Tier 1 entrepreneur extension wrongly refused. AR advice req

[KNY]

Hi friends,

I am new to this forum but i have been following it for a while now-unfortunately after my application.
I had my initial application approved pre-April 2014 and applied for renewal 30/11/2016. I am in the 200k route. I got their decision yesterday 08/02/17.
I was given all the scores for Investment, maintenance and English but scored 0 for job creation.

I believe the case worker erred because i created 4 jobs for 6 months and submitted the payslips June, july, Aug, Sept Oct Nov and the real time information for all 4 complemented by the accountant's letter.

The Caseworker claim that jobs that have existed for less than 12 months cannot be combined together to make a 12 month period and that he was only able to see payslips from june to Oct.

I am given 14 days to go for AR or leave the country. Please advise on how to tackle the AR, the length of time and other options available.

Thanks in anticipation of your prompt assistance.

KNY

I

[babylondoner]

Did your visa expire the month you applied (that is, November) or the month after you applied (that is, December) ?

If your visa expired in November, maybe the case worker didn't that count the month of November as part of your job creation requirements.

I think I have seen similar scenario on this forum where the final month which happened to coincide with the month the applicant's visa expired wasn't considered as part of the total duration of jobs created.

[KNY]

The Visa expired in December 2016.

[tier1in2014]

I believe all these 6 months jobs were full time . if yes is its case workers error.

In my case we have 5 full time worker for 21 months in total and out of those one employee has worked 7 months part time also which we don't know how they going to count that part time hrs for single part time employee . we have applied this week and waiting for biomatric letters .

[KNY]

The four jobs are for more than 30 hrs a week each.

[babylondoner]

How many hours did each worker clock for the month of November ?

The Visa expired in December 2016.

[KNY]

Each of the 4 jobs clocked more than 30 hours. The least did 125 hours and i have 3180 hours in total. I applied in the evening of Nov 30.
Please can anyone advise if there is still a possibility of judicial review after administrative review? Do one get the result of the AR separately or it only means the application process will continue if one is successful?

Every informed contributions will be appreciated please.

[tier1in2014]

If you have applied on 30 nov eve so that will be date of your application . This could be the reason case worker did not count the nov job in count . Not sure but wait for zimba to be more specific on this .

[KNY]

Okay thanks. The caseworker claimed i did not submit November payslip, whereas i did. The payslip and the RTI showed the number of hours worked for each month including November. The least employer did 125 hours in November while the highest did 140 hours. Zimba and other gurus please help.

[zimba]

The Caseworker claim that jobs that have existed for less than 12 months cannot be combined together to make a 12 month period and that he was only able to see payslips from june to Oct.

Under transitional arrangements this is NOT required, so this could be the case worker's failure to apply transitional arrangements.
However to be able to see a better picture, please list ALL the four employment periods with the exact starting/ending dates which you claimed for job creation on the form.

[KNY]

Thanks Zimba.
Job 1- June 1 2016 till date - 140 hours per month
Job 2- June 1 2016 till date- 140 hours per month
Job 3- June 3 2016 till date- 125 hours per month
Job 4-June 3 2016 till date.- 125 hours per month.

Also any assistance/guidance on the possibility of JR and possibly reapplication?

[zimba]

What is till date ?? I said exact dates you put on the form. What was the end date you put on the form ???

[KNY]

all jobs until 30/11/2016

[zimba]

Job 1- June 1 2016 till 30/11/2016 - 140 hours per month (This is 26 weeks of work with max 30 hours per week = 780 hours only)
Job 2- June 1 2016 till 30/11/2016- 140 hours per month (Same as above)
Job 3- June 3 2016 till 30/11/2016- 125 hours per month (This is less than 26 weeks of work with max 30 hours per week ~ 770 hours only)
Job 4-June 3 2016 till 30/11/2016.- 125 hours per month (Same as above)

Please note that only 30 hours of full time per week is counted, so the total is less than 3120 hours.
I am not sure how case worker calculated as there is no definite guide on this but as I did the calculation on a weekly basis, you seem to have missed the mark very marginally for hours worked. Maybe something around 20 hours or so. It is quite risky to do this as technically the period for Job 3 and Job 4 are less than 6 months

[KNY]

Thanks for your time Zimba and i quite agree with you it is risky but i couldnt help it. I believe a full month score had been given for June and since i pay monthly, that shouldnt be a problem. Hopefully...

Having said that, plan B- can i appeal after the AR, can i reapply? if yes, how soon so that i wont become an over-stayer?
Your usual promt response will be appraciated.

[CR001]

can i appeal after the AR, can i reapply? if yes, how soon so that i wont become an over-stayer?
Your usual promt response will be appraciated.

You can't appeal, PBS appeal rights in country have been removed. If you apply for AR and it is refused, you will have 14 days to reapply.

[KNY]

many thanks. in that case i would be able to claim job creation from June 2016 till Jan 2017 at the earliest.

[CR001]

many thanks.

Also, if you do not apply for AR, you still only have 14 days to reapply, so suggest decide really quickly what you are going to do. There is no longer a 28 day grace period.

[babylondoner]

Kny

The most recent guide states that 120 hours a week is regarded as full time employment.

The caseworker claims she only saw payslips for June to November.

If you are sure you submitted payslips for November, I will suggest you apply for administrative review and highlight the oversight of the case worker.

I do not think the problem is the total hours as calculated by Zimba. The issue is one month's payslip is missing.

[babylondoner]

It seems the caseworker did not apply the transitional agreement to your case.

Maybe she's new to the job.

I will suggest administrative review - carefully prepared with reference to the guidance document.

[zimba]

Apply for AR, make the claim that you created equivalent of 24 months under transitional arrangement and you sent all the payslips until November.
As I showed you marginally missed the 24 months mark but you can try

[softwareluv]

I found same result as zimba when I worked out your total no. of weeks for all of your 4 employees i.e. 103.42 weeks and if you divide it by 52 weeks per year. it works out 1.98 years of employment in total. However, I read guidance says either 30 hours a week or 120 hours a month, and you have created 120 hours a month. So not sure why CW didnt consider that.

From my experience, AR wasnt good choice for me as I knew they will stick to their decision. so I wasted 1 month in AR. But in your case, its to do with calculation of hours and you can simply explain your calculation. But you have to show strong calculation with references to your documents that you submit with application, so they can verify that.
Or just make fresh application with December and January payslips as that should definitely clear all their calculation errors.

Or make AR and while thats under process, make fresh application, if you need some time to prepare it.

Raj.

[KNY]

Thanks guys. I did not only submit the November slips he claimed he did not see, it was also shown clearly in the RTI. I will definitely go for the AR and win by God's grace. The case worker obviously didn't use the transitional arrangement because he stated he could have asked for additional document but it wouldn't change the decision because i cannot add 2 jobs that have existed for less than 12 months to make 1 full job.

[msree]

Hi zimba,

Can I know how HO will calculate Employee StartDate?
a) In FPS states as 06/04/2016
b)Accountant says even employee start date is 01/04/2016 ,Money Soft Software will take default 06/04/2016 in FPS

Thanks,

[msree]

Hi Zimba,

I am going 4 Employess for 6 Months route.
My 4 Employee's Start Date 01/09/2016
And my visa expiry date 04/03/2017

If HO consider Employment From 01/09/2016 - to 04/03/2017 ?then it reaches 185 days (26 weeks 3 days) where i am safe.

Thanks,