Questions regarding EEA (PR)

[romanokun]

Hello. I have some questions about EEA (PR) form:

1) A family from Latvia is applying for EEA (PR). A husband (a sponsor, working), a wife and 2 children. Does each person need to print the form and fill it in separately, right? In this case some sections will be repeated (for example, 1, 5, 9, 16, 17, 18 and 19) and the others not (eg the children have to fill in Section 2 and 12 additionally), right?

But in this case I do not understand why then in the form Section 1 C (Family members included in your application) is included, questions 1.24 to 1.41 where you are requested to include in the form all your Family members that are applying. What made me think that you can print out one form for all the people and include all family members and the sponsor, put that you "You and more than 3 family members" and it will work

Then again it is not clear whether it is necessary to fill the sections 2 (3 times for each family member), 11 (for the wife), 12 (2 times for each child).
Do I need to reprint and fill in again the sections 3, 5, 9, 16, 17, 18, 19 (that is, 4 times for each person totally)?

As I remember before March 2016 Guidance Notes stated that each member must fill in the form separately. Even if the information is duplicated sometimes. Although early in 2010 all family members could be included in the form.

2) I was dismissed on 25.02.2011. I applied for JSA on 17.03.2011 and started to look for a job. In April 2011 I found. The question is from 25.02.2011 to 17.03.2011 do I need to put that I was self-sufficient person (and lived on the what remained from the last salary and they will see it from bank statements), or I should put that I was job-seeker?

3) Consideration process takes an average of 2 months, but I heard that there is an option to do this faster (even 1 day). Is it right?

4) Is confirmation from employer (statement from employer) is really important? What risk and may be statistics of refusal to grant PR because of lack of this document is? If instead the worker agreement is supplied? One lawyer answered that just P60 is enough. Is it really the case?

[noajthan]

Hello. I have some questions about EEA (PR) form:

1) A family from Latvia is applying for EEA (PR). A husband (a sponsor, working), a wife and 2 children. Does each person need to print the form and fill it in separately, right? In this case some sections will be repeated (for example, 1, 5, 9, 16, 17, 18 and 19) and the others not (eg the children have to fill in Section 2 and 12 additionally), right?

...

2) I was dismissed on 25.02.2011. I applied for JSA on 17.03.2011 and started to look for a job. In April 2011 I found. The question is from 25.02.2011 to 17.03.2011 do I need to put that I was self-sufficient person (and lived on the what remained from the last salary and they will see it from bank statements), or I should put that I was job-seeker?

3) Consideration process takes an average of 2 months, but I heard that there is an option to do this faster (even 1 day). Is it right?

4) Is confirmation from employer (statement from employer) is really important? What risk and may be statistics of refusal to grant PR because of lack of this document is? If instead the worker agreement is supplied? One lawyer answered that just P60 is enough. Is it really the case?

1) You can use a single form, And just print extra pages for the various sections for the various people.

2) Self-sufficient people need to have had CSI.

Sounds like you were a jobseeker. You will need evidence of your jobsearch and of registration at JobCentre (etc).

3) No, no one-day service for confirmation of PR (to my knowledge). Who told you that?

4) Do you mean a confirmation letter from the employer? Not necessary.
Job contract. P60s, P45 , sample payslips etc etc will suffice. Just follow the PR guidance, its quite clear.

Suggest print off a few copies. Collect all evidence.
Have a dry-run - see how it all shapes up.

[romanokun]

Thank you for response.

I read the guidance that states

"Employment
 Letter from each employer confirming the dates you/your sponsor worked for them,
salary/wages, normal hours of work, and the reason the employment ended (if relevant)
 Wage slips and/or bank statements showing receipt of wages (this must cover each job you
have/your sponsor has held during the relevant qualifying period)
 P60s for each year in which you were/your sponsor was employed.
If you can’t submit the documents above (for example, you’ve lost the relevant documents, the
employer is no longer trading or you are/your sponsor is unable to contact them), you should
enclose a letter explaining why not and you MUSTsubmit alternative evidence of the relevant
employment, such as:
 P45s
 signed contract of employment
 notice of redundancy
 letter accepting resignation
 letter of dismissal
 employment tribunal judgment relating to the employment. "


So I must provide the letter, P60, payslips (every week that I worked) or original bank statement (not from online) (every week that I worked). In case something is missing I MUST provide anything else like P45 or contract. Is how I read the guidance. And I do not understand why letter from employer is not required (like some lawyers say and you as well stated) if the guidance states states the opposite that letter MUST be provided. And do I correctly understand that I need to prove that every week I worked through bank statements or payslips (so payslips for every week is required, no missing weeks, right)?

[romanokun]

With regards of copies: as I understand that copies are no longer required to send since March 2016 when the form was changed. Right? As I am going to send hundreds of pages put in Lever Arch File. It would be more

[noajthan]

Thank you for response.

I read the guidance that states
...

So I must provide the letter, P60, payslips (every week that I worked) or original bank statement (not from online) (every week that I worked). In case something is missing I MUST provide anything else like P45 or contract. Is how I read the guidance. And I do not understand why letter from employer is not required (like some lawyers say and you as well stated) if the guidance states states the opposite that letter MUST be provided. And do I correctly understand that I need to prove that every week I worked through bank statements or payslips (so payslips for every week is required, no missing weeks, right)?

Don't worry. Noone's misleading or tricking you.

Many members here (who are applying to confirm PR as a worker) report simply applying with P60s, plus a sample of payslips, copy of job contract and so on.
This can satisfy the treaty rights part of the application.
(Not even payslips from every week).

Ofcourse if employer is able to provide a letter you can submit it.

Be aware that guidance is not a statement of the law,
And anyway the UK law (EEA Regulations) is only a version of the EU law from the relevant Directive (2004/EC/38).

It is the EU law you need to satisfy.
And all that says about employment (in the context of PR) is it has to be shown to be genuine and effective.

So you don't have to slavishly follow the guidance. It is helpful but only as a guide.

[noajthan]

FYI - you can see in internal HO guidance how a caseworker is likely to assess the application from a worker:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _clean.pdf
- see page 11
and see examples on page 12+

Again this is just a guide, it is not the law,

[romanokun]

OK. Thank You for response. I already collected all the documents then (hundreds of pages put on level-arch file). As I understand I do need to supply copies of the documents anymore, only originals (as form changed as of March of this year), right?

[noajthan]

OK. Thank You for response. I already collected all the documents then (hundreds of pages put on level-arch file). As I understand I do need to supply copies of the documents anymore, only originals (as form changed as of March of this year), right?

I'm not aware of sending copies. The current PR form asks for originals as far as possible.

[romanokun]

Got some other questions. Do I need to prove 5-year residency for children? Like letter from GP surgery, confirmation from school, receipt of child benefit and child tax credit?

[noajthan]

Got some other questions. Do I need to prove 5-year residency for children? Like letter from GP surgery, confirmation from school, receipt of child benefit and child tax credit?

Yes, that is my understanding.
Also suggest any school reports; dentist or optician or vaccination /clinic type documents.

Any membership of youth organisation:
scouts, guides, army/air/sea cadets;
any church/temple.mosque membership.

(Receipt of child benefit would not prove residence of a child as it may be claimed for children overseas and is paid to a parent).

[romanokun]

Thank You for response
That is interesting issue. I have studied the legislation. Article 16, para 1 and 2 of Directive 2004/38/EC)

"1. Union citizens who have resided legally for a continuous period of five years in the host
Member State shall have the right of permanent residence there. This right shall not be subject to
the conditions provided for in Chapter III.
2. Paragraph 1 shall apply also to family members who are not nationals of a Member State and
have legally resided with the Union citizen in the host Member State for a continuous period of
five years"

clearly suggests that if a family member is not from EU then he need to satisfy 5-years residency but what if a family member is EU-national? Why do legislation put in the article family member from NON EU-country only? So if a family-members of the applicant are EU country nationals then this regulation does not apply? For example a husband has been living in UK for 6 years and a wife with her kids recently (let's say 2 month ago) joined the family in UK. Then maybe the wife and the kids do not need to satisfy the 5-year residency as per regulations (otherwise the regulation would include BOTH EU and NON-EU nationals) and they can apply for EEA (PR) rather than applying for EEA (QP)? Where is it said in the regulations about family members that are from EU?

I am not arguing, I just want to make it all clear.

PS By the way, noajthan, are you a lawyer?

[noajthan]

Thank You for response
That is interesting issue. I have studied the legislation. Article 16, para 1 and 2 of Directive 2004/38/EC)

"1. Union citizens who have resided legally for a continuous period of five years in the host
Member State shall have the right of permanent residence there. This right shall not be subject to
the conditions provided for in Chapter III.

...

clearly suggests that if a family member is not from EU then he need to satisfy 5-years residency but what if a family member is EU-national? Why do legislation put in the article family member from NON EU-country only? So if a family-members of the applicant are EU country nationals then this regulation does not apply? For example a husband has been living in UK for 6 years and a wife with her kids recently (let's say 2 month ago) joined the family in UK. Then maybe the wife and the kids do not need to satisfy the 5-year residency as per regulations (otherwise the regulation would include BOTH EU and NON-EU nationals) and they can apply for EEA (PR) rather than applying for EEA (QP)? Where is it said in the regulations about family members that are from EU?

I am not arguing, I just want to make it all clear.

If a family member is a Union citizen then, as I read it, they are covered by para #1 - its for any/all Union (EEA/EU) citizens including family/minors.