Has anyone from UK applied without P60?

[mepals]

Hi

I am on an assignment in UK and do not have P60 form as my company pays the net salary. Has anyone from UK applied for HSMP without P60, showing UK salary? If so, could you please share your experience whether it got approved or not. And what's the reason you gave for exceptional consideration.

Thanks,

[SYH]

that makes no sense
so what they pay net? p60 is sitll issued

[mepals]

They pay fixed amount per month. I do not have NI number. Its one of the top consulting firms from India. We are partly paid in India and i have tax return for that. But I need to include the UK salary to gain the points. So not sure if HO will approve it without P60.

[SYH]

That's completely different, they have to provide you some documentation of them providing you payment in pounds, if they consider it a stipend then you have a problem for income purposes. It is irrelevant that they are providing you money in sterling, it is stil income in india and gets recorded on your tax return, if not then you can't get credit for it.

[rg1]

Typical Indian IT firm problem. If you're in company like TCS who pays allowance here rather than salary, then you can't claim point on that. You need to claim point on your Indian salary.

[mepals]

Hi RG1,

Can't I claim even if I have salary slips, UK bank statements and a letter from employer? I mean this is part of my earnings for which I have all the proofs except for P60.

Thanks,

[pantaiema]

I am quite confusing whether in your case you are really working in the UK ?. It is legeally required that every employee who work in the UK get P60. 'mepals' I think this is not your fault but your employers

Hi RG1,

Can't I claim even if I have salary slips, UK bank statements and a letter from employer? I mean this is part of my earnings for which I have all the proofs except for P60.

Thanks,

[rg1]

If someone claims point for earning in UK, it must show tax & NI contribution in the payslip. Where as in allowance scheme, it is not the case!

I was once an employee of such Indian IT firm. When I got the P60 from them, I was shocked to discover that they have showed my Indian salary, converted to Pound, in the P60. Thus, it becomes miniscule and doesn't attact tax at all!

That's the reason you don't get P60 from your employer!

[pantaiema]

I have read this case many times in this forum. And I will understand that this is not the employee's fault but the employer's fault.

How could you define someone who do not pay tax and NI contribution in the Uk as working in the UK ?

If someone claims point for earning in UK, it must show tax & NI contribution in the payslip. Where as in allowance scheme, it is not the case!

I was once an employee of such Indian IT firm. When I got the P60 from them, I was shocked to discover that they have showed my Indian salary, converted to Pound, in the P60. Thus, it becomes miniscule and doesn't attact tax at all!

That's the reason you don't get P60 from your employer!

[ravins]

Hi,

I have NI number here in UK , Can I apply for hsmp without p-60 .

[vinay shanthi]

I have read this case many times in this forum. And I will understand that this is not the employee's fault but the employer's fault.

How could you define someone who do not pay tax and NI contribution in the Uk as working in the UK ?

If someone claims point for earning in UK, it must show tax & NI contribution in the payslip. Where as in allowance scheme, it is not the case!

I was once an employee of such Indian IT firm. When I got the P60 from them, I was shocked to discover that they have showed my Indian salary, converted to Pound, in the P60. Thus, it becomes miniscule and doesn't attact tax at all!

That's the reason you don't get P60 from your employer!

my understanding how these people work here in uk is by intracompany transfers or being sent here to do the work contracted out of uk by uk company. this comes under WTO GATS4 multilateral international trade agreements and also dispute resolution system. and they get visas without 'local employee prefernce' criteria used for work permits. the rules in 2002 were that one inspite of working in the uk did not have to pay any uk tax under some rules. i know this as i knew a chartered accountant from an indian firm who came on secondment here as chartered accountant on consultancy basis. he worked here 2y didnt have to pay taxes as he knew the rules. there are also double taxation agreements between uk and other countries so even if people have earned in uk, under certain circumstances the legally can avoid paying any tax in uk. also knew another person in software consultancy who similarly didnt have to pay any uk tax. dont know the details how this works as both have left uk permanently. so they cannot insist on uk tax documents if the person is doing a job presently under the WTO GATS4 rules and can avaoid tax legally in some circumstances. others who work in finance might be able to shed more light on this.

all monetary benefits at work i feel should be counted if you can show proof that it is given by company. get a letter from company stating the perks that you get plus allowances etc and include that as well with your application.

btw i didnt submit my p60 as far as i remember for hsmp initial or renewal. sent all payslips 12m, bank statements, letter from employer stating job, duration payscale gross and net and address etc. know others who got hsmp similarly as well. neither me or any of my friends included NARIC certificate as well and we all processed our own applications and didnt get any guidance from any legal person or forum. we all got HSMP without any problem.

[destiniation_london]

If someone claims point for earning in UK, it must show tax & NI contribution in the payslip. Where as in allowance scheme, it is not the case!

I was once an employee of such Indian IT firm. When I got the P60 from them, I was shocked to discover that they have showed my Indian salary, converted to Pound, in the P60. Thus, it becomes miniscule and doesn't attact tax at all!

That's the reason you don't get P60 from your employer!

In my case , the allowance component is split into Allowance 1 and Allowance 2 .. and the company pays tax on Allowance 2.. hence the income shown on the P60 is the total of Allowance 2... which is less to get my HSMP approved...

However, the Net salary (Allowance 1 + Allowance2) on Payslips is enough to give me HSMP approval...

Would that be a concern for the case worker...

[pantaiema]

Here is the direct quaotation from guidelines

"It is important to note that not all income will
be considered. Unearned income such as
dividends from investments (unless it is in a
company in which you are active in day-to-day
management), property rental income, and
interest on savings or funds received through an
inheritance are not used when calculating your
income.
We will not be able to consider any
allowances paid to you that are not declared on
your pay slips. If the company you work for pay
part of your income in dividends then you should
provide evidence that this has been declared as
earnings (see Glossary). This should be in the
form of either personal tax returns or the
corporate tax voucher from the company."

If someone claims point for earning in UK, it must show tax & NI contribution in the payslip. Where as in allowance scheme, it is not the case!

I was once an employee of such Indian IT firm. When I got the P60 from them, I was shocked to discover that they have showed my Indian salary, converted to Pound, in the P60. Thus, it becomes miniscule and doesn't attact tax at all!

That's the reason you don't get P60 from your employer!

In my case , the allowance component is split into Allowance 1 and Allowance 2 .. and the company pays tax on Allowance 2.. hence the income shown on the P60 is the total of Allowance 2... which is less to get my HSMP approved...

However, the Net salary (Allowance 1 + Allowance2) on Payslips is enough to give me HSMP approval...

Would that be a concern for the case worker...

[destiniation_london]

But my both the allowances are declared on the payslips.. does that mean it is not the problem

Here is the direct quaotation from guidelines

"It is important to note that not all income will
be considered. Unearned income such as
dividends from investments (unless it is in a
company in which you are active in day-to-day
management), property rental income, and
interest on savings or funds received through an
inheritance are not used when calculating your
income.
We will not be able to consider any
allowances paid to you that are not declared on
your pay slips. If the company you work for pay
part of your income in dividends then you should
provide evidence that this has been declared as
earnings (see Glossary). This should be in the
form of either personal tax returns or the
corporate tax voucher from the company."

If someone claims point for earning in UK, it must show tax & NI contribution in the payslip. Where as in allowance scheme, it is not the case!

I was once an employee of such Indian IT firm. When I got the P60 from them, I was shocked to discover that they have showed my Indian salary, converted to Pound, in the P60. Thus, it becomes miniscule and doesn't attact tax at all!

That's the reason you don't get P60 from your employer!

In my case , the allowance component is split into Allowance 1 and Allowance 2 .. and the company pays tax on Allowance 2.. hence the income shown on the P60 is the total of Allowance 2... which is less to get my HSMP approved...

However, the Net salary (Allowance 1 + Allowance2) on Payslips is enough to give me HSMP approval...

Would that be a concern for the case worker...

[SYH]

Again declared doesn't mean it is considered. That is what the guidance is trying to explain to you and pantaiema

[destiniation_london]

Again declared doesn't mean it is considered. That is what the guidance is trying to explain to you and pantaiema

This is a bit confusing ...

the HSMP guidelines clearly says that
they will not consider any income not declared on the Payslips...

But I have my both the allowances income shown on the payslips given by employer .... So just didn't got the point that where in guidance is it mentioned that 'Declared on payslips need not be necessarily considered'

[SYH]

Again declared doesn't mean it is considered. That is what the guidance is trying to explain to you and pantaiema

This is a bit confusing ...

the HSMP guidelines clearly says that
they will not consider any income not declared on the Payslips...

But I have my both the allowances income shown on the payslips given by employer .... So just didn't got the point that where in guidance is it mentioned that 'Declared on payslips need not be necessarily considered'

Because what is declared may not be what they consider income.
and they wont considered anythign unless on payslips because they need proof it was paid.
putting something in writing doesn't make it legitimate, it just says you got money, what the money is is what the HO decides, that's not too complicated

[destiniation_london]

then what is the proof that it was paid ... should it be Bank statements...

[SYH]

then what is the proof that it was paid ... should it be Bank statements...

Yes it can be with the contract explaining how he is to be paid, ie salary, expenses, stipend

[pavanne]

Hi Vinay Shanthi,
I am also in the similar king situation that I am in UK from Dec -2006 on Workpermit from Indian IT firm, and they don't give P60.
As per your reply saying that you have applied without P60. Now I am hoping to apply without P60..
Can you please let us know how did you cinvince the Home office regarding unavailability of P60..I mean what you clearly written in the cover letter to come as an exceptional case.

Please reply back..

Thanks
Pavan

[rajsharma_143]

Hi Vinay Shanthi,
I am also in the similar king situation that I am in UK from Dec -2006 on Workpermit from Indian IT firm, and they don't give P60.
As per your reply saying that you have applied without P60. Now I am hoping to apply without P60..
Can you please let us know how did you cinvince the Home office regarding unavailability of P60..I mean what you clearly written in the cover letter to come as an exceptional case.

Please reply back..

Thanks
Pavan

Hi Pavan,
Infact i am also in the Same boat.

Can you guys suggest the best possible way for this.

Thanks,
Raj............

[cheers2boss]

Hi can anyone please update on the outcome of this? Curious to know what eventually has happend in this case?