Studying in UK (on HSMP)

[Brian Anderson]

Hi,

If I were to migrate to UK on the HSMP, can I follow a master's program at a University? I have friends who are studying part-time, but I wish to know if I could do it full time?

-Brian-

[kck9]

You can do what ever you want on HSMP, but if you want to extend the HSMP visa, you have to satisfy the home office that you are contributing enough to the government with your earnings and also you have qualify by the reaching the threshold points.
So you can do full time course if you think you can qualify for the extension by reaching the 75 points etc.

hope this helps

[Brian Anderson]

So you can do full time course if you think you can qualify for the extension by reaching the 75 points etc.

Thanks for the quick response. What does it take to reach these 75 points? Any link on the gov.uk web site that provides this info?

[gordon]

What does it take to reach these 75 points? Any link on the gov.uk web site that provides this info?

At this point, the 75 points for FLR are garnered in much the same way as initial approval, e.g. on the bases of education, earnings, age, UK experience, etc. See the link for what you can broadly expect for tier 1, esp. the recent SoI: http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/siteco ... s/pbsdocs/

So in principle you could undertake a full-time course, but if you want to renew (FLR) your leave under tier 1, you'd just have to make sure that you have enough earnings in the year or so prior to your renewal application, to garner sufficient points to stay on.

AG

[Brian Anderson]

Can I bring your attention to this points calculator:

http://www.workpermit.com/uk/hsmp_exten ... ulator.htm

In the secion that says Earning Power, you're required to give the "Income over last 12 months in UK Currency (if you are a student for the 12 months before you became a student)"

Doesn't this imply that you really don't need to show an income/earning while you were a student, and that its sufficient to show the 12 months prior to becoming a student?

[olisun]

Can I bring your attention to this points calculator:

http://www.workpermit.com/uk/hsmp_exten ... ulator.htm

In the secion that says Earning Power, you're required to give the "Income over last 12 months in UK Currency (if you are a student for the 12 months before you became a student)"

Doesn't this imply that you really don't need to show an income/earning while you were a student, and that its sufficient to show the 12 months prior to becoming a student?

I believe that rule applies if you have not got your HSMP approval already, otherwise everybody will get their HSMP and study for a year and show the income which was already used for the HSMP approval.

Makes sense?

[Brian Anderson]

I believe that rule applies if you have not got your HSMP approval already

Hmm.. I don't think so. The points calculator clearly states that if "You were granted HSMP for 12 months or less" you're required to show your "Income over last 8 months in UK Currency (if you are a student for the 8 months before you became a student)."

[gordon]

With regard to extension applications (FLR after the initial grant of HSMP leave), there appears to be no such provision for being a full-time student. For initial applications, yes, but not for extension applications. See the current FLR (HSMP) application and guidance notes:

http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/6353/1 ... pril07.doc
http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/6353/1 ... idance.pdf (esp. paras 29-42)

[olisun]

I believe that rule applies if you have not got your HSMP approval already

Hmm.. I don't think so. The points calculator clearly states that if "You were granted HSMP for 12 months or less" you're required to show your "Income over last 8 months in UK Currency (if you are a student for the 8 months before you became a student)."

You are referering to the details on the worpermit.com website and not the bia website.

[Brian Anderson]

Gordon, thanks for those links. I read through both documents and like you said there was no mention of special provisions for full-time study. However, I came accross the following link which did mention:

http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/develo ... ssessment/


See section "Previous earnings". This is what is says:

"If you have been unable to earn income for the last 12-15 months due to undertaking full-time study we will consider your income for a 12 month period in the 15 month immediately prior to you becoming a full-time student."

Olisun, I was under the impression that worpermit.com was reliable. Do you suggest that I rather stick to the bia website for all details?

[gordon]

So I see that they do mention a concession for students, but I am not sure that mention actually refers properly to people applying for a subsequent round of leave on HSMP. That webpage conflates two separate groups using the same FLR (HSMP) form: those who are requesting an initial grant of leave to stay on in the UK, this time under HSMP (switching from a student visa, WHM visa, or WP, for instance); and those who are already on HSMP and wish to continue.

My sense is that that page is biased toward the first group, those varying their leave, because:
- the page specifically refers to the MBA provision (which can be used in initial applications, but does not apply to applications to extend existing HSMP leave)
- the indicated brackets for age points are those for initial approval, not for extending existing HSMP leave (cf section 7, Q54 in the FLR application)

In the HSMP (FLR) caseworker guidance notes, I can't find any mention of an exception for students, although it is in the HSMP caseworker guidance (for initial applications). My sense is that there is no exception for full-time study for those extending their extant HSMP leave because full-time students fall into an entirely separate immigration category. (In other words, if you're here as a full-time student, why are you in an employment-related immigration category like HSMP?)

That said, I don't see that there's very much of a problem. Initial leave under HSMP is currently two years (the SoI suggests that this will become three years under the new tier system). Even under current terms, someone could get entry clearance under HSMP and spend the first year as a full-time student and the second year working - and then potentially still have sufficient earnings to get the second round of FLR. Such a scenario would be even easier if initial leave were extended to three years.

AG

[Brian Anderson]

That said, I don't see that there's very much of a problem. Initial leave under HSMP is currently two years (the SoI suggests that this will become three years under the new tier system). Even under current terms, someone could get entry clearance under HSMP and spend the first year as a full-time student and the second year working - and then potentially still have sufficient earnings to get the second round of FLR. Such a scenario would be even easier if initial leave were extended to three years.

Gordon, thanks again for your really helpful answer. My situation is that I'm hoping to leave to UK on HSMP as soon as possible. I also got an offer from a top (Grade 5) University in UK to follow a Masters program in a specialized field. I really value this offer a lot and don't want to miss this opportunity. The course starts on October 2008.

Based on what you said, if I leave to UK in say Feb, work until the course starts, follow the course (which is 1 year long and ends in Sept. 2009), and work until Feb the following year, I could meet the points requirements (given that I would also get extra 5 points for my Masters degree) and provided that I have a good income and could also show a 12 month period of income (excluding the time I was studying). The thing is I'm not leaving to UK solely for education, but would like to take it as incidental during my stay there. Do you think this can work?

[gordon]

The course starts on October 2008. [...]
I could meet the points requirements (given that I would also get extra 5 points for my Masters degree) and provided that I have a good income and could also show a 12 month period of income (excluding the time I was studying).

But I think that's the problem: it's not clear to me that the FLR application allows an exclusion for full-time study (except for the initial application) when calculating earnings points.

Under the scenario you propose, let's say you have entry clearance with effect from Feb 2008 for two years until Feb 2010. You apply for FLR in Jan 2010, with an earnings window of Nov 08 - Jan 2010. If you think that part-time earnings during the degree and full-time earnings for four months after it (plus 5 UK experience plus the 5 master's degree points) would get you above the points threshold, then go for it and come sooner.

Noises have been made (by Liam Byrne, according to Hansard) that tier 1 will be implemented in March, and according to the recent SoI, the tier will issue three-year initial visas. As your course starts in October, it seems to me that you might consider holding off a few months -- given what you want to do, I would think it more reasonable to wait until they start issuing three-year initial visas. If you were to come here with a three-year initial visa under tier 1, your earnings period would not overlap with your study period when you apply for a subsequent round of FLR. That sould strike me as less risky a strategy.

AG

[Brian Anderson]

Noises have been made (by Liam Byrne, according to Hansard) that tier 1 will be implemented in March, and according to the recent SoI, the tier will issue three-year initial visas. As your course starts in October, it seems to me that you might consider holding off a few months -- given what you want to do, I would think it more reasonable to wait until they start issuing three-year initial visas. If you were to come here with a three-year initial visa under tier 1, your earnings period would not overlap with your study period when you apply for a subsequent round of FLR. That sould strike me as less risky a strategy.

Thanks again Gordon, your responses were really helpful.

[HSMPgirl]

Brian,

I'm also on HSMP and am currently studying. I'm on a 2 year HSMP and my course finishes in the summer so I plan to work as soon as I finish the course (so it will be within the 12 month qualifying period for earnings).

If you're going to study in October 2008 then you can either get a part time job while studying full time (a bit difficult, but doable) so at least you get some income, then when you finish you can work full time so you'll be okay for HSMP renewal.

[daylebo5]

hey brian.. did you find out any more information about the studying situation ?? I too have a similar query...

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?p=141490

[pantaiema]

This is only apply to initital HSMP applizcation not for extension.
In the extension you will be assessed based on your very latest economic activities.

Similarly you were out of job at that time (no income to show), you were out.

So if you still have strong determination to study, the best strategy is like those suggested by HSMPgirl. But this is quite difficult, if you are just be given 2 years initial LTR but still possible
Make sure you allow 12 months prior to apply for extension enough salary to gain point.

Also just be aware, the new rule might come in the middle of your study which prohibit this activies. It quite possible that The new rule is applied restrospectively.

quote="Brian Anderson"]
"If you have been unable to earn income for the last 12-15 months due to undertaking full-time study we will consider your income for a 12 month period in the 15 month immediately prior to you becoming a full-time student."

quote]