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Moderators: Casa, Amber, archigabe, batleykhan, ca.funke, ChetanOjha, EUsmileWEallsmile, JAJ, John, Obie, push, geriatrix, vinny, CR001, zimba, meself2, Administrator
The Government has ordered a major review into the procedures for granting Irish citizenships to foreigners, following the discovery of a 30-month backlog in dealing with each application.
Figures obtained by The Sunday Business Post show there are 15,000 people on the waiting list for naturalisation, a process whereby foreigners living in Ireland can obtain Irish citizenship.
The main reason for the delay is the significant increase in the number of people applying for naturalisation in recent years, according to the Department of Justice. More than 7,000 people applied last year, compared with 1,004 in 2000.
Minister for Justice Brian Lenihan has instructed his senior officials to undertake an immediate review of the various processes to see if they can be streamlined and improved.
In order for a foreigner to be naturalised, the individual must have lived in Ireland continuously for the 12-month period prior to the application. In addition, they must have lived in Ireland for at least four of the previous eight years.More than 3,400 people applied for naturalisation in the first six months of the year, according to Department of Justice figures. In total, 28,000 people have lodged applications since 2000.
Applications are subject to a number of different tests. In addition to the residency criteria, passports and other documentation are also examined, and the Garda National Immigration Bureau may also be consulted.
Since April 1, 2005, some 3,500 applicants have been found to be ineligible under this criteria. The next stage of the process involves a thorough examination of the applicant’s financial status in order to assess their ability to support themselves.
The department may consult with the Revenue Commissioners and the Department of Social and Family Affairs to check the person’s financial background.
all good things come to those who wait? while you are waiting. you better pray and hope nothing happen to youself. i am not saying that anything will happen to you but if you suddenly become unemploy or fall sick and cant work or for whatever reason that you have to claim social welfare before your citizenship application decided by DOJ. they might not renew your permission to remain in ireland, so waiting is still a good thing? yes?another_immigrant wrote:Thanks Joe.
it looks like it's getting longer and longer every month. According to my calculation, -based on the letter that was issued last November- it's now 16 months i guess... (jul 06 - nov 07)
it reminds me of the old irish saying "all good things come to those who wait" ...
Applications for naturalisation received in June 2005 are currently being processed.
The processing time just jumped by 4 months.Processing time is approximately 18 months.
Not true that they are counting the months, they are counting the days, 365 days per year.Long term residence is granted on the basis that a non EEA national has completed five years (60 months) legal residence in the State on Work Permit conditions which is reflected in the corresponding Stamp 1 or Stamp 4 endorsements in a person's passport and not by the dates of commencement and expiry of each Work Permit. Subsequently, in calculating the reckonable period of 60 months legal residence, this office only takes into consideration time spent in the State legally on work permit conditions.
Long Term Residency
How can I obtain Long Term Residence in Ireland?
The position in relation to granting long term residence (currently processed as an Administrative Scheme) is as follows : Persons who have been legally resident in the State for over five years (ie: 60 months) on the basis of Work Permit/work authorisation/work visa conditions may apply to this office for a five year residency extension. In that context they may also apply to be exempt from employment permit requirements.
Long term residence is granted on the basis that a non EEA national has completed five years (60 months) legal residence in the State on Work Permit conditions which is reflected in the corresponding Stamp 1 or Stamp 4 endorsements in a person's passport and not by the dates of commencement and expiry of each Work Permit. Subsequently, in calculating the reckonable period of 60 months legal residence, this office only takes into consideration time spent in the State legally on work permit conditions. However, periods of time, where a person has not had legal residence (ie: having an up to date endorsement on Work Permit conditions in their passport) cannot be counted towards an application for long term residence.
The dependants of the aforementioned, who have been legally resident in the State for over five years (ie: 60 months) may also apply for long term residence. This particular long term permission does not exempt the dependants from employment permit requirements.
The following documents together with a covering letter of application clearly indicating the passport endorsements (totalling 60 months) relating to each work permit should be submitted to;
The Long Term Residence Section,
General Immigration Division,
3rd Floor,
INIS,
13-14 Burgh Quay,
Dublin 2
* Copy work permits.
* Copy Certificate of Registration (GNIB Card).
* Clear and legible copy passport including all endorsements (If your passport has expired since arrival in the State, please submit copies of both passports).
Applicants are also advised to keep their permission to remain up to date at all times (including the period while their application is being processed).
Processing time is approximately 18 months.
Applications from non EEA nationals who have not competed the 60 months legal residency at time of applications will not be accepted.
I appreciate and understand the torture that you take from the public. I can see that sometimes there are circumstances that you just feel you want to strangle or have the overwhelming urge to tell applicants to go away in a not-so-polite way. I agree that sometimes INIS officers find dealing with some applicants/"chancers" very frustrating and they act on this. But there is not "neutral" position for most of these guys and they constantly operate in this aggressive mode. I've had opportunity to socialize with staff from various embassies (incl. American) in Dublin and I frequently amazed at just how frustrating even diplomatic staff find it to operate in Ireland and its procedures.Marielmcp wrote:I find that disgusting, considering the wages I am on and the amount of abuse I have to take from the youth (and their parents!) of this country (most of whom cannot complete an application form to save their life)
I don't think that the foreigners are willing to stand together and stand up to the system. And I can understand this. The reason for this, in my opinion, is that most of them are all scared. The Irish has shown in the past that they can do whatever they want with foreigners because the immigration laws in Ireland and the governments power is as clear as mud. The Irish fear change a lot and with all these foreigners around I think they are upset by the changes it's bringing to Irish society. A lot of people are trying to build a new future here, some with young families, and simply just don't want to risk that being taken away from them because the fear is there that Irish gov will exactly just do that. (And of course access to financial resources to pursue matters in the courts if things turn sour.)Marielmcp wrote:It might also not be a bad idea to call for a 'general strike' of sorts for people effected by this inefficiency.
In our case, we went to the solicitors in August2007 when some nitwit supervisor at the GNIB actually challenged us to go to the courts. By December 2007, our case got listed for hearing and the Department settled with us out of court which is not a bad turn around time.Marielmcp wrote:Plus from what I have heard, the courts and their wait times are nearly as appalling as the LTR and Naturalsation wait times..
Count me in. But we will need a considerable number of people and media attention to have any affect.archigabe wrote:I would also be in favour of protesting in front of the Irish parliament Dail (Leinster House) which can be a PR disaster for the Government if everyone found out about the cra**y way the government treats legal foreign workers and not just asylum seekers.
To those with a more academic interest, this page refers to all issues relevant to movement of third country nationals in E.U countries.(25) In accordance with Articles 1 and 2 of the Protocol on the position of the United Kingdom and Ireland, annexed to the Treaty on European Union and to the Treaty establishing the European Community, and without prejudice to Article 4 of the said Protocol, these Member States are not participating in the adoption of this Directive and are not bound by or subject to its application.
(26) In accordance with Articles 1 and 2 of the Protocol on the position of Denmark, annexed to the Treaty on European Union and the Treaty establishing the European Community, Denmark does not take part in the adoption of this Directive, and is not bound by it or subject to its application
There is an EU directive from 1999 that says residency must be processed from the time a non eu is eligible. Unfortunetly and inexplicably Ireland and the UK are exempt from it. Again its' like the Irish mammy syndrome. The spoiled Irish government can do what it wants and the EU will wipes its mule all day long.archigabe wrote:Marielmcp wrote:
Isn't there some E.U regulation that specifies member states are supposed to process residency applications within a specific time frame once the applicant has lived legally in a member state for 5 years? I don't remember where I saw it,but I'll try to find it again. Maybe someone can use that regulation to sue to department.
I would also be in favour of protesting in front of the Irish parliament Dail (Leinster House) which can be a PR disaster for the Government if everyone found out about the cra**y way the government treats legal foreign workers and not just asylum seekers.
Unfortunately this type of thought is what is going to keep the sustem going as it is, with wait times increasing on a constant basis. At the end of the day we have rights as legal residents in Ireland and we need to make it clear to all parties involved that most of us will gain a right to vote in this country and that we can influence our partners, friends, families and businesses in regards to their vote.I don't think that the foreigners are willing to stand together and stand up to the system. And I can understand this. The reason for this, in my opinion, is that most of them are all scared. The Irish has shown in the past that they can do whatever they want with foreigners because the immigration laws in Ireland and the governments power is as clear as mud. The Irish fear change a lot and with all these foreigners around I think they are upset by the changes it's bringing to Irish society. A lot of people are trying to build a new future here, some with young families, and simply just don't want to risk that being taken away from them because the fear is there that Irish gov will exactly just do that. (And of course access to financial resources to pursue matters in the courts if things turn sour.)
I just cannot believe that there is very little that the foreigners can do to safely protest the system. One thing I know, the sooner the Irish realise that change in society is inevitable and that it will happen, the better the outcome will be for nationals/foreigners alike.
That's one of the reasons for my poll. I wanted to get an idea of how many people is browsing this forum. I guess one approach would be to get a not-for-profit org going, and get people actively involved that way. I am definitely not suggesting doing what orgs like Immigrant Council and MRCI are doing. They already doing a great job in any case. The not-for-profit org should focus on the ordinary non-EU Joe Soaps with valid work/spousal visas who work here and who gets treated unfairly, and is discriminated against, who waits for their LTR or naturalisation applications to be processed. There should also be some way to formally lodge complaints against abuse from INIS officials. I've heard of apalling stories of these yokes making ridiculous statements and refuse to commit to them in writing.Marielmcp wrote:Does anyone have any idea as to how many people use this forum and might be keen on joining this?