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Funds withdrawal

Only for UK Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) points system. This route is now closed to new applicants.

Moderators: Casa, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, CR001, push, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, meself2, geriatrix

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marcnath
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by marcnath » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:12 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:41 am
Thanks for reply.


I am asking cover letter template and we need submit cover letter as well..i am not asking for third party declaration letter




Sorry.

There is no cover letter template that I am aware of.
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Saurabh79
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Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 am

I think when we apply through lawyer they submit cover letter to support the application. I need format what they write



quote=marcnath post_id=1642645 time=1528186352 user_id=76145]
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:41 am
Thanks for reply.


I am asking cover letter template and we need submit cover letter as well..i am not asking for third party declaration letter




Sorry.

There is no cover letter template that I am aware of.
[/quote]

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CR001
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by CR001 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 am
I think when we apply through lawyer they submit cover letter to support the application. I need format what they write
There is NO cover letter template. I really do not understand why members think there is a template letter for everything, there is not. You simply need to write a letter based on your circumstances.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

Saurabh79
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Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:59 am

Hi,

my brother will sponsor me, do I need to submit my brother income tax return papers as well.
As far as I know , I need to submit my tax return paper only, please correct me if I am wrong


CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 am
I think when we apply through lawyer they submit cover letter to support the application. I need format what they write
There is NO cover letter template. I really do not understand why members think there is a template letter for everything, there is not. You simply need to write a letter based on your circumstances.

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TheRock9
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by TheRock9 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:01 pm

Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:59 am
Hi,

my brother will sponsor me, do I need to submit my brother income tax return papers as well.
As far as I know , I need to submit my tax return paper only, please correct me if I am wrong


CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 am
I think when we apply through lawyer they submit cover letter to support the application. I need format what they write
There is NO cover letter template. I really do not understand why members think there is a template letter for everything, there is not. You simply need to write a letter based on your circumstances.
Hi,

Your brother us sponsoring you for what ?

Thanks
I am not an immigration lawyer, so comments here are not an advise. My comments are from my own experience and interpretation of information which is available publicly.

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CR001
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by CR001 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:03 pm

TheRock9 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:01 pm
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:59 am
Hi,

my brother will sponsor me, do I need to submit my brother income tax return papers as well.
As far as I know , I need to submit my tax return paper only, please correct me if I am wrong


CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 am
I think when we apply through lawyer they submit cover letter to support the application. I need format what they write
There is NO cover letter template. I really do not understand why members think there is a template letter for everything, there is not. You simply need to write a letter based on your circumstances.
Hi,

Your brother us sponsoring you for what ?

Thanks
Read the whole topic.

Sponsoring the FUNDS for Tier 1 Ent.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

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TheRock9
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by TheRock9 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:06 pm

CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:03 pm
TheRock9 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:01 pm
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:59 am
Hi,

my brother will sponsor me, do I need to submit my brother income tax return papers as well.
As far as I know , I need to submit my tax return paper only, please correct me if I am wrong


CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 am

There is NO cover letter template. I really do not understand why members think there is a template letter for everything, there is not. You simply need to write a letter based on your circumstances.
Hi,

Your brother us sponsoring you for what ?

Thanks
Read the whole topic.

Sponsoring the FUNDS for Tier 1 Ent.
Hi

I read the topic and the reason i asked is because OP has changed thr mind several times.

Thanks
I am not an immigration lawyer, so comments here are not an advise. My comments are from my own experience and interpretation of information which is available publicly.

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CR001
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by CR001 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:27 pm

TheRock9 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:06 pm
CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:03 pm
TheRock9 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:01 pm
Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:59 am
Hi,

my brother will sponsor me, do I need to submit my brother income tax return papers as well.
As far as I know , I need to submit my tax return paper only, please correct me if I am wrong



Hi,

Your brother us sponsoring you for what ?

Thanks
Read the whole topic.

Sponsoring the FUNDS for Tier 1 Ent.
Hi

I read the topic and the reason i asked is because OP has changed thr mind several times.

Thanks
Yes, unfortunate that us volunteers are asked to figure it out instead of OP simply reading the guidance notes and follow the requirements :roll: :?
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

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TheRock9
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by TheRock9 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:03 pm

CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:27 pm
TheRock9 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:06 pm
CR001 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:03 pm
TheRock9 wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:01 pm


Hi,

Your brother us sponsoring you for what ?

Thanks
Read the whole topic.

Sponsoring the FUNDS for Tier 1 Ent.
Hi

I read the topic and the reason i asked is because OP has changed thr mind several times.

Thanks
Yes, unfortunate that us volunteers are asked to figure it out instead of OP simply reading the guidance notes and follow the requirements :roll: :?
very true.
I am not an immigration lawyer, so comments here are not an advise. My comments are from my own experience and interpretation of information which is available publicly.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:46 pm

Hi MARC,

As I told u earlier, that I just filed income tax return for 2018 and I was not filling tax return for last two years, prior to this I was in UK on student visa and was paying everything . do I need to submit my pay slip or NI number as I was working there as a part timer.

Moreover, we got family business in India, manufacturing tiles and I was helping my father.my father legally owned that business and I don't have any proof such as pay slip or propriership that I was working there for two years. so my question is what documents I can take from father to support my application .In such case how I can strengthen my application. Furthermore, we are into manufacturing tiles in India and in UK, I am going to establish a engineering company; however I have got more than 7 years of experience working in engineering field specially in technical sales , worked in UK,Germany ,SAUDI ARABIA and India.in addition, I have don MBA from UK.

how I can sum up everything.

Please advice me , I am very tensed.



marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:39 am
No
Saurabh79 wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:34 am
do you know anyone who got visa through third party. I am not talking about this forum, generally asking anyone in ur circle or friend and relatives.

Thanks


marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:22 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:15 am
Thanks brother,


have seen any third party cases in last one year who got approval. as my friend he also got Tier 1 visa and said that he din hear anyone get approval in third party funding I past one year

so I just want to confirm that people still getting approval in such cases. That's it.

you might know some cases through this forum that's y asking, please revert brother as I am very confused.

Thanks


No, I haven't.

But most people who post in this forum are those who have some problems they are looking for solutions too. So, if they are successful, it is less likely they will post here.

On the other hand, I don't remember anyone here posting of a rejection because they used third party funding.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 7:32 am

Hi MARC

Please reply above

thanks

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TheRock9
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by TheRock9 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:24 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:46 pm
Hi MARC,
As I told u earlier, that I just filed income tax return for 2018 and I was not filling tax return for last two years, prior to this I was in UK on student visa and was paying everything . do I need to submit my pay slip or NI number as I was working there as a part timer.
How will submitting Pay slips of UK will help your Tier 1 Entrepreneur Visa ? Yeah you might have to declare your NI number only if they are asking about this on the form
Moreover, we got family business in India, manufacturing tiles and I was helping my father.my father legally owned that business and I don't have any proof such as pay slip or propriership that I was working there for two years. so my question is what documents I can take from father to support my application .In such case how I can strengthen my application. Furthermore, we are into manufacturing tiles in India and in UK, I am going to establish a engineering company; however I have got more than 7 years of experience working in engineering field specially in technical sales , worked in UK,Germany ,SAUDI ARABIA and India.in addition, I have don MBA from UK.

how I can sum up everything.
You need to prepare your BUSINESS PLAN and in that you can mention in appendix or in extra notes about your experience or you can mention in your cover letter.

Please advice me , I am very tensed.



marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:39 am
No
Saurabh79 wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:34 am
do you know anyone who got visa through third party. I am not talking about this forum, generally asking anyone in ur circle or friend and relatives.

Thanks


marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:22 am


No, I haven't.

But most people who post in this forum are those who have some problems they are looking for solutions too. So, if they are successful, it is less likely they will post here.

On the other hand, I don't remember anyone here posting of a rejection because they used third party funding.
I am not an immigration lawyer, so comments here are not an advise. My comments are from my own experience and interpretation of information which is available publicly.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:54 am

Hi,

Thanks for you reply.

I am going to submit one year 2018 ITR only(income tax return ) as I din file last year.do u think it will affect my application.

my brother is going to sponsor me so believe his ITR is more important than me.

do you think ,I also need to submit my family business papers such as balance sheet and company registration paper

TheRock9 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:24 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:46 pm
Hi MARC,
As I told u earlier, that I just filed income tax return for 2018 and I was not filling tax return for last two years, prior to this I was in UK on student visa and was paying everything . do I need to submit my pay slip or NI number as I was working there as a part timer.
How will submitting Pay slips of UK will help your Tier 1 Entrepreneur Visa ? Yeah you might have to declare your NI number only if they are asking about this on the form
Moreover, we got family business in India, manufacturing tiles and I was helping my father.my father legally owned that business and I don't have any proof such as pay slip or propriership that I was working there for two years. so my question is what documents I can take from father to support my application .In such case how I can strengthen my application. Furthermore, we are into manufacturing tiles in India and in UK, I am going to establish a engineering company; however I have got more than 7 years of experience working in engineering field specially in technical sales , worked in UK,Germany ,SAUDI ARABIA and India.in addition, I have don MBA from UK.

how I can sum up everything.
You need to prepare your BUSINESS PLAN and in that you can mention in appendix or in extra notes about your experience or you can mention in your cover letter.

Please advice me , I am very tensed.



marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:39 am
No
Saurabh79 wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:34 am
do you know anyone who got visa through third party. I am not talking about this forum, generally asking anyone in ur circle or friend and relatives.

Thanks




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TheRock9
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Posts: 211
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Mood:
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by TheRock9 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:34 am

Hi,

Thanks for you reply.

I am going to submit one year 2018 ITR only(income tax return ) as I din file last year.do u think it will affect my application.

my brother is going to sponsor me so believe his ITR is more important than me.

do you think ,I also need to submit my family business papers such as balance sheet and company registration paper
1. I think so it should be fine.

2. Yeah you can add his tax returns if he is providing you with the funding

3. Well why you think you have to submit your family business papers , as this as nothing to do with your visa application.


Thanks
I am not an immigration lawyer, so comments here are not an advise. My comments are from my own experience and interpretation of information which is available publicly.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:33 am

HI Marc,

I contacted DIT regarding my start up in UK. They said ,they can help me to find the market/location/cost/market analysis, furthermore they will introduce me to the professionals( accountants/solicitor/visa assistance/bank account/and business development) and local bodies to support my business. But they said, I need to register my company in India first and later I can establish a branch in UK.

Do you think it will help in my application if I register my company in India first and take DIT services. will it make my application more complex ?

Or

simply I prepare neccsaasy documents and apply for Tier 1 Visa straight away without involving DIT.


Thanks

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marcnath
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Location: Milton Keynes
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by marcnath » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:00 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:33 am
HI Marc,

I contacted DIT regarding my start up in UK. They said ,they can help me to find the market/location/cost/market analysis, furthermore they will introduce me to the professionals( accountants/solicitor/visa assistance/bank account/and business development) and local bodies to support my business. But they said, I need to register my company in India first and later I can establish a branch in UK.

Do you think it will help in my application if I register my company in India first and take DIT services. will it make my application more complex ?

Or

simply I prepare neccsaasy documents and apply for Tier 1 Visa straight away without involving DIT.


Thanks
I personally think DIT endorsement will help but there is no guarantees
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:10 am

Thanks Marc,

Is it ok if I register my company first in India and later establish a branch in UK,DIT suggested me this.

HO can ask me why you registered ur company in india or will it make application more complex.




marcnath wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:00 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:33 am
HI Marc,

I contacted DIT regarding my start up in UK. They said ,they can help me to find the market/location/cost/market analysis, furthermore they will introduce me to the professionals( accountants/solicitor/visa assistance/bank account/and business development) and local bodies to support my business. But they said, I need to register my company in India first and later I can establish a branch in UK.

Do you think it will help in my application if I register my company in India first and take DIT services. will it make my application more complex ?

Or

simply I prepare neccsaasy documents and apply for Tier 1 Visa straight away without involving DIT.


Thanks
I personally think DIT endorsement will help but there is no guarantees

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marcnath
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Posts: 6493
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Location: Milton Keynes
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by marcnath » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:22 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:10 am
Thanks Marc,

Is it ok if I register my company first in India and later establish a branch in UK,DIT suggested me this.

HO can ask me why you registered ur company in india or will it make application more complex.


I think I have said this before.

HO Can ask you any question they want and no one can predict what they will or will not ask.

Nor is there any way of determining what makes an application complex.

From all your questions, your primary concern seems to be just getting a visa by some means or the other.

You should be focused on your business rather than the visa.
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:54 am

Hi Rock,

can you please answer my question.

Fixed deposit to the company name allowed or not.

it will be third party sponsor and sponsor is a company(money is in form of FDR to pvt ltd company name).



TheRock9 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:24 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:46 pm
Hi MARC,
As I told u earlier, that I just filed income tax return for 2018 and I was not filling tax return for last two years, prior to this I was in UK on student visa and was paying everything . do I need to submit my pay slip or NI number as I was working there as a part timer.
How will submitting Pay slips of UK will help your Tier 1 Entrepreneur Visa ? Yeah you might have to declare your NI number only if they are asking about this on the form
Moreover, we got family business in India, manufacturing tiles and I was helping my father.my father legally owned that business and I don't have any proof such as pay slip or propriership that I was working there for two years. so my question is what documents I can take from father to support my application .In such case how I can strengthen my application. Furthermore, we are into manufacturing tiles in India and in UK, I am going to establish a engineering company; however I have got more than 7 years of experience working in engineering field specially in technical sales , worked in UK,Germany ,SAUDI ARABIA and India.in addition, I have don MBA from UK.

how I can sum up everything.
You need to prepare your BUSINESS PLAN and in that you can mention in appendix or in extra notes about your experience or you can mention in your cover letter.

Please advice me , I am very tensed.



marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:39 am
No
Saurabh79 wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:34 am
do you know anyone who got visa through third party. I am not talking about this forum, generally asking anyone in ur circle or friend and relatives.

Thanks




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TheRock9
Member
Posts: 211
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Mood:
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Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by TheRock9 » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:06 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:54 am
Hi Rock,

can you please answer my question.

Fixed deposit to the company name allowed or not.

it will be third party sponsor and sponsor is a company(money is in form of FDR to pvt ltd company name).



TheRock9 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:24 am
Saurabh79 wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:46 pm
Hi MARC,
As I told u earlier, that I just filed income tax return for 2018 and I was not filling tax return for last two years, prior to this I was in UK on student visa and was paying everything . do I need to submit my pay slip or NI number as I was working there as a part timer.
How will submitting Pay slips of UK will help your Tier 1 Entrepreneur Visa ? Yeah you might have to declare your NI number only if they are asking about this on the form
Moreover, we got family business in India, manufacturing tiles and I was helping my father.my father legally owned that business and I don't have any proof such as pay slip or propriership that I was working there for two years. so my question is what documents I can take from father to support my application .In such case how I can strengthen my application. Furthermore, we are into manufacturing tiles in India and in UK, I am going to establish a engineering company; however I have got more than 7 years of experience working in engineering field specially in technical sales , worked in UK,Germany ,SAUDI ARABIA and India.in addition, I have don MBA from UK.

how I can sum up everything.
You need to prepare your BUSINESS PLAN and in that you can mention in appendix or in extra notes about your experience or you can mention in your cover letter.

Please advice me , I am very tensed.



marcnath wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:39 am
No

Hi,

I am afraid i am not sure. Wait for senior members to reply.

Thanks
I am not an immigration lawyer, so comments here are not an advise. My comments are from my own experience and interpretation of information which is available publicly.

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:41 am

Hi Marc,


Sorry to disturb you again.

I got some fund issue, so working on it.


company FD( fixed deposit) allowed or not? Its PVT ltd company

or

Mutual Funds

Please confirm

Thanks

User avatar
marcnath
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Posts: 6493
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:27 pm
Location: Milton Keynes
United Kingdom

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by marcnath » Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:47 pm

Saurabh79 wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:41 am
Hi Marc,


Sorry to disturb you again.

I got some fund issue, so working on it.


company FD( fixed deposit) allowed or not? Its PVT ltd company

or

Mutual Funds

Please confirm

Thanks
I thought this was addressed before.

It has to be cash, so mutual funds definitely not allowed.

Any reason why FD is not in cash ?
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

jjs456
Junior Member
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:02 pm

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by jjs456 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:30 pm

Hi Saurabh,
Most important is that you have business plan and have cash in your or third party's bank account and cash has to be in account (saving or current) so that it will be immediately available and Indian bank will not issue a letter required for T1E and as per their template for any FD and mutual fund will not be accepted. I came as T1E on £200K and so I know that banks are very reluctant to give letter, may be you may get on personal relations as it is common there. I guess whosoever has fund is just showing for this application sake, will he transfer money to UK immediately after your visa?

Saurabh79
Newbie
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 1:09 pm
India

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by Saurabh79 » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:51 am

Hi

Thanks for your reply.

my uncle us having money and he keep changing his stances about funds.its really making me crazy.

is company fd allowed?

plz give me your contact details, want to let you know my exact situation.

you can contact me at telephone number removed by moderator.




jjs456 wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:30 pm
Hi Saurabh,
Most important is that you have business plan and have cash in your or third party's bank account and cash has to be in account (saving or current) so that it will be immediately available and Indian bank will not issue a letter required for T1E and as per their template for any FD and mutual fund will not be accepted. I came as T1E on £200K and so I know that banks are very reluctant to give letter, may be you may get on personal relations as it is common there. I guess whosoever has fund is just showing for this application sake, will he transfer money to UK immediately after your visa?

User avatar
CR001
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Location: London
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South Africa

Re: Funds withdrawal

Post by CR001 » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:58 am

Saurabh79 wrote:
Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:51 am
Hi

Thanks for your reply.

my uncle us having money and he keep changing his stances about funds.its really making me crazy.

is company fd allowed?

plz give me your contact details, want to let you know my exact situation.

you can contact me at telephone number removed by moderator.
Strongly suggest you read the forum rules. Every member on the forum is a complete stranger and we have many spammers and scammers who trawl the forum. Posting of personal contact information is not permitted.

With all due respect, given your seemingly desperate need to want get to the UK in any way, perhaps you should consult a professional to help you as the advice being given to you on the forum is accurate but clearly not what you want to hear, even though it follows the rules and guidance and asking the same question over and over will not change the answer.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

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