (Academic)
d) younger daughter - minor
7. I got one PCN for wrong parking in June 2011. Do I need to declare this as a conviction or in notes ?

2) Minor daughter's absence tally doesn't matter so much.
The absences criteria (450/90 days etc) is only for adults.

5) Registration of minor born abroad (assuming daughter was) is at Home Secretary's discretion.
(Small chance of rejection & loss of fee).
If you apply with a parent and they are refused you risk losing both fees. That is all.

4 years in UK is a good indicator daughter's future lies in UK as HO tend to use past behaviour as an indicator;
(they also look for more years time-served in UK for older teens).

6 c) Suggest investigate whether daughter's IELTS is still accepted.
There's a good FAQ on English requirements elsewhere in forum.

Degree holders will be unaffected by last November's changes; (move from ESOL qualifications to SELT only).

7) Suggest declare in 'further/additional info' section of form unless you can make it fit the boxes on the current form.

[vp23]

I am really confused now.... just read the new AN booklet and this is what is says...

If you met the requirement to have sufficient knowledge of language and life in the UK when you applied for settlement by having a B1 level test you do not have to demonstrate it again. (People who applied for settlement on or after 28 October 2013 needed to have had a B1 level qualification.)

My confusion is if my daughter will need to give her IELTS again ... she already sat IELTS Academic and was scored an aggregate of 8.0 with every level higher than 7.0.

Can you help throwing some light on this... just want to avoid the hassle of my daughter giving the test again.

[noajthan]

I am really confused now.... just read the new AN booklet and this is what is says...

If you met the requirement to have sufficient knowledge of language and life in the UK when you applied for settlement by having a B1 level test you do not have to demonstrate it again. (People who applied for settlement on or after 28 October 2013 needed to have had a B1 level qualification.)

My confusion is if my daughter will need to give her IELTS again ... she already sat IELTS Academic and was scored an aggregate of 8.0 with every level higher than 7.0.

Can you help throwing some light on this... just want to avoid the hassle of my daughter giving the test again.

See the comprehensive forum FAQS (mentioned previously):
british-citizenship/faqs-english-langua ... 98118.html

[vp23]

Thank you for your response.... I did read the FAQ and it says

You don’t need to prove your knowledge of English if you:
1. met this requirement, on or after 28th October 2013, in order to obtain settlement (ILR or PR), or

I have just read another post just now where the individual conferred with HO who said it previous certificate would not be valid... but a response from WR1 says the following....

On a further note, if someone is relying on using a English test taken before 6 April 2015 and not on the current SELT list but was previously accepted for ILR applied AFTER 28 October 2013, then all they need to do is tick the relevent box on the AN form. DO NOT attach the English certificate with it. This will only create confusion. You are relying of the fact the English Crieria was already met for ILR after 28 October 2013 and not trying to prove English requirement again. Only LUIK needs to be submitted again.

Can some one guide me what the correct fact is..... will the IELTS Acadmic be valid or will we need to give another test at the recognised center.

[noajthan]

Thank you for your response.... I did read the FAQ and it says

You don’t need to prove your knowledge of English if you:
1. met this requirement, on or after 28th October 2013, in order to obtain settlement (ILR or PR), or

I have just read another post just now where the individual conferred with HO who said it previous certificate would not be valid... but a response from WR1 says the following....

On a further note, if someone is relying on using a English test taken before 6 April 2015 and not on the current SELT list but was previously accepted for ILR applied AFTER 28 October 2013, then all they need to do is tick the relevent box on the AN form. DO NOT attach the English certificate with it. This will only create confusion. You are relying of the fact the English Crieria was already met for ILR after 28 October 2013 and not trying to prove English requirement again. Only LUIK needs to be submitted again.

Can some one guide me what the correct fact is..... will the IELTS Acadmic be valid or will we need to give another test at the recognised center.

The HO helpline is notoriously untutored & unreliable in these matters.

The question (which is a kind of English test in itself) is:
did applicant (daughter) actually use the same qualification when previously applying for ILR & was it at some time after October 2013?

[vp23]

She took the IELTS Academic at University of Surrey - School of English and Languages at Guildford in July 2014 and the same was used for her ILR in March 2015.

[vp23]

Filling up the form MN1 for my 15 year daughter and have some questions on Section 2

I came to UK in June 2010 and my family formally joined me in Apr 2012. Date of first entry into UK for my daughter/ family on Tier 1 was October 2010 for holiday and they went back to India to complete their studies. My family visited me during holiday till they finally moved in Apr 2012.

Question
1. In section 2 of MN1, do I need to fill up only UK or India address as well since the date of entry
2. For absences I need to put in all absences i.e. 5 or 3 years prior to date of application or date of entry

[noajthan]

...

Question
1. In section 2 of MN1, do I need to fill up only UK or India address as well since the date of entry
2. For absences I need to put in all absences i.e. 5 or 3 years prior to date of application or date of entry

1) A holiday is not a period of residence.

Start from period of residence commencing 2012.
UK addresses only.

2) Append absence history since date of entry (2012).

[vp23]

thanks, just for clarity.

You are saying that first entry on her T1 dependent visa is not considered as first date of entry.

They were in UK for a month in 2010 and a month in 2011 then moved permanently in Apr 2012.

[noajthan]

thanks, just for clarity.

You are saying that first entry on her T1 dependent visa is not considered as first date of entry.

They were in UK for a month in 2010 and a month in 2011 then moved permanently in Apr 2012.

You described it as a holiday.
I do not think a holiday (for the odd month here & there) qualifies as residence in UK.

In any case, even for an older teenager 3+ years residence in UK should be adequate.

[vp23]

Thanks, is it true to say the absence rules for adults I.e 450/90 are different for minors

[noajthan]

Thanks, is it true to say the absence rules for adults I.e 450/90 are different for minors

Yes - they do not apply.

As per my reply to your Q2 on Jan 12 (as above)

[vp23]

Thanks, is it true to say the absence rules for adults I.e 450/90 are different for minors

[CR001]

Thanks, is it true to say the absence rules for adults I.e 450/90 are different for minors

Yes - they do not apply.

As per my reply to your Q2 on Jan 12 (as above)

Not sure why you have asked the question again when noajthan has already answered your question.

[vp23]

Sorry, not sure why but it got posted twice. Thanks for your response.

[vp23]

A leading question for my elder daughter.... when I apply for her, her first entry date will need to be when she came in oct 2010 and any period she is not in UK will count towards absence which should not be greater than 450 days over immediate 5 year period and 90 days in the last year from date of application.

Is my understanding correct ?

[CR001]

Yes on the entry date. HO are not as concerned about absence for children but they should not be excessive, i.e. living in another country mostly.

[noajthan]

A leading question for my elder daughter.... and any period she is not in UK will count towards absence which should not be greater than 450 days over immediate 5 year period and 90 days in the last year from date of application.

Is my understanding correct ?

Not quite. See:
british-citizenship/applying-for-britis ... l#p1299125

[vp23]

Just got my NCS appointment for joint application.... I have got referees for myself but for my daughter (15 yrs) I am wondering who to get for referees...

For myself I have a solicitor in my company who would sign and a colleague who Is a contractor and a Director of his limited company.

for my daughter do I need to get the school to refer, but am sure they will refuse saying it is not their policy. Can I get the Director of the limited company to sign as he knows my daughter for now at least 3 years.

[noajthan]

Just got my NCS appointment for joint application.... I have got referees for myself but for my daughter (15 yrs) I am wondering who to get for referees...

For myself I have a solicitor in my company who would sign and a colleague who Is a contractor and a Director of his limited company.

for my daughter do I need to get the school to refer, but am sure they will refuse saying it is not their policy. Can I get the Director of the limited company to sign as he knows my daughter for now at least 3 years.

Any appropriate professional will do if they have known the applicant for 3+ years: teacher/tutor, head of year, headteacher or yes, company director;
2nd referee (over 25) can simply be a family friend or schoolfriend's parent or similar.

Usual provisos apply: no relatives, no (legal/immigration) representatives, no HO employees, no unspent convictions & etc.

[vp23]

Another question... on filing return for my daughter and wife.
My daughter worked for 3 months during her gap year. She did not file a tax return as her income was below the threshold and not all need to file a tax return or do a self assessment. Same is for my wife as well income is below £10600 hence should not have to file a return.

do we need to mention this on the naturalisation form for both ?