Current Tier 4 supporting EEA wife, applying for RC

[yuiop]

I am currently a student under Tier 4 visa living with my wife, an EEA citizen, also student. I am the one with the highest income of the two (working legally up to 20 hours a week), therefore I am her sponsor. My studies will finish and I want to apply for a residence card so I can continue living working in the UK while my wife studies. The application process asks for evidences that the EEA citizen can sponsor the non-EEA one, but in our case it is the other way around - I am the one who sponsors my EEA wife and need the permit to continue doing so. How should I proceed?

Thank you in advance for your help!

[noajthan]

I am currently a student under Tier 4 visa living with my wife, an EEA citizen, also student. I am the one with the highest income of the two (working legally up to 20 hours a week), therefore I am her sponsor. My studies will finish and I want to apply for a residence card so I can continue living working in the UK while my wife studies. The application process asks for evidences that the EEA citizen can sponsor the non-EEA one, but in our case it is the other way around - I am the one who sponsors my EEA wife and need the permit to continue doing so. How should I proceed?

Thank you in advance for your help!

I assume you are a non-EEA national.
You have some misunderstandings around the exercise of EU treaty rights.

You cannot actually sponsor anyone under the EU migration route; your activity in UK is actually immaterial (in immigration terms).

The EEA national (in this case your spouse) is your sponsor; you (as non-EEA) will be the dependent, direct family member.

Note: You will both need CSI as your sponsor is in the student category of qualified person.

Assuming you remain married to each other and your wife continues to exercise treaty rights as a qualified person (in one category or other), and both parties keep any absences from UK within prescribed limits, and there is no Brexit, then all you need to do is reside in UK.

Your right to reside and work (and even study) will be derived from your sponsor/spouse.
You can apply for an optional RC to demonstrate this right,

You can get up to speed on EU free movement rights here:
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/doc ... 013_en.pdf

[yuiop]

I am currently a student under Tier 4 visa living with my wife, an EEA citizen, also student. I am the one with the highest income of the two (working legally up to 20 hours a week), therefore I am her sponsor. My studies will finish and I want to apply for a residence card so I can continue living working in the UK while my wife studies. The application process asks for evidences that the EEA citizen can sponsor the non-EEA one, but in our case it is the other way around - I am the one who sponsors my EEA wife and need the permit to continue doing so. How should I proceed?

Thank you in advance for your help!

I assume you are a non-EEA national.
You have some misunderstandings around the exercise of EU treaty rights.

You cannot actually sponsor anyone under the EU migration route; your activity in UK is actually immaterial (in immigration terms).

The EEA national (in this case your spouse) is your sponsor; you (as non-EEA) will be the dependent, direct family member.

Note: You will both need CSI as your sponsor is in the student category of qualified person.

Assuming you remain married to each other and your wife continues to exercise treaty rights as a qualified person (in one category or other), and both parties keep any absences from UK within prescribed limits, and there is no Brexit, then all you need to do is reside in UK.

Your right to reside and work (and even study) will be derived from your sponsor/spouse.
You can apply for an optional RC to demonstrate this right,

You can get up to speed on EU free movement rights here:
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/doc ... 013_en.pdf

Thank you for your reply. Yes, I am a non-EEA national.

So basically the fact that I work here is irrelevant to the application process, is that right? However, when making the application, my EEA wife will need to show that she has money to support both of us. The problem is that I am the one who is currently working. Therefore, her statements will obviously not show enough income to support both of us, because I am the one who does it. Would that be a problem? Should I send my bank statements instead? I would obviously continue to support both of us, but can only continue working after I receive a residence card.

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

Thank you for your reply. Yes, I am a non-EEA national.

So basically the fact that I work here is irrelevant to the application process, is that right? However, when making the application, my EEA wife will need to show that she has money to support both of us. The problem is that I am the one who is currently working. Therefore, her statements will obviously not show enough income to support both of us, because I am the one who does it. Would that be a problem? Should I send my bank statements instead? I would obviously continue to support both of us, but can only continue working after I receive a residence card.

Many thanks!

Yes, your understanding is correct as you are not the sponsor.

You can transfer funds to your wife or else maintain a joint account, something like that.

Don't forget the CSI (for both of you) or its an instant fail.

As long as wife is a qualified person (eg student, with CSI) you can reside & work etc. (You don't have to have a RC).

A RC is optional as its just a confirmatory document but obviously employers or landlords (etc) may need sight of proof of your rights from time to time.

[yuiop]

Yes, your understanding is correct as you are not the sponsor.

You can transfer funds to your wife or else maintain a joint account, something like that.

As far as I remember she would need to show statements from the three last months, which complicates things. We have separate bank accounts because the bank wouldn't open a joint student account. Do you think I could send my statements as proof of funds? I don't have a great sum to transfer her, but my statements show that I receive regular income. Do you think that would work, or is totally irrelevant? If the latter, what could be possibly do?

Don't forget the CSI (for both of you) or its an instant fail.

Sorry about my ignorance, but what is the CSI?

As long as wife is a qualified person (eg student, with CSI) you can reside & work etc. (You don't have to have a RC).

A RC is optional as its just a confirmatory document but obviously employers or landlords (etc) may need sight of proof of your rights from time to time.

Would that mean that, as long as she remains a qualified person, my application for an RC would most likely be successful? Would it depend on our proof of income?

Many thanks!


Also, what is CSI?

[noajthan]

Yes, your understanding is correct as you are not the sponsor.

You can transfer funds to your wife or else maintain a joint account, something like that.

As far as I remember she would need to show statements from the three last months, which complicates things. We have separate bank accounts because the bank wouldn't open a joint student account. Do you think I could send my statements as proof of funds? I don't have a great sum to transfer her, but my statements show that I receive regular income. Do you think that would work, or is totally irrelevant? If the latter, what could be possibly do?

Don't forget the CSI (for both of you) or its an instant fail.

Sorry about my ignorance, but what is the CSI?

As long as wife is a qualified person (eg student, with CSI) you can reside & work etc. (You don't have to have a RC).

A RC is optional as its just a confirmatory document but obviously employers or landlords (etc) may need sight of proof of your rights from time to time.

Would that mean that, as long as she remains a qualified person, my application for an RC would most likely be successful? Would it depend on our proof of income?

Many thanks!

Also, what is CSI?

Submit separate statements if that is what you have.

CSI = comprehensive sickness (/health) insurance;
sponsor's student period won't count towards PR unless you both have this in place.

Your application for RC should succeed if you have adequate documentary supporting evidence to prove your identities, prove your relationship, demonstrate both your residency periods in UK, show any absences from UK within limits (for both parties) and of course sponsor/spouse's proof of exercising treaty rights.

[yuiop]

Submit separate statements if that is what you have.

CSI = comprehensive sickness (/health) insurance;
sponsor's student period won't count towards PR unless you both have this in place.

Your application for RC should succeed if you have adequate documentary supporting evidence to prove your identities, prove your relationship, demonstrate both your residency periods in UK, show any absences from UK within limits (for both parties) and of course sponsor/spouse's proof of exercising treaty rights.

We never needed any kind of health insurance to be in the UK as a student, therefore we don't have one. We are actually registered with the NHS. Do we need one to apply for temporary residency, or just for permanent residency? Why would I not need health insurance under Tier 4 but need it as a non-EEA family member?

I thought we would not need insurance in the UK, since healthcare is free through NHS. That's quite confusing.

[noajthan]

Submit separate statements if that is what you have.

CSI = comprehensive sickness (/health) insurance;
sponsor's student period won't count towards PR unless you both have this in place.

Your application for RC should succeed if you have adequate documentary supporting evidence to prove your identities, prove your relationship, demonstrate both your residency periods in UK, show any absences from UK within limits (for both parties) and of course sponsor/spouse's proof of exercising treaty rights.

We never needed any kind of health insurance to be in the UK as a student, therefore we don't have one. We are actually registered with the NHS. Do we need one to apply for temporary residency, or just for permanent residency? Why would I not need health insurance under Tier 4 but need it as a non-EEA family member?

I thought we would not need insurance in the UK, since healthcare is free through NHS. That's quite confusing.

Don't mix up UK immigration law with EU law. Completely different kettles of fish.

You're switching to the EU migration route - EU law.

It is confusing - so have you read the EU document I posted for you earlier?
Clue: chapter 6
Pro tip: it pays to be proactive when plotting your migration journey into UK.

One requirement is for non-economically active persons, (eg students), to not be a burden on the state;
- that includes having to have sickness/health cover.
The same applies for their dependents - CSI required.

You can get up to speed on students as qualified persons here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... lean.pdf[b]

Note[/b] It's not about whether you need healthcare, or whether you are fighting fit and have never used the NHS (etc).

'Rules are rules', simple as that. Follow them and you should be fine (but no guarantees).
Students and self-sufficient qualified persons need CSI; without it they are wasting their time in UK and, technically, they and family are liable to removal as their PR clock is stopped.
Without CSI your student sponsor will not be exercising treaty rights.

Many students do remain blissfully unaware of this until its too late and so ruin their chances of acquiring PR;
(hence delaying any ambition they may have for the privilege of citizenship).

It doesn't matter now as you say you are still on a T4 visa with wife as dependent.
Fortunately you have time to set this CSI cover in place before/as you transition to operate under EU regulations.

[yuiop]

Don't mix up UK immigration law with EU law. Completely different kettles of fish.

You're switching to the EU migration route - EU law.

It is confusing - so have you read the EU document I posted for you earlier?

One requirement is for non-economically active persons, (eg students), to not be a burden on the state;
that includes having to have sickness/health cover.
The same applies for their dependents - CSI required.

You can get up to speed on students as qualified persons here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... lean.pdf[b]

Note[/b] It's not about whether you need healthcare, or whether you are fighting fit and have never used the NHS (etc).

'Rules are rules', simple as that.
Students and self-sufficient qualified persons need CSI; without it they are wasting their time in UK and, technically, are liable to removal as their PR clock is stopped.
Without CSI your student sponsor will not be exercising treaty rights.

Many students do remain blissfully unaware of this until its too late and so ruin their chances of acquiring PR, (hence delaying any ambition they may have for the privilege of citizenship).

It doesn't matter now as you say you are still on a T4 visa with wife as dependent.
Fortunately you have time to set this CSI cover in place before/as you transition to operate under EU regulations.

Thank you very much for the clarification, now things make more sense. I hadn't realised that UK immigration laws and EU laws were different, maybe because UK is part of the EU.

If we both acquire CSI at this point, would all the time we spent here as students still count for a future PR? In other words, would the CSI apply retroactively to the time we spent as students in the UK?

Yes, I read through most of the link you sent me - thank you very much for that. Now I understand why some of the rules there are different than the UK rules - I am applying for EU residency, despite having chosen the UK as the country to settle in.

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

Thank you very much for the clarification, now things make more sense. I hadn't realised that UK immigration laws and EU laws were different, maybe because UK is part of the EU.

If we both acquire CSI at this point, would all the time we spent here as students still count for a future PR? In other words, would the CSI apply retroactively to the time we spent as students in the UK?

Yes, I read through most of the link you sent me - thank you very much for that. Now I understand why some of the rules there are different than the UK rules - I am applying for EU residency, despite having chosen the UK as the country to settle in.

Many thanks!

No worries.

Forewarned is forearmed.
Glad I got to you ahead of time; you will see too many cases here lamenting "PR refused" &/or "naturalisation refused" due to something as simple as having no CSI.

CSI is an insurance so it can't be backdated to your T4 period (& wasn't needed for your T4).

Your EU PR clock will only start when you switch to EU rules (presumably when the T4 visa expires) so you haven't lost anything by not having CSI.
(Ofcourse your T4 time in UK doesn't count under EU rules).

Note: CSI is not needed if, in future, sponsor switches to employment/self-employment as then such economic activity (including paying tax/NI) covers the necessary.

All being well, (and assuming you remain married to each other, there's no Brexit, etc etc) you should both acquire PR in about 5 years time.

Good luck.

[yuiop]

No worries.

Forewarned is forearmed.
Glad I got to you ahead of time; you will see too many cases here lamenting "PR refused" &/or "naturalisation refused" due to something as simple as having no CSI.

CSI is an insurance so it can't be backdated to your T4 period (& wasn't needed for your T4).

Your EU PR clock will only start when you switch to EU rules (presumably when the T4 visa expires) so you haven't lost anything by not having CSI.
(Ofcourse your T4 time in UK doesn't count under EU rules).

Note: CSI is not needed if, in future, sponsor switches to employment/self-employment as then such economic activity (including paying tax/NI) covers the necessary.

All being well, (and assuming you remain married to each other, there's no Brexit, etc etc) you should both acquire PR in about 5 years time.

Good luck.

I also finished reading through the last link you've send from the UK gov website - very helpful, as always.

I guess the final question would be: how can I be sure that a specific health insurance will meet the requirements for CSI? Are some of them advertised as such? Do you have any links with a list of qualified health insurances or something like that?

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

I also finished reading through the last link you've send from the UK gov website - very helpful, as always.

I guess the final question would be: how can I be sure that a specific health insurance will meet the requirements for CSI? Are some of them advertised as such? Do you have any links with a list of qualified health insurances or something like that?

Many thanks!

I haven't travelled this specific route so cannot recommend insurers directly.

You will find various providers mentioned in the forum (use 'advanced search' feature) or else google is your friend.

fyi https://www.freemovement.org.uk/compreh ... -students/

[yuiop]

I haven't travelled this specific route so cannot recommend insurers directly.

You will find various providers mentioned in the forum (use 'advanced search' feature) or else google is your friend.

fyi https://www.freemovement.org.uk/compreh ... -students/

Thank you again!

After reading the first PDF you sent me, it seems that I would be the only one required to apply for a RC - my EEA wife doesn't need to. Is that right? What would be the advantages of her registering for an RC as well? Also, if she decides not to apply for an RC (only me), do we both need to have CSI or just me?

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

Thank you again!

After reading the first PDF you sent me, it seems that I would be the only one required to apply for a RC - my EEA wife doesn't need to. Is that right? What would be the advantages of her registering for an RC as well? Also, if she decides not to apply for an RC (only me), do we both need to have CSI or just me?

Many thanks!

Yes, a RC (certificate not card for EEA applicants) is optional for the EEA national.
Advantage is that it's a simple way to confirm holder's status.

Yes, both sponsor and dependents of students need CSI as all the links/docs make clear.

Suggest wife informs her university of her change of visa status.
UK universities are held to account as 'proxy immigration officials' for their international customers and so will probably need to know of wife's change from T4 to EU trajectory. They may have to approve it - not sure.

[yuiop]

Thank you for your reply.

I was reading the Guide to Supporting Documents for the RC application forms and it says that we need to provide proof of my wife's enrollment at the university. The problem is that enrollment only happens in September. My Tier 4 Visa expires in October, and if I wait until September to send the paperwork I will probably not receive any kind of documentation confirming my application before my Visa expires. This would mean that I would loose my current jobs for not providing proof of eligibility to work...

Does anyone know if a letter of Unconditional Offer from the university would be accepted instead of proof of enrollment? Maybe if I included a letter explaining the situation?

Alternatively, could I apply right now as the spouse of a self-sufficient EEA national instead? If so, would we need to change anything in the application afterwards? What are the advantages of applying as a student over applying as self-sufficient, since in both cases you need to have funds to support yourself?

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

Thank you for your reply.

...

Does anyone know if a letter of Unconditional Offer from the university would be accepted instead of proof of enrollment? Maybe if I included a letter explaining the situation?

Alternatively, could I apply right now as the spouse of a self-sufficient EEA national instead? If so, would we need to change anything in the application afterwards? What are the advantages of applying as a student over applying as self-sufficient, since in both cases you need to have funds to support yourself?

Many thanks!

You can't apply on the basis that your wife is going to be a student in the future.

If applying now submit proof of having a selfsufficient sponsor (plus the CSI ofcourse).

There is no 'good' qualified person category versus 'bad' qualified person category, the sponsor is either a valid qualified person or not.

As you will note from the Declaration you sign on the application form, you are committing to notify HO of any material changes after the application is filed, (such as sponsor switching categories).

[yuiop]

Thank you again.

In that case, is there a specific procedure to notify changes to the Home Office? When my sponsor becomes a student, do we both need to fill another copy of the application forms, or is there a specific form to make amendments to the application? Do we need to notify the HO by phone/email or just send the documents by post with some kind of letter attached?

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

Thank you again.

In that case, is there a specific procedure to notify changes to the Home Office? When my sponsor becomes a student, do we both need to fill another copy of the application forms, or is there a specific form to make amendments to the application? Do we need to notify the HO by phone/email or just send the documents by post with some kind of letter attached?

Many thanks!

Simply notify such material changes in writing.

[yuiop]

Thank you again.

In that case, is there a specific procedure to notify changes to the Home Office? When my sponsor becomes a student, do we both need to fill another copy of the application forms, or is there a specific form to make amendments to the application? Do we need to notify the HO by phone/email or just send the documents by post with some kind of letter attached?

Many thanks!

Simply notify such material changes in writing.

Just to be 100% clear, you mean attach a letter with the extra documentation and send it altogether to the same address that we have originally sent the application, right?

Where did you find this information? I didn't find the procedure to notify changes in the guidelines for EEA FM or EEA QP forms.

Many thanks!

[noajthan]

Just to be 100% clear, you mean attach a letter with the extra documentation and send it altogether to the same address that we have originally sent the application, right?

Where did you find this information? I didn't find the procedure to notify changes in the guidelines for EEA FM or EEA QP forms.

Many thanks!

See Declaration you wil have to sign on the form, eg:

I confirm that if, before this application is decided, there is a material change in my circumstances or new information relevant to this application becomes available, I will inform the Home Office

I haven't done this but would use initial address unless HO happens to advise of any other address in any subsequent communication with you.

[yuiop]

See Declaration you wil have to sign on the form, eg:

I confirm that if, before this application is decided, there is a material change in my circumstances or new information relevant to this application becomes available, I will inform the Home Office

I haven't done this but would use initial address unless HO happens to advise of any other address in any subsequent communication with you.

Thank you. I thought there could be other ways of informing changes in my application (phone, email, etc).

We were thinking of using one of the Premium Services Centres for our application. According to instructions in front of the EEA(QP) and EEA(FM) forms, the application of EEA(QP) can be done at a PSC, but the EEA (FM) cannot. This is clear if you are doing both applications separately; however, I wonder if we are doing both applications together, would it be possible to go to a PSC and submit the EEA(FM) as well? After all, we are strongly recommended to submit both applications together.

I spoke to a friend today who said he has done both applications together at a PSC about six years ago, which made me wonder if that is still possible.

Many thanks!

[yuiop]

Dear noajthan,

Just curious if you had a chance to read my post above.

Kind regards.