Two Businesses

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

1. I dont remember/recall Home Office Reference from my previous application. Is this the number that is on my stamped visa ? Similarly cant recall what is my wife's application ref.

2. Can I request you to do a sanity check on my doc list I am going to provide and mention here if ok ?

Thanks

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

1. I dont remember/recall Home Office Reference from my previous application. Is this the number that is on my stamped visa ? Similarly cant recall what is my wife's application ref.

2. Can I request you to do a sanity check on my doc list I am going to provide and mention here if ok ?

Thanks

[marcnath]

Hi Marcnath

1. I dont remember/recall Home Office Reference from my previous application. Is this the number that is on my stamped visa ? Similarly cant recall what is my wife's application ref.

It says, "If known", so this is not important.

2. Can I request you to do a sanity check on my doc list I am going to provide and mention here if ok ?

Thanks

Go ahead and put your document list. If not me, I am sure others will be happy to help too

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath, Zimba88 and other kind moderators.

Need your valuable comments on following list that I am planning to submit. I am under 200k Tier 1 initial entry route. (Pre April 2014) - Let me know if any red flags or Addition/deletion needed.

Appreciate an early response as planning to apply tomorrow. thanks in advance.

Attribute A - Investment

For Business A1

1. Two sets of Un-audited accounts from 2015/2016 and 2016/2017 for above business with Accountant compilation report
2. Director’s loan agreement stating the terms and conditions of the loan.
3. Original Business bank account statements showing director’s loan transactions – with investment summary
4. Accountant letter confirming the amount of investment in the business.
5. Letter from UK Business Bank confirming that I am the signatory and Director.
6. Current appointment report, filing history & confirmation statement from companies house to show I invested in a UK Business.
7. HMRC CT600 – Completed signed Corporation tax return document form 2015/16 & 2016/17

Attribute B – Registered within 6 Months of Entering the route

For Business A2

1. Current appointment report from Companies house listing myself as Director and date of appointment
2. Companies house Filing History.
3. Confirmation Statement.

Attribute C – Engaged in Business Activity at the time of Application

For Business A1:

1. Current appointment report from Companies house listing myself as Director and date of appointment
2. Companies house Filing History.
3. Confirmation Statement

Attribute D – Job Creation

For Business A1

1. Copies of passport bio pages of 2 British National Employees working for Auto Buddies Ltd
2. Employee RTI / Full Payment Submission (FPS) showing total payments, tax deducted & start date.
3. Duplicate of Employee Payslips for period of employment. (Showing pay rise where given mid year)
4. Letter from certified Accountant confirming net creation of Jobs with details including hourly rates etc.
5. Employee P11 deductions worksheet
6. Current Filing History from Companies house.

Attribute E – English Language

For evidence of English Language you'll find attached:

1. Original Masters Degree – from London. UK
2. Original Academic Transcript of MSc from London. UK

Attribute E – Maintenance

1. My Last 3 Month’s Original Bank statement from Personal HSBC Account meeting the funds requirement.

Total Points being Claimed: 95


Other Supporting Documents

For Business A2:

1. Few Business Purchase Invoices, Sales Invoices, Expense Invoices & Freight Invoices.
2. VAT registration & Payment receipts.
3. Business premises Bills like Council Business Rates bill, Electric, Water & Telephone
4. Business Insurance (covering trade & Employers Liability)
5. Business Professional membership with RMI
6. Personal Accreditation in IMI.
7. Screenshots from Company Website, & Marketing Platforms.
8. My company registration with Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) & Information Commissioner
9. Copy of Business contract with Lloyds Cardnet.
10. Birth Certificate for Dependent.

[marcnath]

Attribute A - Investment

For Business A1

1. Two sets of Un-audited accounts from 2015/2016 and 2016/2017 for above business with Accountant compilation report - OK (only 2016/17 needed though)
2. Director’s loan agreement stating the terms and conditions of the loan. - OK
3. Original Business bank account statements showing director’s loan transactions – with investment summary - OK. Assuming your name is against each transaction.
4. Accountant letter confirming the amount of investment in the business. - Not a requirement. Optional
5. Letter from UK Business Bank confirming that I am the signatory and Director. - OK. But optional - statement is sufficient
6. Current appointment report, filing history & confirmation statement from companies house to show I invested in a UK Business. -OK. Actual requirement is "a printout of a Companies House document showing the address of the registered office in the UK". CAR would satisfy it.
7. HMRC CT600 – Completed signed Corporation tax return document form 2015/16 & 2016/17 - OK

Attribute B – Registered within 6 Months of Entering the route

For Business A2

1. Current appointment report from Companies house listing myself as Director and date of appointment - OK
2. Companies house Filing History. - Optional but part of CAR
3. Confirmation Statement. - Not a requirement. Optional

Attribute C – Engaged in Business Activity at the time of Application

For Business A1:

1. Current appointment report from Companies house listing myself as Director and date of appointment- OK
2. Companies house Filing History. - Optional but part of CAR
3. Confirmation Statement - Not a requirement. Optional

Attribute D – Job Creation

For Business A1

1. Copies of passport bio pages of 2 British National Employees working for Auto Buddies Ltd - OK
2. Employee RTI / Full Payment Submission (FPS) showing total payments, tax deducted & start date. - OK
3. Duplicate of Employee Payslips for period of employment. (Showing pay rise where given mid year) - OK. Only needed for the 24 months being claimed. Any more is optional
4. Letter from certified Accountant confirming net creation of Jobs with details including hourly rates etc. - Not a requirement. Optional
5. Employee P11 deductions worksheet - Not a requirement. Optional
6. Current Filing History from Companies house. - OK

Attribute E – English Language

For evidence of English Language you'll find attached:

1. Original Masters Degree – from London. UK - Not required as you had entry as T1E
2. Original Academic Transcript of MSc from London. UK - Not required as you had entry as T1E

Attribute E – Maintenance

1. My Last 3 Month’s Original Bank statement from Personal HSBC Account meeting the funds requirement. - OK. Double check the dates to make sure that the difference between 1st date and last date listed in the statement is more than 90 days

Total Points being Claimed: 95


Other Supporting Documents - OK

For Business A2:

1. Few Business Purchase Invoices, Sales Invoices, Expense Invoices & Freight Invoices.
2. VAT registration & Payment receipts.
3. Business premises Bills like Council Business Rates bill, Electric, Water & Telephone
4. Business Insurance (covering trade & Employers Liability)
5. Business Professional membership with RMI
6. Personal Accreditation in IMI.
7. Screenshots from Company Website, & Marketing Platforms.
8. My company registration with Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) & Information Commissioner
9. Copy of Business contract with Lloyds Cardnet.
10. Birth Certificate for Dependent.


Good luck !!

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath.

Thank you for being there at the speed of 1000 Mbps

Just a couple of things .

1. Duplicate of Employee Payslips for period of employment. (Showing pay rise where given mid year) - OK. Only needed for the 24 months being claimed. Any more is optional

I only have 12 month each for 2 employees. I hope this is what you are refering to as well. ??

Yes, Business bank statements show my name and I have made a summary of it as well. SHould I mention my account number and sort code of personal banking in my investment summary sheet as well ?

Anything you believe is missing ? Obviously passports, forms, Cover letter, Pics and BRP's are there .

[marcnath]

Hi Marcnath.

Thank you for being there at the speed of 1000 Mbps

Just a couple of things .

1. Duplicate of Employee Payslips for period of employment. (Showing pay rise where given mid year) - OK. Only needed for the 24 months being claimed. Any more is optional

I only have 12 month each for 2 employees. I hope this is what you are refering to as well. ??

Yes, I was referring to a total of 24 months. So it is the same.

Yes, Business bank statements show my name and I have made a summary of it as well. SHould I mention my account number and sort code of personal banking in my investment summary sheet as well ?

Not needed

Anything you believe is missing ? Obviously passports, forms, Cover letter, Pics and BRP's are there .

Not that I can think of.

[alijafri]

Marcnath

Can you please comment on below format for DL. anything that you thing raises a flag ? or needs to be added ?

Its 200k Route - 229,650 actual investment - 230 k loan. Company formed Apr 15, Investment started Oct 15, DL agreement date Sep 15

"

This agreement is made and entered by between Mr ------ (Lender) and -------------- Ltd (Company). Mr -------------- is the only Director and 100% Shareholder of ---------- Ltd.

In consideration of the covenant and condition hereinafter set forth, both Lender and the Company agree as follows:

1 – Terms

This agreement commences from the start of Accounting Period of the Company. The Loan is unsecured and subordinated in favour of third party creditors.

2 – Interest Rate

There is consensus between both the parties that the Directors Loan is “Interest Free”.

3 – Tenure

The tenure of Loan Agreement will be for five years and renewable with the consensus for both the parties depending upon the profitability index of the Company

4 – Loan Security

The Director’s Loan is unsecured and subordinated in favour of third party short term and/or long term creditors of the Company

5 – Loan Amount

The Lender shall make available to the Company a sum of £230,000.00 starting October 2015, which can be drawn down in instalments as required by company. The amounts will be received directly by the Company in Company Business bank account and accounted for against the Directors Loan in Company accounts.

6 – Confidentiality and Ownership

The loan agreement recognises and acknowledges the confidentiality of all financial and other information of the company obtained by Director during the performance of his duties and obligations


Executed this 15th September 2015






On Behalf of Company Lender
Director - -------- Mr ------------

[marcnath]

Marcnath

Can you please comment on below format for DL. anything that you thing raises a flag ? or needs to be added ?

Its 200k Route - 229,650 actual investment - 230 k loan. Company formed Apr 15, Investment started Oct 15, DL agreement date Sep 15

"

This agreement is made and entered by between Mr ------ (Lender) and -------------- Ltd (Company). Mr -------------- is the only Director and 100% Shareholder of ---------- Ltd.

In consideration of the covenant and condition hereinafter set forth, both Lender and the Company agree as follows:

1 – Terms

This agreement commences from the start of Accounting Period of the Company. The Loan is unsecured and subordinated in favour of third party creditors.

2 – Interest Rate

There is consensus between both the parties that the Directors Loan is “Interest Free”.

3 – Tenure

The tenure of Loan Agreement will be for five years and renewable with the consensus for both the parties depending upon the profitability index of the Company

4 – Loan Security

The Director’s Loan is unsecured and subordinated in favour of third party short term and/or long term creditors of the Company

5 – Loan Amount

The Lender shall make available to the Company a sum of £230,000.00 starting October 2015, which can be drawn down in instalments as required by company. The amounts will be received directly by the Company in Company Business bank account and accounted for against the Directors Loan in Company accounts.

6 – Confidentiality and Ownership

The loan agreement recognises and acknowledges the confidentiality of all financial and other information of the company obtained by Director during the performance of his duties and obligations


Executed this 15th September 2015






On Behalf of Company Lender
Director - -------- Mr ------------

Looks fine to me

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

1. I have aligned my documents in a folder with proper tagging, Table of contents and tabs. I have arranged everything in a big box file, however because of pile of documents in it, only thing that cant fit is the Business Bank statements. I have made another file for Bank Statements now and tagged it as well - Just want to ask, since the bank statement file is separate, Can I expect them to pick that file up if its not part of mail pile ? Will it give impression that my documents are distorted ?

2. One of my employees started working from 01/01/16 and other from 01/03/16. But my claim dates are from 01/04/16 because thats when we started submitting FPS. However we did submit old FPS as well as per their actual date of joining. WHich means starting date is only available on FPS of 01/01 and 01/03 respectively (Claim dates are 01/04/16-31/05/17). So this means Alongwith these months FPS, I also have to send FPS/RTI of month that shows start date ? Is this a problem (diff claim date)

THanks

[marcnath]

Hi Marcnath

1. I have aligned my documents in a folder with proper tagging, Table of contents and tabs. I have arranged everything in a big box file, however because of pile of documents in it, only thing that cant fit is the Business Bank statements. I have made another file for Bank Statements now and tagged it as well - Just want to ask, since the bank statement file is separate, Can I expect them to pick that file up if its not part of mail pile ? Will it give impression that my documents are distorted ?

Don't worry. I am sure the case workers are used to this and can handle it
Having said that, in case they talk to up (and it can happen) , it will be troublesome and cause tension, but at least you will have solid grounds for an AR.

2. One of my employees started working from 01/01/16 and other from 01/03/16. But my claim dates are from 01/04/16 because thats when we started submitting FPS. However we did submit old FPS as well as per their actual date of joining. WHich means starting date is only available on FPS of 01/01 and 01/03 respectively (Claim dates are 01/04/16-31/05/17). So this means Alongwith these months FPS, I also have to send FPS/RTI of month that shows start date ? Is this a problem (diff claim date)

THanks

A little confusing, but I think what you are saying is that you are claiming 12 months each for two employees - one from 1/3 and the other from 1/4. The start date from employee that you are claiming from 1/4 is on the FPS of 1/1/16. If that is the case, you will have 25 FPS documents - 24 for the months you are claiming and one additional to show the start date. If so, you are perfectly right.

[alijafri]

For Job, yes thats correct. But I dont have 25 FPS. Because there is only 1 FPS for every month and it shows names of both employees. FPS are not separate as per my accountant. isnt it ?

"Having said that, in case they talk to up (and it can happen) , it will be troublesome and cause tension, but at least you will have solid grounds for an AR."

Can you please elaborate this ?

[marcnath]

For Job, yes thats correct. But I dont have 25 FPS. Because there is only 1 FPS for every month and it shows names of both employees. FPS are not separate as per my accountant. isnt it ?

"Having said that, in case they talk to up (and it can happen) , it will be troublesome and cause tension, but at least you will have solid grounds for an AR."

Can you please elaborate this ?

OK about FPS. I was trying to make clear there seems to be the need of 1 additional FPS to show the start date.

"talk to up" - I typed "s c r e w it up" (without the spaces in the first word) - guess this discussion board software did not like my language and changed it to something else

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

Much appreciate your help. Thank you for providing valuable feedback on various viewpoints.

Hope this all comes to fruition.

Cheers

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

Thanks again for your valuable input.

Some new questions foreseeing future as I want to streamline things before hand:

1. What will be the requirements for ILR for me now ? I am most confused about Job creation even after reading through policy guidance. (applied for entry before April 2014)

2. My brother came on same visa last year so he is on Post Apr 2014 rules. What will be different for him to show in Job creation (for first extension) ?

A. Does he have to employ 2 FT employees only ? No PTimers allowed ?
B. Does employment have to be min for 12 months consecutive ?
C. What if someone leaves the job ? In which case we cant show consecutive 12 months as next one might join 2-3 months from there on ?

THanks

[marcnath]

Hi Marcnath

Thanks again for your valuable input.

Some new questions foreseeing future as I want to streamline things before hand:

1. What will be the requirements for ILR for me now ? I am most confused about Job creation even after reading through policy guidance. (applied for entry before April 2014)

The criteria for your ILR does not change. You still need to create two jobs as defined in the transitional arrangements.

2. My brother came on same visa last year so he is on Post Apr 2014 rules. What will be different for him to show in Job creation (for first extension) ?

A. Does he have to employ 2 FT employees only ? No PTimers allowed ?

No, he can still have PT

B. Does employment have to be min for 12 months consecutive ?

No. There can be gaps in employment. Only the total has to be 12 months.

C. What if someone leaves the job ? In which case we cant show consecutive 12 months as next one might join 2-3 months from there on ?

THanks

Same answer as above.

The key difference is that pre-2014, you just needed to show 104 weeks of full time work. So, if you hired 104 jobs for 1 week each or 1 person for the full 104 weeks (or any combination in between), you would be given the points.
In the new guidance (the rule never changed, only the interpretation of the rule changed), they follow the law strictly - it has to be 2 separate jobs, each with a minimum of 52 weeks.
In the new guidance, the same restriction also comes for PT. Each of the PT jobs you combine has to have lasted 52 weeks each.

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

Thanks again for your valuable input.

Some new questions foreseeing future as I want to streamline things before hand:

1. What will be the requirements for ILR for me now ? I am most confused about Job creation even after reading through policy guidance. (applied for entry before April 2014)

The criteria for your ILR does not change. You still need to create two jobs as defined in the transitional arrangements.

- I have already created 2 FT jobs - They are still working and will keep working as I dont see them leaving (unless they don't like me anymore ) But for purely documents/ILR purpose, does it mean I have to continue employing them ? If so, then for how much time ? another 12 months each ? (as ILR is for 24 months)

Also, my ILR will also be based on transitional rules ?

2. My brother came on same visa last year so he is on Post Apr 2014 rules. What will be different for him to show in Job creation (for first extension) ?

A. Does he have to employ 2 FT employees only ? No PTimers allowed ?

No, he can still have PT

B. Does employment have to be min for 12 months consecutive ?

No. There can be gaps in employment. Only the total has to be 12 months.

C. What if someone leaves the job ? In which case we cant show consecutive 12 months as next one might join 2-3 months from there on ?

THanks

Same answer as above.

The key difference is that pre-2014, you just needed to show 104 weeks of full time work. So, if you hired 104 jobs for 1 week each or 1 person for the full 104 weeks (or any combination in between), you would be given the points.
In the new guidance (the rule never changed, only the interpretation of the rule changed), they follow the law strictly - it has to be 2 separate jobs, each with a minimum of 52 weeks.
In the new guidance, the same restriction also comes for PT. Each of the PT jobs you combine has to have lasted 52 weeks each.

- So for this you mean, in post 2014, we can combine jobs, do PT , with gaps but incl all gaps and PT , that job should be at least 52 months ? (could be 5 PT ppl, worked 52 weeks over a period of 24 months ?

is it 52 weeks each or combined ?

Thanks

[marcnath]

- So for this you mean, in post 2014, we can combine jobs, do PT , with gaps but incl all gaps and PT , that job should be at least 52 months ?

I think you meant 52 weeks, not 52 months.

(could be 5 PT ppl, worked 52 weeks over a period of 24 months ?

is it 52 weeks each or combined ?

Yes - if you had 5 PT each of whom worked for 52 weeks over the visa period (36 months for 1st extension) and together they worked 30 hours per week.

[alijafri]

Hi

Yes, I meant 52 weeks.

1. So repeating my previous question which I think you missed as it was quoted, I have already created 2 FT jobs for my extension - They are still working and will keep working as I dont see them leaving (unless they don't like me anymore ) But for purely documents/ILR purpose, does it mean I have to continue employing them ? If so, then for how much time ? another 12 months each or for full 48 months ? (as ILR is for 24 months)

2. Also, my ILR will also be based on transitional rules - just like my 1st extension ?

3. JOb creation/continuity will now be the only evidence that will be needed for ILR if hopefully all goes well for 1st extension ?

[marcnath]

Hi

Yes, I meant 52 weeks.

1. So repeating my previous question which I think you missed as it was quoted, I have already created 2 FT jobs for my extension - They are still working and will keep working as I dont see them leaving (unless they don't like me anymore ) But for purely documents/ILR purpose, does it mean I have to continue employing them ? If so, then for how much time ? another 12 months each or for full 48 months ? (as ILR is for 24 months)

No, it does not mean you have to keep employing them specifically. You can create new jobs during your extension period. You just need a total of 104 weeks.

2. Also, my ILR will also be based on transitional rules - just like my 1st extension ?

Yes

3. JOb creation/continuity will now be the only evidence that will be needed for ILR if hopefully all goes well for 1st extension ?

More or less - that is the most critical one.

You still need to show that you are in business (CAR), that you are a genuine entrepreneur (same uncertain guidelines) and some new ones like the Life in the UK test.

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

Much clear now. However still confused on one point.

1. So for my second extension (ILR) - Is continuity in employment essential ? Like 12 months continuous ONLY ? Cant have breaks ? - I read on someone else's thread thread that it HAS TO BE continuous 12 months with no break - I dont think its possible with high iteration rate and HO not understanding that.

2. For Post 2014, what I have understood is at least 2 FT jobs for 12 months (continuous or non continuous) - or PT jobs accordingly (continuous or non continuous) ?

[marcnath]

I am clearly not being clear for some reason. But I will try one more time.

Hi Marcnath

Much clear now. However still confused on one point.

1. So for my second extension (ILR) - Is continuity in employment essential ? Like 12 months continuous ONLY ? Cant have breaks ? - I read on someone else's thread thread that it HAS TO BE continuous 12 months with no break - I dont think its possible with high iteration rate and HO not understanding that.

The rules for the 2nd extension/ILR on job creation is EXACTLY THE SAME as for your 1st extension. Ignore anything you may have heard/read anywhere else !!!! No continuity needed - you can mix part-time, full time, different jobs etc as much as you like as long as you meet 104 WEEKS of 30 hours each.

2. For Post 2014, what I have understood is at least 2 FT jobs for 12 months (continuous or non continuous) - or PT jobs accordingly (continuous or non continuous) ?

Yes correct.

I have to make a slight change to what I said in response to your scenario on 5 PT people. I answered as though it was 5 PT jobs. Jobs and people are different.

For example, with 5 PT people, this following combination will still be accepted as the equivalent of 1 FT job for 52 weeks.
Job1 - Employee 1 - 15 hrs/week - 52 weeks (Jul to Jun next year)
Job2 - Employee 2 - 15 hrs/week - 13 weeks (Jan to Mar)
Job2 - Employee 3 - 15 hrs/week - 13 weeks (Apr to Jun)
Job2 - Employee 4 - 15 hrs/week - 13 weeks (Oct to Dec)
Job2 - Employee 5 - 15 hrs/week - 13 weeks (Jan to Mar next year)

The important thing is JOBS have to be there for 52 weeks. Employees can come and go.

[alijafri]

Hi Marcnath

Thank you and that has cleared it up all. Much appreciated.

I was just reviewing the application I submitted, in Application I think i did a tiny mistake.

For English Language section, I submitted my UK MS degree and transcript and checked "degree taught in english form" instead of checking "evidence previously submitted"

Obviously I did fill in all relevant form pages form there on and did provide my degree and transcript.

Hope I havent made a blunder here ??

[marcnath]

Hi Marcnath

Thank you and that has cleared it up all. Much appreciated.

I was just reviewing the application I submitted, in Application I think i did a tiny mistake.

For English Language section, I submitted my UK MS degree and transcript and checked "degree taught in english form" instead of checking "evidence previously submitted"

Obviously I did fill in all relevant form pages form there on and did provide my degree and transcript.

Hope I havent made a blunder here ??

That should be fine.

[alijafri]

Hi Marc, Zimba

I need your expert opinion on another matter -

My friend is on Ent Visa as well. His first ext will be due next year. He is the only director of his business and being that he has already invested 190k in his business (200k route). He has a potential investor interested in his business now and that person wants to be a joint director as well to safeguard his investment. (shareholding needs to be agreed yet).

1. If they plan to go ahead with getting that person added as a Director to the business, how will this affect my friends Extension application ?

2. Any other thing to keep an eye for in case of above arrangement, so we can easily put his extension case once time comes ?

Thanks and appreciate your help.