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The "relevant period" is the period of employment. So, for example, if you worked one job from from January 2010-March 2011 and then your next job ran from December 2011-April 2013, you would need a set of documents for each period of employment, verifying the dates. If you've been working in the UK for more than 10 years, you don't need to provide evidence for any job you had more than 10 years ago.robtek wrote:1. First one is regarding my employment. The guidelines says :
You must provide details of all your National Insurance contributions made for your current and previous employment during the past 10 years. To support this claim evidence can be in the form of payslips, P60s covering the relevant period, or a letter(s) from the employer(s) confirming you have worked for them, from the start and finish date.
How many years mean the "relevant period" - is it 5, 6 years or whole period being in the UK?
My guess is that they're double-checking that you've had settled status in the UK for at least a year.robtek wrote:2. Second question is regarding residency requirement.
I've read the statement from the council website:
These must cover the five or three year residency requirement. You should produce original copies of these documents (if applicable).
Please note. If you are from the European union and exercise Treaty Rights, you will need to evidence six years, not five.
I was thinking since I got PR card I need to only proof the last five years. What is your opinion?
Regards
Chris
I don't know why the date on your PR card isn't evidence enough, but it's best to do what's recommended (especially if you're using a Nationality Checking Service) to avoid arguing with a casework and also to avoid being asked to provide more information later on.Page 9 wrote:If you are a national of a country which is a member state of the EEA or Switzerland, or the family member of such a person, you will automatically have permanent residence status after exercising EEA free movement rights in the UK for any continuous period of 5 years ending on or after 30 April 2006. You should apply for a permanent residence card to prove that you hold that status before applying for citizenship.
But remember that, unless you are married to or the civil partner of a British citizen, you should normally have held permanent resident status for 12 months before applying for naturalisation. This means that you may need to wait until you have been in the United Kingdom for 6 years before you can apply. When you apply for a permanent residence document the evidence that you supply for your EEA(PR) application must be for a 5 year period that ended at least a year before you want to apply for citizenship.
For example: If you apply for Permanent Residence on 1 June 2017 and want to apply for citizenship once that application is decided, you should send evidence that shows you were exercising Treaty rights as a qualified person or family member from 1 June 2011 to 1 June 2016.
So it means I need to proof any period of employment up to 10 years. What if company doesn't exist and I don't have a P60. Can I provide P45 instead? (I did that when applied for PR card but in AN booklet doesn't mention about P45) . If I worked from Jan-Aug should I provide 8 payslips or just 1st and last payslip from that period?Tea_Rocket wrote: January 2010-March 2011 and then your next job ran from December 2011-April 2013, you would need a set of documents for each period of employment, verifying the dates. If you've been working in the UK for more than 10 years, you don't need to provide evidence for any job you had more than 10 years ago.
Provide of evidence of 6 years was when someone applies for Naturalization without having PR card.Tea_Rocket wrote:My guess is that they're double-checking that you've had settled status in the UK for at least a year.
I don't know why the date on your PR card isn't evidence enough, but it's best to do what's recommended (especially if you're using a Nationality Checking Service) to avoid arguing with a casework and also to avoid being asked to provide more information later on.
I would send/bring any and all evidence that you have, including the P45 and the payslips.robtek wrote:So it means I need to proof any period of employment up to 10 years. What if company doesn't exist and I don't have a P60. Can I provide P45 instead? (I did that when applied for PR card but in AN booklet doesn't mention about P45) . If I worked from Jan-Aug should I provide 8 payslips or just 1st and last payslip from that period?
First of all, it is no longer possible for EEA nationals to apply for naturalisation without a PR card. Secondly, I didn't write guidelines or your council's website. If you want to ignore their advice, then you are free to do so, and submit your application with evidence of your residency for the last five years only. However, I don't see what it hurts to supply the extra information if you have it.robtek wrote:Provide of evidence of 6 years was when someone applies for Naturalization without having PR card.
The evidence that I was exercising Treaty rights for 5 years has been proved when applied for PR card.
The PR card for EEA nationals is issued with a letter that states when permanent residence is deemed to have been achieved. For example, a card issued in July this year may be accompanied with a letter stating the permanent residence was achieved in July 2016 which would mean the holder could apply immediately for BC. The date on the letter, NOT the date on the card is the correct one and the card AND the letter should be sent with with form AN because the letter is PROOF.Tea_Rocket wrote:I would send/bring any and all evidence that you have, including the P45 and the payslips.robtek wrote:So it means I need to proof any period of employment up to 10 years. What if company doesn't exist and I don't have a P60. Can I provide P45 instead? (I did that when applied for PR card but in AN booklet doesn't mention about P45) . If I worked from Jan-Aug should I provide 8 payslips or just 1st and last payslip from that period?
Since PR cards do not include the date that PR was acquired—only the date that they were issued*—your council might be telling you to provide the six years' worth of evidence so that you can establish that you've held settled status for a year before naturalising.robtek wrote:Provide of evidence of 6 years was when someone applies for Naturalization without having PR card.
The evidence that I was exercising Treaty rights for 5 years has been proved when applied for PR card.
I assume you are referring to the requirement on form AN to give your employment history during the past 10 years. Actually what the HO would be most interested in is your employment history during the 5-year QP (and even that primarily only for tax purposes).dhoms wrote:I am filling form AN and would appreciate advice please.
About 8 years ago I did a couple of jobs (much less than 10 (not 20) hours per week in total for both jobs) when I was a student. The problem is that I don't remember my employment details (address, dates, etc.). I have no P60s for these jobs and I requested a copy of my employment history but it does not show these jobs. I am unable to contact my employer at that time. The best information I can give on the form is a very broad date range and employer name together with a note explaining my case. Could you please advise whether there is anything else I should do?
Many thanks.
dontringthebell wrote:Hi all kindly weigh on my situation below.
2007 June came in as Work Permit holder, applied for HSMP in Feb 2008, got it in April, 2008. Left in April 2010 on expiry, did not apply for extension. During my time under HSMP worked sporadically.
2010 Sep came in as Tier 2 dependent. Worked for two years until 2012 Nov, after birth of child due to short maternity leave provided to wife, gave up career and have been house husband/stay at home dad.
2016 Mar got my ILR smoothly.
In AN FORM,
1.50 Employment history in UK during past 10 years, or since date of entry if you have been here for less than 10 years.
However, the very next section as per guidance notes namely
2.1 Enter the day you first arrived with a view to stay in the UK on a long term basis.
Truth is I got married in 2007 Jan used the first stay mainly enjoying life in UK and went back. However, second time over was a more thought out decision since my wife got a really good opportunity in terms of her career.
1. Should I use the second entry date as the answer and hence provide the work experience details from that time? Yes and no. Yes, you may use the second date (Sep 2010) as the entry date because this is when presumably you entered the UK with a view to settlement. And no, you may not shorten your employment history below 10 years. The reason the Home Office wants to know about your employment history is NOT to pass judgment on anyone's life choices - I've seen people naturalised you were unemployed and on benefits for years as an ILR. There's nothing in the British Nationality Act 1981 or the Nationality Instructions that regards employment as relevant. Your employment period IS however relevant to the good character assessment, in that UKVI will make enquiries with HMRC that you have fully complied with your tax obligations during the preceding 10 years. That's all.
2. Would being unemployed for last five years affect my application in any adverse way? Nope, as per the above. Once you have obtained settlement/ILR, your employment situation is out of the picture.
3. My passport expired in 2017 Feb, would that be an issue? Technically, unless you are applying on the basis of EU law, you don't have to submit a valid passport, provided your Biometric Residence Permit is in-date. What ID document did you use for the Life in the UK test? You can use a driving licence as proof of identity as well, for example. But what stops you from renewing the passport? Is it because your country of origin doesn't allow dual citizenship and you see no point in renewing it?
4. What evidence do I need to provide for my stay in UK ( most important for time since expiry of passport). So that would cover February 2017 to present only? And you're a stay at home dad? Given that your passport hasn't been cancelled (I assume), it is unlikely you would have travelled anyway. However, to comply with the "alternative evidence of residence" requirement, best submit a letter confirming receipt of child benefit for this financial year. If you don't have that or correspondence from another government department indicating your presence in the UK (maybe a council tax bill in your or joint names?), you are under the Nationality Instructions free to submit any other evidence you regard as relevant (despite what the NCS likes to tell people), such as utility bills, bank statements.
5. In 1.2 should I leave blank and state seperately my passport expired ? Type in your last passport number and put underneath in brackets "(last passport, expired dd/02/2017)".
6. Everything is same for my wife except that she has been on constant employment from Oct 2010 & carries valid Indian passport. Is your wife applying to naturalise as well?
I saw some having one or two of the concerns above however, none with combination of all. Kindly direct instruct & suggest.
The gap is not as such an issue provided you can demonstrate both factual and legal residence. The bank statement should be enough to show you were factually in the UK during that period.robtek wrote:Hi, question regarding employment.
I am EU national and I had 3 months (Sept - Nov 2011) gap history for the last 6 years.
At that time I was in UK and only confirmation of that period is bank statement.
Should I wait 4 months to prove 6 years of continuously work or the gap is not the issue?
The Council has simply failed to update its website. Prior to the coming into force of the British Nationality (General) (Amendment No 3) Regulations 2015 in November of that year, it was possible to apply without a Document Certifying Perm Res (for EEA nationals) or Permanent Resident Card (for non-EEA family members) So back then, both NCS and HO would have needed to see all of that paperwork listed on the council website (which made the process long-winded and complex, hence the change in the law). This documentation is not required now.Tea_Rocket wrote:I would send/bring any and all evidence that you have, including the P45 and the payslips.robtek wrote:So it means I need to proof any period of employment up to 10 years. What if company doesn't exist and I don't have a P60. Can I provide P45 instead? (I did that when applied for PR card but in AN booklet doesn't mention about P45) . If I worked from Jan-Aug should I provide 8 payslips or just 1st and last payslip from that period?
First of all, it is no longer possible for EEA nationals to apply for naturalisation without a PR card. Secondly, I didn't write guidelines or your council's website. If you want to ignore their advice, then you are free to do so, and submit your application with evidence of your residency for the last five years only. However, I don't see what it hurts to supply the extra information if you have it.robtek wrote:Provide of evidence of 6 years was when someone applies for Naturalization without having PR card.
The evidence that I was exercising Treaty rights for 5 years has been proved when applied for PR card.
Since PR cards do not include the date that PR was acquired—only the date that they were issued*—your council might be telling you to provide the six years' worth of evidence so that you can establish that you've held settled status for a year before naturalising. While the issue date of your card might be a year ago or more, some people will be applying for naturalisation as soon as they receive their PR cards (and on the basis of having held permanent residence well before the date on the card), hence the instructions. My guess is they're trying to prevent the situation where the Home Office has to ask applicants to send more documents.
Finally, you should keep in mind that the laws that apply to naturalisation are completely different from the laws that apply to ILR/PR, so possession of settled status is not evidence that you meet the other requirements for naturalisation, even when they overlap with the ones for settlement.
*At least, this is what I have gleaned from Google. I am non-EEA, so I don't actually know what is and isn't on a permanent residence card; however the ones I've seen online look like my ILR card.
The AN form requires to prove the last 5 years and yes I have continuity of residency and work during that period.Indguru90 wrote:The gap is not as such an issue provided you can demonstrate both factual and legal residence. The bank statement should be enough to show you were factually in the UK during that period.robtek wrote:Hi, question regarding employment.
I am EU national and I had 3 months (Sept - Nov 2011) gap history for the last 6 years.
At that time I was in UK and only confirmation of that period is bank statement.
Should I wait 4 months to prove 6 years of continuously work or the gap is not the issue?
To show legal residence, you have to show you were exercising one or more Treaty rights for those four months, as a worker, self-employed person, jobseeker, student or self-sufficient person. If you were a jobseeker, in addition to the bank statement submit either proof of registration with JobCentre plus/private employment agency, or two copies of applications/rejection letters/interview invites. If you were self-sufficient, you must show (a) sufficient funds for those four months (around £2,400 in total) and (b) comprehensive, private sickness insurance or a non-UK European Health Insurance Card (EHIC).
If you don't fall within either of these two categories, then your residence was technically unlawful and does not qualify for Permanent Residence (I am assuming, based on the info provided, that you'd not qualify for retained worker status - did you work for more than 1 year in the UK before 2011?). In that case, your eligibility for naturalisation would not arise until November 2017. In any event, you have to get a Document Certifying Perm Residence prior to filing form AN.
So you'll presumably make a joint application. The evidence she provides in support of her residence will corroborate yours and vice versa. As long as she has passports covering the preceding 5 years she won't need alternative residence documentation. I advise you to apply using the Nationality Checking Service in your local authority,dontringthebell wrote:Indguru90 Thanks very very much for your advice, guidance and comments. Following is what I would like to add.
1. Should I use the second entry date as the answer and hence provide the work experience details from that time? Yes and no. Yes, you may use the second date (Sep 2010) as the entry date because this is when presumably you entered the UK with a view to settlement. And no, you may not shorten your employment history below 10 years. The reason the Home Office wants to know about your employment history is NOT to pass judgment on anyone's life choices - I've seen people naturalised you were unemployed and on benefits for years as an ILR. There's nothing in the British Nationality Act 1981 or the Nationality Instructions that regards employment as relevant. Your employment period IS however relevant to the good character assessment, in that UKVI will make enquiries with HMRC that you have fully complied with your tax obligations during the preceding 10 years. That's all.
I don't intend to hide, however, it's true I don't have means of procuring that data, don't have access to those documents anymore, some destroyed some don't have them. Also, the decision to close the limited company was so abrupt that I couldn't do it in the best possible way and it had to be dissolved. When I checked my NI contributions under my gov data, some years are not full but I wasn't employed, would that be an issue? Also, I have a clear statement with HMRC, even have a letter to that effect stating I have no dues with them. If you have already obtained your full HMRC/NIC data, as you seem to have done, then you should declare the employers that are reflected on your HMRC record over the past 10 years. You don't need to go over and beyond that, but as UKVI will check your HMRC record anyway, they will see the same information that you have. Does that make sense? As for the ltd you're referring to, were you a director of that company? As for having years without work/NI contributions, that does not matter. As you point out, HMRC have confirmed you have paid your tax. You can include the HMRC letter, but UKVI will check with them anyway.
3. My passport expired in 2017 Feb, would that be an issue? Technically, unless you are applying on the basis of EU law, you don't have to submit a valid passport, provided your Biometric Residence Permit is in-date. What ID document did you use for the Life in the UK test? You can use a driving licence as proof of identity as well, for example. But what stops you from renewing the passport? Is it because your country of origin doesn't allow dual citizenship and you see no point in renewing it?
I'm not applying on the basis of EU Law. I used my passport which was in effect at the time for LITUK test. My ILR BRP is valid for next 10 years. Don't have driving licence. I would have no requirement of passport after naturalisation hence not applying for it. Use your expired passport and valid BRP as proof of identity in that case, if you don't intend to renew it. That combination proves your identity and nationality sufficiently for AN purposes. This has been discussed previously as well, see british-citizenship/applying-for-britis ... 88453.html
4. What evidence do I need to provide for my stay in UK ( most important for time since expiry of passport). So that would cover February 2017 to present only? And you're a stay at home dad? Given that your passport hasn't been cancelled (I assume), it is unlikely you would have travelled anyway. However, to comply with the "alternative evidence of residence" requirement, best submit a letter confirming receipt of child benefit for this financial year. If you don't have that or correspondence from another government department indicating your presence in the UK (maybe a council tax bill in your or joint names?), you are under the Nationality Instructions free to submit any other evidence you regard as relevant (despite what the NCS likes to tell people), such as utility bills, bank statements.
Don't get any benefits and don't intend too. Did not travel and don't intend to until I get my British passport. In terms of letters from govt departments I have some correspondence from HMRC which they have been sending with regards to the information I requested. Also I applied for driving licence and then cancelled it because I didn't want to post my BRP in the post at this crucial time. Ok, if you don't have a letter indicating your presence during the Feb 2017-present period, enclose one or two of the HMRC letters and a utility bill or something similar. The caseworker needs to be satisfied that you spent no more than 90 (de facto 100) days out of country during the preceding 12 months.
Your expired but uncancelled passports plus official HMRC/utility/bank correspondence should suffice.
UKVI have access to landing card records on the Warehouse database and can request eBorders advance passenger data from the Border Force if required.
6. Everything is same for my wife except that she has been on constant employment from Oct 2010 & carries valid Indian passport. Is your wife applying to naturalise as well?
Yes she is applying for the naturalisation with me.
If you were accepted for EEA(PR) purposes, then you have absolutely nothing to worry about on that front. You're right that for naturalisation purposes, only the previous five (not six) years matter. I'd be surprised if the NCS even took a peek at the documentation requested on their website (which, as I said in a previous post, is presumably still from before November 2015), let alone forward it to the Home Office. All the caseworker will need to see is that you obtained freedom from immigration time restrictions/PR at least 12 months ago, and that you were physically present over the past 5 years.robtek wrote:The AN form requires to prove the last 5 years and yes I have continuity of residency and work during that period.Indguru90 wrote:The gap is not as such an issue provided you can demonstrate both factual and legal residence. The bank statement should be enough to show you were factually in the UK during that period.robtek wrote:Hi, question regarding employment.
I am EU national and I had 3 months (Sept - Nov 2011) gap history for the last 6 years.
At that time I was in UK and only confirmation of that period is bank statement.
Should I wait 4 months to prove 6 years of continuously work or the gap is not the issue?
To show legal residence, you have to show you were exercising one or more Treaty rights for those four months, as a worker, self-employed person, jobseeker, student or self-sufficient person. If you were a jobseeker, in addition to the bank statement submit either proof of registration with JobCentre plus/private employment agency, or two copies of applications/rejection letters/interview invites. If you were self-sufficient, you must show (a) sufficient funds for those four months (around £2,400 in total) and (b) comprehensive, private sickness insurance or a non-UK European Health Insurance Card (EHIC).
If you don't fall within either of these two categories, then your residence was technically unlawful and does not qualify for Permanent Residence (I am assuming, based on the info provided, that you'd not qualify for retained worker status - did you work for more than 1 year in the UK before 2011?). In that case, your eligibility for naturalisation would not arise until November 2017. In any event, you have to get a Document Certifying Perm Residence prior to filing form AN.
The 3 months gap is related to the period happened over 5 years and 7 months ago. I had sufficient amount of money (over £7000) but not private sickness insurance however that 3 months gap has been accepted by caseworker and granted of Document Certifying Perm Residence.
Based on information provided above should I apply for AN with no worries?
Your honesty is commendable. Am I correct in inferring from your post that you have not yet received your full data set from HMRC? If you feel that the HMRC data is incomplete and that you should make further disclosure on your naturalisation application, here are a couple of points:dontringthebell wrote:Indguru90 once again, thanks for your guidance. I'm not quoting in order to shorten my post.
1. Yes I have requested Data, though, I doubt they would have my employer data, date of joining & leaving, duration I worked with an employer, payslips etc, might get some P60s though.Form AN does not require you to give all of this information. As long as you can give the month (e.g. "Mar 09") that is fine.
You won't need to state your salary for previous employments. Preferably you should give the name of your employer, if they no longer exist, write "dissolved" or something to similar effect in the "employer address"
section of question 1.50. Also a record for what was supposed to be paid and what was paid. I say this because they have sent me the partial record. And you don't expect further data from HMRC?And thats all I can see, though its also true what they have sent is only for the period for my limited company. Does that mean I should only attach what they sent me for my limited company, because I don't think I can summarise it better than they have on these letters/yearly statements.You can enclose whatever you think is relevant to the application, but I don't see much point in doing so, given the very limited information asked for under question 1.50. But see my comments below.
My worry still is I don't want to be perceived as someone hiding or misrepresenting, funny enough when I don't even have that information. This is how many applicants feel about tracing back their absences over the past five years... pretty common!
I think all other points are now covered and in alignment to your responses earlier. Thanks for your wishes and cooperation.Fabs.
Do I need to provide all employment evidence since I came to UK (7 years) as per guidelines:Indguru90 wrote:If you were accepted for EEA(PR) purposes, then you have absolutely nothing to worry about on that front. You're right that for naturalisation purposes, only the previous five (not six) years matter. I'd be surprised if the NCS even took a peek at the documentation requested on their website (which, as I said in a previous post, is presumably still from before November 2015), let alone forward it to the Home Office. All the caseworker will need to see is that you obtained freedom from immigration time restrictions/PR at least 12 months ago, and that you were physically present over the past 5 years.robtek wrote:The AN form requires to prove the last 5 years and yes I have continuity of residency and work during that period.Indguru90 wrote:The gap is not as such an issue provided you can demonstrate both factual and legal residence. The bank statement should be enough to show you were factually in the UK during that period.robtek wrote:Hi, question regarding employment.
I am EU national and I had 3 months (Sept - Nov 2011) gap history for the last 6 years.
At that time I was in UK and only confirmation of that period is bank statement.
Should I wait 4 months to prove 6 years of continuously work or the gap is not the issue?
To show legal residence, you have to show you were exercising one or more Treaty rights for those four months, as a worker, self-employed person, jobseeker, student or self-sufficient person. If you were a jobseeker, in addition to the bank statement submit either proof of registration with JobCentre plus/private employment agency, or two copies of applications/rejection letters/interview invites. If you were self-sufficient, you must show (a) sufficient funds for those four months (around £2,400 in total) and (b) comprehensive, private sickness insurance or a non-UK European Health Insurance Card (EHIC).
If you don't fall within either of these two categories, then your residence was technically unlawful and does not qualify for Permanent Residence (I am assuming, based on the info provided, that you'd not qualify for retained worker status - did you work for more than 1 year in the UK before 2011?). In that case, your eligibility for naturalisation would not arise until November 2017. In any event, you have to get a Document Certifying Perm Residence prior to filing form AN.
The 3 months gap is related to the period happened over 5 years and 7 months ago. I had sufficient amount of money (over £7000) but not private sickness insurance however that 3 months gap has been accepted by caseworker and granted of Document Certifying Perm Residence.
Based on information provided above should I apply for AN with no worries?
So all you will need is:
- Your current passport or national identity card as proof of EEA nationality (plus any other ID doc you used for the Life in the Uk test)
- Your EEA(PR)/DCPR as proof of settlement
- Life in the UK test certificate and language proof
- Evidence of five years' physical residence in the UK, such as letters from employers indicating dates of employment, letters from gov't departments confirming receipts of benefits, etc.
That should be all.
UKVI will NOT go further into your Treaty rights history (the only exception would be - and that doesn't apply to your case on the facts stated - where an EEA nationals immigration history casts doubt on their satisfying the good character requirement. I wouldn't worry about that).
No. Evidence of employment is required neither for 7 years nor for the 5-year Qualifying Period itself. However, evidence of employment CAN be used to evidence physical presence in the UK. See explanation below:robtek wrote:
Do I need to provide all employment evidence since I came to UK (7 years) as per guidelines:
You must provide details of all your National Insurance contributions made for your current and previous employment during the past 10 years. To support this claim evidence can be in the form of payslips, P60s covering the relevant period, or a letter(s) from the employer(s) confirming you have worked for them, from the start and finish date.
I heard that NCS take only last 5 years of proof employment and not interested for the period above 5 years.