Surinder Singh still open?

[sadmanonatrain]

Is this route still technically open until March 2019? The last month, one can apply for a family permit for a spouse (in my case)?

There's a lot of confusing news as to what the....PM is saying with the Brexit negotiations. Imagine we went this route, in the last day of the last month we got a successful application to enter the UK with the family permit, would my wife be able to stay and eventually gain UK residence after the required no. years? I've read there's a supposed cut off point?

Thanks for your time if you reply.

[gillacious_505]

There is still ambiguity on this. Technically UK is obliged to follow all EU law until brexit. As per the policy document, EU national and their family members coming before the specified cut off date would have a settled status. The ones coming after that the specified date wont have a settled status . They would have to change their status as per UK law after the brexit.

This can be made more liberal depending on how hard EU goes on this topic in the negotiations.

[sadmanonatrain]

There is still ambiguity on this. Technically UK is obliged to follow all EU law until brexit. As per the policy document, EU national and their family members coming before the specified cut off date would have a settled status. The ones coming after that the specified date wont have a settled status . They would have to change their status as per UK law after the brexit.

This can be made more liberal depending on how hard EU goes on this topic in the negotiations.

Yeah as I suspected. Thanks for your opinion. I guess we and others have to await events for more details right(?).

We plan to enter using the 'human rights breaking' (high income requirement) UK visa first and if I wouldn't of gotten work of the same income I have now in Japan, we would (or not) try the EU way.

Man I wanted to Corbyn to win so badly. I couldn't believe a pledge in their manifesto was to scrap the income requirement and base it on something else.

[Richard W]

There is still ambiguity on this. Technically UK is obliged to follow all EU law until brexit. As per the policy document, EU national and their family members coming before the specified cut off date would have a settled status. The ones coming after that the specified date wont have a settled status .

Unless Sadmanonatrain is a dual national, I see no evidence that the proposals for EU citizens and their families would apply to him.

[sadmanonatrain]

There is still ambiguity on this. Technically UK is obliged to follow all EU law until brexit. As per the policy document, EU national and their family members coming before the specified cut off date would have a settled status. The ones coming after that the specified date wont have a settled status .

Unless Sadmanonatrain is a dual national, I see no evidence that the proposals for EU citizens and their families would apply to him.

Hi, thanks for replying and sorry for being a necromancer by bringing the dead thread back to life. Could you explain what you mean? I'm a British Citizen who would be excerising his right as an 'EU' citizen to live and work in another EU country (R.Ireland for example). I would then 'sponsor' my family member (who would happen to be the spouse of an 'EU citizen' to return to the UK, as it were.

Are you saying any changes wont affect me because I'm not actually/technically an EU citizen?

Forgive my naiveness. This whole route would be our second choice most likely anyway. But it's good to know if it'll be open or not.

[Richard W]

Are you saying any changes wont affect me because I'm not actually/technically an EU citizen?

Yes. The EU proposal covers ("or having worked") Surinder Singh families:

20. The Agreement should safeguard the status and rights derived from Union law at the withdrawal date, including those the enjoyment of which will intervene at a later date (e.g. rights related to old age pensions) both for EU27 citizens residing (or having resided) and/or working (or having worked) in the United Kingdom and for United Kingdom citizens residing (or having resided) and/or working (or having worked) in one of the Member States of the EU27...

21(a). Definition of the persons to be covered: the personal scope should be the same as that of Directive 2004/38 (both economically active, i.e. workers and self-employed, and inactive persons, who have resided in the UK or EU27 before the withdrawal date, and their family members who accompany or join them at any point in time before or after the withdrawal date). In addition, the personal scope should include persons covered by Regulation 883/2004 (e.g. frontier workers).

The British proposal does not:

6. The Government undertakes to treat EU citizens in the UK according to the principles
below, in the expectation that the EU will offer reciprocal treatment for UK nationals resident in
its member states:

Its glossary defines

EU citizen: Refers to any person who holds EU citizenship as established under Article 20
(1) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union, save that for current purposes,
persons who are EU citizens solely by way of their British nationality are excluded from the
scope of this term....

While this appears to include dual nationals (I hope this is not merely a removable drafting error), it offers no scope to beneficiaries of the Surinder Singh ruling.

Neither proposal protects the guardians of British citizens in the UK (Zambrano).

[sadmanonatrain]

Could someone please answer a couple of questions I have in regards to this.

Firstly the BBC's take on Mrs May's speech in Florence:

What's the significance? This is important. It means that during a transition period - the prime minister suggested two years as a possibility - all the rules will remain the same.

That means payments into the EU budget, free movement of people and the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice would stay in place.

That's always been the position of the rest of the EU - it now appears that the UK has accepted that there is no way round this.

Mrs May confirmed that there will be no restrictions on EU citizens coming to the UK during the transition, but that after Brexit they will be registered as they arrive. That is something that the UK could already do under current EU rules, but it never has done so.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41360901 According to the BBC analysis all EU routes (Including SS right?) to the UK will remain the same, not just up until March 2019, but until 2021 at least. Even if a cut off point is introduced the only change to EU citizens coming in would be that they need to register when they arrive? Which the UK could have already implemented regardless of Brexit. Of course getting PR will most likely still be subject to the many branches of whatever the UK system will be and when you arrived.

Secondly, is everything this lawyer in the link below says effectively true? If I've understood the nuance correctly he makes it sound like the UK's interpretation of the SS route is just..well..wrong. Meaning if you get rejected you can appeal under many grounds (of previous well documented accounts) and win. An example being that there essentially is no minimum length of stay bar the initial 3 months. Or even the dreaded circumvention of UK immigration rules is BS and in contradiction to Akrich C-109/01.

https://www.freemovement.org.uk/surinde ... ion-route/

Thanks for any insight from the volunteers here.

[sadmanonatrain]

Also, would us visiting the UK to see my parents before jetting off to Ireland (to exercise freedom of movement rights) be detrimental when a applying for the eea permit 6-12 months later?

Because you have to supply travel history and previous visa applications to and from the UK right? Technically it shouldn't though right? Even while in Ireland, visiting for Christmas or something should definitely be okay though?

Is any of the above perfect grounds for suspicion on bypassing UK immigration routes for UKVI?

TLTR: Haven't seen my parents in 4 years... Would it be better to visit after being settled in Ireland? Or would visiting beforehand be okay?

[blondesafari]

I am totally disgusted at the comment made below. Can Moderators please address personal comments about the Prime Minister, or other people, be they in government, or not. It is a bad reflection on this forum if this type of behavior is tolerated - no matter what anyone's personal beliefs may be.

Edited by moderator

[CR001]

I am totally disgusted at the comment made below. Can Moderators please address personal comments about the Prime Minister, or other people, be they in government, or not. It is a bad reflection on this forum if this type of behavior is tolerated - no matter what anyone's personal beliefs may be.

Edited by moderator

The comment by the user has been edited.

[blondesafari]

Thank you.