Employment record as a full time PhD student?

[Intrepid V]

Hello, on the naturalisation application form, I have to state my employment record for the last 10 years.

I have been in full time higher / further education since 2005.

For the first 5 years of that 10 year period, I have been a full time undergraduate student, with no employment.

Then for the last 6 years, I have been a full time, fully funded, UK PhD student (twice, since my first PhD did not work out and I started again at another university). During my PhD studies, I have done sporadic paid demonstrating work (i.e. teaching / marking homework for undergrads) in my department. I have not paid any tax/NI contributions on this since the income was less than £10,000 per year (or whatever exact figure is required for taxable income). I don't have any P45/P60 forms, or anything like that. I have not done any other paid work.

I have recently contacted administration both at my current and ex-university, they provided me with letters stating that I am / was a a full time PhD student in receipt of a tax-free stipend, and that all my income (from stipend and demonstrating work) is tax free. To my knowledge, that's all the formal paperwork I am able to obtain.

1. Should I list these universities as my "employers"? (Although I am a full time postgraduate student there)

2. Are these letters enough to act as a proof as employment record / evidence that my income is tax-free?

[cs95tdg]

Did you have a national insurance number (NI) during the time you were paid by the university while a PhD student?

[Intrepid V]

Did you have a national insurance number (NI) during the time you were paid by the university while a PhD student?

Yes, why?

[cs95tdg]

As you have a NI number, just a suggestion to verify if you have a HMRC NI contribution history over the last 10 years, even if you paid no taxes. You should be able to do this by registering online for a personal tax account using your NI number. You can then see if you have any NI contributions logged against any tax year from the date you first got your NI number. Google personal tax account to find the url to register/login.

I did this earlier in the year and could see the overall contribution figures for each of the years where I was a student in the past and had worked. All subsequent years where I had not worked were also visible with no contributions.

[Intrepid V]

As you have a NI number, just a suggestion to verify if you have a HMRC NI contribution history over the last 10 years, even if you paid no taxes. You should be able to do this by registering online for a personal tax account using your NI number. You can then see if you have any NI contributions logged against any tax year from the date you first got your NI number. Google personal tax account to find the url to register/login.

I did this earlier in the year and could see the overall contribution figures for each of the years where I was a student in the past and had worked. All subsequent years where I had not worked were also visible with no contributions.

Thank you, I will look into it. Do I have to state NI contributions on my application?

[cs95tdg]

Do I have to state NI contributions on my application?

As far as I've seen its not required to be stated on the form. But if you read the AN form guidance (& if not Id suggest that you do so) you'll see it says you must provide details of all your NI contributions made for your current and previous employment during the past 10 years. This is where they refer to P60's and payslips or employer letters as evidence.

As you say you don't have p60's, my thought was that the personal tax account would be another way of verifying whether you do or don't have a HMRC NI employment history.

[Intrepid V]

Do I have to state NI contributions on my application?

As far as I've seen its not required to be stated on the form. But if you read the AN form guidance (& if not Id suggest that you do so) you'll see it says you must provide details of all your NI contributions made for your current and previous employment during the past 10 years. This is where they refer to P60's and payslips or employer letters as evidence.

As you say you don't have p60's, my thought was that the personal tax account would be another way of verifying whether you do or don't have a HMRC NI employment history.

Ok. I just tried logging into personal tax account using the gov. gateway website. However, an error message comes up "We're unable to confirm your identity". I don't know why. Perhaps because I received my NI number on a letter when I obtained my ILR back in 2004, and they haven't updated the records? (This letter is the only written document I ever had that states my NI number).


By the way, if it turns out that officially I don't have HMRC NI employment history, would I still have to state that I did this work at my university, or could I just leave that section blank?

Edit. I just called HMRC directly. They have my details on their system. They will send me the record over the last 10 years.

[cs95tdg]

Perhaps because I received my NI number on a letter when I obtained my ILR back in 2004, and they haven't updated the records? (This letter is the only written document I ever had that states my NI number).

Am slightly confused by this underlined statement, or it may be I'm misreading what you attempted to say. Your NI number wouldn't have been issued as part of your ILR application. It's something you need to apply for independently - normally through job centre plus and is not linked to the HO immigration application process in that way. Additionally, I'm assuming you obtained ILR at a later date, not while you were working as a PhD student with limited leave to remain. So the question is whether you in fact did have an NI number at that time, as from what I understand it appears that you may have only obtained one at a later time? Probably best if you clarify.

By the way, if it turns out that officially I don't have HMRC NI employment history, would I still have to state that I did this work at my university, or could I just leave that section blank?

Personally I would include it, but with a clear cover letter explaining with your employer letters to be provided as evidence. The HO will check employment history with HMRC employment history records, that's why it's important that yours can either be verifying through HMRC or be explained if no history exists.

[Intrepid V]

Perhaps because I received my NI number on a letter when I obtained my ILR back in 2004, and they haven't updated the records? (This letter is the only written document I ever had that states my NI number).

Am slightly confused by this underlined statement, or it may be I'm misreading what you attempted to say. Your NI number wouldn't have been issued as part of your ILR application. It's something you need to apply for independently - normally through job centre plus and is not linked to the HO immigration application process in that way. Additionally, I'm assuming you obtained ILR at a later date, not while you were working as a PhD student with limited leave to remain. So the question is whether you in fact did have an NI number at that time, as from what I understand it appears that you may have only obtained one at a later time? Probably best if you clarify.

I was in UK since 1997 as a child (my mother claimed asylum). In 2004 I and my mother were granted ILR due to a government amnesty. I received this via a letter from Home Office. Together with ILR, I received a SEPARATE letter stating my NI number. These documents are separate, of course - I just meant that they were sent at the same time in the same envelope. I guess that was the standard at the time due to that government amnesty - the authority just bundled all the documents together and sent them out to successful claimants.

So to clarify: I had ILR and NI number since 2004. I received them both on the same date. At the time I was 17 years old.

I went to university in 2005 for my first degree. Then started my PhD in 2010.

[cs95tdg]

I was in UK since 1997 as a child (my mother claimed asylum). In 2004 I and my mother were granted ILR due to a government amnesty. I received this via a letter from Home Office. Together with ILR, I received a SEPARATE letter stating my NI number. These documents are separate, of course - I just meant that they were sent at the same time in the same envelope. I guess that was the standard at the time due to that government amnesty - the authority just bundled all the documents together and sent them out to successful claimants.

So to clarify: I had ILR and NI number since 2004. I received them both on the same date. At the time I was 17 years old.

I went to university in 2005 for my first degree. Then started my PhD in 2010.

It certainly helps to have the background as your circumstances are not what would be considered the norm, in terms of how an NI number is issued. Additionally, your immigration history would also help understand the context, i.e. that you were not in the UK as a international student, but rather a ILR holder studying in the UK.

If you are unable to register to login to your personal tax account, I would contact the NI contributions contact number to enquire about how you can do this. One side note, when you say you received your NI number, was it a temporary number? The format of a normal valid NI Number would be XX######X, in the past there have been instances where temporary NI numbers have been issued to students when first commencing employment. Would be good if you can verify what you have, as I don't believe a temporary NI number can be used to register to login to a personal tax account.

A side note, I see you have created multiple topics, all which appear to be related to your naturalisation application. As per the rules of the forum, it would be best if you include all related questions under a single topic.
http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 14404.html
http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 14434.html

[cs95tdg]

Hello. My situation is this. I have been in UK since 1997 (when I was a child). My mother moved here with me then and claimed asylum approximately two weeks later after arriving in UK. Our country's passport allowed us to fly freely into UK (visa was not required).

In 2004, me and my mother were granted ILR due to a certain government amnesty. The ILR was in the form of a letter sent by post. I have never put the ILR stamp in my passport. When I travel abroad, I show them the ILR letter.

(Our individual asylum case had no relevance to the government amnesty, many families that satisified certain criteria received ILR at the time.)

Now I intend to apply for naturalisation. Three questions:

1) The date of arrival into UK. Is this the date when my mother and me physically arrived at the UK border, or when she claimed asylum?

2) How to prove that I was in UK legally from 1997 till 2004 (when I received ILR)? I don't have any official paperwork relevant to me from that time. My mother only kept some "identity"-type document she was given at Home Office when she claimed asylum (this document is double sided, one side has her photograph, the reverse has my photograph, and some basic personal information, and states the date when we arrived in UK). I wouldn't have any legal paperwork dating back to that time anyway, since I was a little child. Is this document enough to prove my legal status in UK prior to receipt of ILR?

3) Should I explicitly clarify (say write a covering letter) explaining my immigration status from 1997-2004, or is that not required? Especially given that I was still 17 years of age when I received ILR in 2004?

I could also try to obtain old school attendance records, but that may take time and I don't really want to waste time and energy obtaining documents that are not required.

1) This would be the date you first entered the UK with your mother.
2) Given your circumstances, you may want to make a SAR (Subject Access Request), to see what the Home Office have recorded against your immigration history. You will need some form of proof that you have Indefinite leave to remain in the UK, as you say you have a letter and have used this letter as proof for the past 12 odd years then it appears that it would serve this purpose. (Just FYI:The norm now would be for a ILR stamp in a passport or a BRP - Biometric Residence Permit)
3) You may wish to do so, if you think it will help clarify certain aspects of your immigration background which differs from the norm and the supporting documents that you will be providing. Purely because this may make it easier for a case worker to follow, cross-check and verify the information you are providing with your application.

[Intrepid V]

Hi to all, so I verified my employment record as a PhD student with both universities. Indeed, I have a record stating that I did ad-hoc work as a demonstrator. However my official occupation is a PhD student. I did not pay any Income tax, but I paid national insurance contributions.

My last job (at my present university finished in May 2015. I am still present as a PhD student here, but not doing any demonstrating work. Officially, all this time I am /was a "Postgraduate Research Student", so this is what I will put in Question 1.45. However, given that I was temporarily employed by the university, what do I put in Questions 1.46 -1.49? Do I leave them blank? Should I enter a tax ref office number for the last work I did in May 2015?

[cs95tdg]

I verified my employment record as a PhD student with both universities. Indeed, I have a record stating that I did ad-hoc work as a demonstrator. However my official occupation is a PhD student. I did not pay any Income tax, but I paid national insurance contributions.

My last job (at my present university finished in May 2015. I am still present as a PhD student here, but not doing any demonstrating work. Officially, all this time I am /was a "Postgraduate Research Student", so this is what I will put in Question 1.45. However, given that I was temporarily employed by the university, what do I put in Questions 1.46 -1.49? Do I leave them blank? Should I enter a tax ref office number for the last work I did in May 2015?

1) Based on what you've mentioned the answer to Q1.45 would appear to be 'Postgraduate Research Student - Demonstrator'. Unless you have a letter with different job role/title, you could mention that.
2) If you have been employed during the past 10 years then you should answer Q's 1.46-1.49. Yes, you can include the latest tax ref office number. The fact that the employment was temporary in nature or that you didn't have to pay income tax, as your earnings were within the tax free allowance, is irrelevant when it comes to the questions on this form. As you have now verified that you have a HMRC employment history reflecting your NI contributions, the HO can independently cross check & verify those records as they deem necessary.