Citizenship timeline tracker.

PatiencePracticer · Post by **PatiencePracticer** » Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:10 pm

To all those that are awaiting naturalisation,

How about everytime someone calls the citizenship/naturalisation helpline and get told which applications the Department are working on now, we post an update to this single thread. The aim of this is to keep track of what applications are being worked on and see if there is any consistency to the information we are given when calling the famous Tuesday&Thursday help desk.

Example:

Date of call: 17 April, 2008
Batch of appilcations being worked on: July 2005 applications

Thank you.

smartk2 · Post by **smartk2** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:48 pm

Isn't it silly that the Dept of Justice can't publish this on their website like the US government can do? ......

asrpb · Post by **asrpb** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:29 pm

Hi Guys,

I agree with both of you....
But don't you think that we should be putting our attention & energy towards sorting the ridiculous time its taking to process citizenship applications

If nothing will be done the time frame of 2.5 years , might well be 4-5 years some day..... (BTW it used to be 1 year)

IDEAS anyone

Thanks

mendo · Post by **mendo** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:08 am

They do have a web site but the time lines are not true:

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/Co ... %20Section

They say that applications from early August 2005 are processed at the moment but it is not true.
I've applied early August 2005 and I haven't got any update from them.
The web site was updated on the 5th of April but I don't think that they touched any application from August 2005.
I am not sure if they are actually processing applications even from July 2005.
Maybe someone who applied earlier than August 2005 can confirm if they've got any real update, like an official letter from them.

Citizenship
Contact Details
Citizenship
Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform
13/14 Burgh Quay
Dublin 2

Telephone (within Ireland): Lo-Call 1890 551 500
(helpline available 10:00am - 12:30pm Tuesdays and Thursdays only)

Telephone (from outside Ireland): + 353 1 616 7700
(helpline available 10:00am - 12:30pm Tuesdays and Thursdays only)

Email: Citizenship_Mail@Justice.ie

Applications for naturalisation received up to early August 2005 are currently being processed.

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PatiencePracticer · Post by **PatiencePracticer** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:29 pm

Thanks for your replies.

I agree tracking the progress of these applications isn't going to be exciting considering the slowness of the events.... It's not exactly breaking news!

But if we keep some sort of track of it, at least those of us who have applied can know where we stand.

The latest I heard of is a guy (friend of a friend) who got the "yes" reply this month. He had applied in January 2005. So his application took 3 years and 4 months.

I applied in July 2006, so of course I still have a long ways ahead of me.... yawn.

PatiencePracticer · Post by **PatiencePracticer** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:45 pm

To asrpb who asked if anyone has any ideas... I have a little one. It's not great but here goes...

Has anyone noticed how certain issues become suddenly "fasionable" in the Irish news? For example nowadays people are talking a lot about the crappy health service. You get a few scandals and suddenly the health service is on everyone's lips.

Or, if you are unfortunate enough to read the Metro free paper, people write in about how ugly Ugg boots are and suddenly a lot of people talk about Ugg boots.

So, the question is.. how do we make it "fasionable" to talk about the slow immigration-related services? Do we need to write in to the Metro and the A.M Herald? Or maybe chat to taxi drivers who can then spread the word (taxi drivers like to talk!)?

We need to make the slow immigration/naturalisation process seem like a "hot topic" to talk about. How about a reality show? Anyone know an up and coming film maker looking to make a big brother show about naturalisation?

Told you, it's not much of an idea... but I'm getting desperate here!

mendo · Post by **mendo** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:41 am

A friend that I know very well, applied in February 2005 and he hasn't heard anything from them yet.

He sent them a letter asking for an update and they answered two weeks later, stating that the copy of his passport is not good enough and they can't determine if he is eligible for citizenship.

Of course the copy of his passport that he sent was as good as a copy can be ( my mate did his best to make the best copy he could do, he would never risk such an important part of his application) and this was only an excuse from DOJ to justify the delay in procesing applications.
Not to mention the fact that he used an identical copy for his LTR application the same time and there were no problems, he got the LTR granted in a week.

I don't believe anymore the updates they post on the INIS web site.

I do believe that they might process applications from January 2005 at the moment and the realistic timelines at the moment are around 3 years and 4 months mark and this is going to increase further and that is going to take even longer than this.

Mendo
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Fionn · Post by **Fionn** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:35 am

to: PatiencePracticer

The problem is that Irish people wont' really give any attention to this. The health service issues are of course of interest for them, but who really gives the shit about our naturalisation??..It would be nice if we could highlight this to the public as you said, but I'm not sure if that will improve things..It would be probably more helpful if you get the opposition involved (Fine Gael, Labour, etc..) and get them to talk about this regularely in the Dail..Has anyone contact to opposition PDs??

Christophe · Post by **Christophe** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:24 am

Fionn wrote:to: PatiencePracticer

The problem is that Irish people wont' really give any attention to this. The health service issues are of course of interest for them, but who really gives the shit about our naturalisation??..It would be nice if we could highlight this to the public as you said, but I'm not sure if that will improve things..It would be probably more helpful if you get the opposition involved (Fine Gael, Labour, etc..) and get them to talk about this regularely in the Dail..Has anyone contact to opposition PDs??

That is true, no doubt about it. On the other hand, the general chaos in what was the IND (Immigration and Nationality Directorate) of the Home Office in the UK became a bit of a cause cÃ©lÃ¨bre. People now remember issues like the non-consideration for deportation of foreign prisoners and the like, but the inordinate waiting times and general mismanagement were made to prick the government's conscience too, especially with regard to people seeking asylum.

Services (which never seemed to be as chaotic as they are in Ireland at the moment) are better now: one government response was to increase costs and to start charging for immigration services that had been free (reasonable up to a point, although I think the charges are set too high). But I think that most processing times are much better and on the whole the timing is more transparent, although there are still problems. Naturalisation times are much quicker now than they were a couple of years ago, with some decisions being made, seemingly, in a matter of days and many being made in a few weeks.

So it is possible to interest the government in these things. A few politicians who were prepared to spout on about it at regular intervals would help (perhaps ones who have a lot of immigrants in their electorate?); business leaders who are inconvenienced by the chaos might also make a bit of noise. I wonder if there are immigrant groups and charities that could involve such people?

ferrellk · Post by **ferrellk** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:32 pm

Has there been any major news coverage of the naturalisation delay issue at all?

I know immigration gets a lot of "face" coverage, but has any newspaper or tv/radio programme ever focused on how long it will take for the folks propping up the Irish economy to get official recognition?

PatiencePracticer · Post by **PatiencePracticer** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:32 pm

I would be happy to compose letters and post them to the "key" politicians of the opposition. It's just that I'm a bit useless with names and don't know who's who in these parties. If anyone can educate me about who these key figures are, I will send them a nice letter explaining succinctly and in a constructive manner, how the processing of applications could be streamlined. I work in IT process improvement myself so I am somewhat qualified to provide them with ideas.

In these letters it is also important to highlight all the advantages, for Ireland and its standing in Europe, of having a more streamlined and transparent process.

asrpb · Post by **asrpb** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:14 pm

To: PatiencePracticer

Thanks buddy for your suggestion.
This issue did start in Free Metro few months ago, and I requested people to send in as many letter as they can & keep the ball rolling. I even have scanned copies of couple of pages if you wanna see. This whole thing about Irish lazy attitude towards Citizenship process was in full flow under this Thread.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... c&start=40

I've already sent few letters to Metro regarding this But I suppose they will publish 1 if they receive 10

BTW there's another option apart from the one suggested by Fionn (which I think is very good idea if you know your local TD)

I suppose Some people are still on work permits while waiting for LTR/naturalisation ...... If they can get their employers (big firm=big pressure) to contact DoJ, clearly stating that they are paying the real price (arranging work-permits etc) just because DoJ can't hire few more staff and get the whole backlog out.

Let me know what you think

ChIrl · Post by **ChIrl** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:58 pm

INIS web site update:

Applications for naturalisation received in September 2005 are currently being processed.

Is it true? If it is atleast we can see some light at the end of the tunnel.

Regards

Ch

malcolmrx · Post by **malcolmrx** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 11:44 pm

I'm relatively new here, but I've been closely following this board for quite some time now. I'm, as everyone else, appalled by the long delays in LTR and Naturalisation to the extent that it's starting to hurt my job prospects and my employer in Ireland by not being able to freely move to the UK and the rest of Europe.

I add my voices to all those who are willing to stop this disgraceful attitude of the Irish Government towards immigrants who they desperately need to keep their economy. We need to stand up and fight for our rights. We paid a lot of taxes in this country like any other citizen and we deserve a better treatment. We pay for the immigration services and we are not asking for something for free. We all have a lot of ideas, but the most important thing is to get organised and put a plan of action

Some of the ideas which have already been mentioned should be seriously considered. I summarize these below:

1. Flood the media with letters of complaints. Target major editors of Irish newspapers, TV programs and radio.

2. Send our local TDs a letter every month asking for updates and progress.

3. Send the Taoiseach and the Integration minister letters asking for our rights.

4. Lots of other ideas which need action from us.

The question now is how to start. I'll start myself by compiling letters which describe my personal circumstances and send them to all the above. I think everyone should send letters explaining why it is so important that Ireland has to solve these problems. I'm sure everyone is an important part of an organisation which can loose a lot if we all suddenly leave and become difficult to replace.

PLEASE, WE NEED TO ACT NOW ...

malcolmrx · Post by **malcolmrx** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 11:51 pm

Just to add to my point above. I think we should set benchmarks for ourselves as in:

1. How many newspapers are responding?.
2. What kind of replies are we getting (if at all) from TDs?.
3. Are we starting to pop up in the radio?.
4. Did we appear on Prime Time yet? (Just dreaming here).

We also need to let each other know how much progress each one is making like how many letters are being sent and to who. We need to shoulder each other, you know the human nature is quite lazy sometimes, and myself included!.

Anyone interested in embarking on such a mission?. Once we assemble a team we need to organise a mailing list for ourselves and advertise it here so we can be more efficient.

I'm honestly sick and tired at this stage and I'm willing to do whatever it takes to get my rights ..

asrpb · Post by **asrpb** » Sun Apr 27, 2008 8:04 pm

malcolmrx wrote:Just to add to my point above. I think we should set benchmarks for ourselves as in:

1. How many newspapers are responding?.
2. What kind of replies are we getting (if at all) from TDs?.
3. Are we starting to pop up in the radio?.
4. Did we appear on Prime Time yet? (Just dreaming here).

We also need to let each other know how much progress each one is making like how many letters are being sent and to who. We need to shoulder each other, you know the human nature is quite lazy sometimes, and myself included!.

Anyone interested in embarking on such a mission?. Once we assemble a team we need to organise a mailing list for ourselves and advertise it here so we can be more efficient.

I'm honestly sick and tired at this stage and I'm willing to do whatever it takes to get my rights ..

I'm with you malcolmrx

I've already sent couple of letters to Irish times.... But no answer yet.
I'll be sending few more next week .... and will keep you guys updated on this thread.

Another idea

.... why don't we flood DoJ with cards on occasions like X-Mas with this issue. The more the cards ... the better it will be.

Also can someone let me know how to find who is your local TD ??

malcolmrx · Post by **malcolmrx** » Sun Apr 27, 2008 8:18 pm

That's great asrpb .. we REALLY need to keep this going .. the more the buzz the more attention we're going to get .. I'm currently compiling my letter and will send it to the Irish Times editor as well .. I'm not quite sure how to find your local TD, but local TDs usually send you letters asking if there's anything that they can help with (!) and they leave their details. It's worth ringin your city council. I'll be also sending to my local TD shortly.

I'll update you when I do this. We need to let each other know of any media outlet out there that we could use. So far I hear the following:

1. The Irish Times Editor.
2. Local TDs.
3. Metro Newspaper.
4. I like your idea of sending postcards whenever there's a chance.

KEEP the ball rolling guys.

joesoap101 · Post by **joesoap101** » Sun Apr 27, 2008 11:27 pm

What you actually need to do is go to your local TD and get him to ask Brian Lenihan the progress of individual cases, to which he has to reply in the parliament. I think this will work better than merely telling your local TD how woeful the service is. Eventually he will get tired of the questions and perhaps do something about it?

ChIrl · Post by **ChIrl** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:58 pm

Hi

If we can agree on a letter, we all can send the same letter to respective TD's and also to the Justice Minister. I can also ask my friends, who are also in the same position to send the letter. If we can get atleast 100 members, then we can get some attention. I can promise around 10-20 members.

Can you circulate the draft?

Regards

golwaycat · Post by **golwaycat** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:06 pm

Hi All ,

I had applied in Sept 05 and have not received any responce so far beasides a letter 2 years go stating they will examine my file in more detail. The acknowledgement letter from the Dept to my application is dated Sept 29th 05. Do I need to write to them for a status or shall I just wait ............. thanks to let me know

Cheers
GG

asrpb · Post by **asrpb** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 5:28 pm

To: joesoap101

I understand and appreciate your point about bringing individual cases to TD or DoJ.... But even though if they'll act on that/those specific case/s, its still not gonna solve the ROOT CAUSE i.e. waiting for almost 3years for thousands who are in the same boat.

To: ChIrl

I totally agree with your idea of one letter pointing the main issue and signed by as many people we can get.
Anyone has a draft already ?? otherwise I can try to put one by tomorrow and we can amend where it needs to be .... How that sounds ??

To: golwaycat

You are lucky man that they actually put SEP 05 on their web-page.... If I were you I'd eat their head out with enquiries

.
Send them letters... give them calls and ask them to move their lazy A** and try to do some work.

golwaycat · Post by **golwaycat** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:37 pm

Hi All

after feedback from all of you , I will write to them tomorrow. Also since my application is in month as theymention "Sept 05" I will keep all of you posted on the progress. I do hope the update from them on the INIS website about which month application they are processing is true.If it is not I will let you all know .... it will be proved if I do not get a responce and the month moves to oct 05 on the website.

thanks to all

GG

asrpb · Post by **asrpb** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:25 pm

golwaycat wrote:Hi All

after feedback from all of you , I will write to them tomorrow. Also since my application is in month as theymention "Sept 05" I will keep all of you posted on the progress. I do hope the update from them on the INIS website about which month application they are processing is true.If it is not I will let you all know .... it will be proved if I do not get a responce and the month moves to oct 05 on the website.

thanks to all

GG

Nice one golwaycat.... much appreciated

joesoap101 · Post by **joesoap101** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:51 pm

asrpb wrote:To: joesoap101

I understand and appreciate your point about bringing individual cases to TD or DoJ.... But even though if they'll act on that/those specific case/s, its still not gonna solve the ROOT CAUSE i.e. waiting for almost 3years for thousands who are in the same boat.

Well that is exactly my point. If Brian Lenihan has to answer thousands of questions in the Dail and is continually questioned on the issue by TDs he might just consider doing something about the situation.

another_immigrant · Post by **another_immigrant** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:06 pm

golwaycat wrote:Hi All

after feedback from all of you , I will write to them tomorrow. Also since my application is in month as theymention "Sept 05" I will keep all of you posted on the progress. I do hope the update from them on the INIS website about which month application they are processing is true.If it is not I will let you all know .... it will be proved if I do not get a responce and the month moves to oct 05 on the website.

thanks to all

GG

Thanks golwaycat. If we keep eachother up-to-date, we will be more aware of the process and if the INIS skips/overlooks someone by any reasons, we will be able to know it and take an action as well. We should also find a way to get the rest of the people involved in this immigration board and share information as much as possible. Maybe we can write to the newspapers like Metro/Herald am. They are free and would you believe, they are actually reaching more people than we can imagine here in Dublin. More info, more feedback, more awareness. regards

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