Naturalisation application - am I an overstayer?

[hope_Is_everything]

Hi All,

I have received permanent residence card in 2018. However, I was an overstayer until June 2011 and also worked in this time illegally, originally arrived in UK on a student visa in 2008/9 which expired a year later.

Since I left the country voluntarily in june 2011 and returned on eea family permit in 2013 following 5 year residence card, currently on permanent residence card. My question is: I am planning to apply for naturalisation later this year just waiting for 10 years to complete from the day i left UK. however, if someone could please help me - will my application for naturalisation will be refused because i did not spend 10 continuous year in uk. Or the time i left the country and returned in 2013 (two year gap) will count to cover the 10 year timeframe? thanks in advance

[secret.simon]

I have split your query into its own separate thread. Please keep all your queries about naturalisation in this thread.

will my application for naturalisation will be refused because i did not spend 10 continuous year in uk.

There is no requirement to have resided in the UK for 10 years. The requirement is that if you resided in the UK at any time in the past 10 years, any such residence must have been legal.

You do need to have resided in the UK for a minimum of five years if not married to a British citizen.

[hope_Is_everything]

secret.simon - you have made my day. Thank you so much.

I am sorry for being impatient as i have started another thread where I explained my situation in depth so everyone else could understand the background of it.

the thread is here:

british-citizenship/naturalisation-appl ... 13797.html

I am not sure if I could merge these two threads. However, i will add my story in this trail.

[hope_Is_everything]

Dear All,

secret.simon has already replied to my query in the beginning of this thread. feel free to continue posting down.

My story in a nutshell; I arrived UK by the end of 2008 on a 6 month student visa (might be an error on HO side as i supposed to receive 4 years visa, but i thought i would get extension once in the UK) however my college got shut and further leave to remain was not granted, i appealed but it was also refused. in the meantime, i met my EEA wife and tried to get married as at that time that seemed the only possible way for us to live together but it did not work as I have already overstayed here for almost a year or so and it happened in march 2011 (I was also working in this time, obviously illegally) when home-office raid on our wedding venue at registrar office. Then the officer told me that I cannot work here and they asked me to come in an office for signing every week. I did not feel it right as i became dependent on my wife (was not married than) so i left UK in June 2021 and returned on EEA family permit in 2013, straightaway applied 5 year residence card, currently I am on permanent residence card since 2018.

I am planning to apply for naturalisation later this year just waiting for 10 years to complete from the day i left UK. lately i was reading good character requirements and as per below instruction to home office staff, the exact wordings are:

Non-compliance with immigration requirements
An application will normally be refused if, within the previous 10 years (before the
date of decision), the person has not complied with immigration requirements,
including having:
• failed to comply with (breached) conditions imposed under the Immigration
Acts, for example:
o accessed public funds when prohibited from doing so
o worked in the UK without permission to do so
o studied in the UK in contravention of any restrictions on studying
o failed, without reasonable excuse, to report when required to do so
• remained in the UK after their leave, including when leave extended by virtue of
section 3C or 3D of the Immigration Act 1971 has expired. See: Overstaying
• failed to comply with the requirements of the EEA Regulations 2016
Abuse of immigration requirements may also occur if a person enters or remains in
the UK for a purpose other than that for which they were given leave to enter or
remain. For example, where a person is found to be working full time in the UK
having entered the UK as a Tier 4 student and having failed to undertake or
complete the course of study for which the leave was given.

My question is, what does (before the
date of decision) means? Do my 10 years start from the date i was known to home office as an overstayer back in march 2011, or it is june 2011 when i left the country. Or 10 years start from the date i returned in March 2013 on EEA family permit? I personally think that 10 years are from june 2011 when i left the country (i can trace back the ticket i bought myself when i left the country) but what is bothering me is that me staying out of country might be overlooked and they refuse my application, in that case should i wait and apply in march 2023?

Another thing, should i add a cover letter explaining everything provided i apply in June 2021 or i should just go with online application and wait for them to say something?

I am really really sorry for creating this long long post but it might will help many others who are in the same situation where I am right now. Please assist me.
Thank you so much for reading this post.

[hope_Is_everything]

I have split your query into its own separate thread. Please keep all your queries about naturalisation in this thread.

will my application for naturalisation will be refused because i did not spend 10 continuous year in uk.

There is no requirement to have resided in the UK for 10 years. The requirement is that if you resided in the UK at any time in the past 10 years, any such residence must have been legal.

You do need to have resided in the UK for a minimum of five years if not married to a British citizen.

HI Secret Simon and anyone else who has a similar situation or someone who could assist - I have spoken with couple of professionals with regards to my situation (storyline in the above post). I am a bit confuse now. a solicitor has informed me that i can only apply for naturalisation for a successful application in November 2023 as that's when I will complete 10 years from the day I started living here legally on a leave (which was 5 year residency card issued in November 2013) .

However, as Simon advised and that's what my hunch was that there is no such rule to stay here legally and home office says: "we would no normally consider someone who has been in breach of the immigration laws at any time during the 10 years immediately prior to their applicant as being of good character". i left UK in 2011 June, i was illegal at that time. and this solicitor who scared me, his words were that HO will refuse the application based on that I left country illegally. further he said that when i re-entered on family permit, I should not consider that time towards my application, in fact my time starts from the day i received my 5 year residence card.

Question (again) is:

should i wait until 2023 November when i received my residence card 10 year ago
or
should I want until beginning of 2023 when i entered 2nd time on a family permit
or
I can apply in June 2021 as that's when i left UK and i should count my 10 years from this time.
any help, anybody is the same situation, i will appreciate all answers.

[vinny]

I think you cease to be an overstayer in the UK immediately after you left the UK. I don’t see how a person may be in breach of the UK immigration laws while being outside the UK. You were legally in the UK on your return under the EEA family permit, provided your wife/partner had an initial or extended or permanent right of residence. When did you get married?

[hope_Is_everything]

I think you cease to be an overstayer in the UK immediately after you left the UK. I don’t see how a person may be in breach of the UK immigration laws while being outside the UK. You were legally in the UK on your return under the EEA family permit, provided your wife/partner had an initial or extended or permanent right of residence. When did you get married?

Many thanks for your prompt reply Vinny,

we married outside UK in India in March 2012. our wedding is not registered in UK. However, My mrs is from Poland and we registered our wedding in Poland in the end of 2012 as i came to Poland prior to arriving in UK 2nd time on eea family permit which was in February 2013. I must add here that when we tried to marry in Uk in 2011, home office raided on the day at registrar office and did not allow wedding. However, they let me go and the officer insisted that i should leave the country voluntarily which I did. we did not know about eea family permit at that time so we were thinking of Applying for marriage/spouse visa and my wife suggested that it will be easy if we do it from Poland (her home country, know she is dual uk-eea national) so we stayed there for half a year at that time we learned that we could come back to uk on eea family permit and all my adverse immigration history will be over looked.

Vinny - do you think it's safe to apply now in June, given i was outside the country at this time 10 years ago, regardless my status at the time I left the country? or should I wait?
do i need to add a cover letter explaining my situation? they would know anyway all my background.
i will look forward to your reply. Thank you

[London22]

I think you cease to be an overstayer in the UK immediately after you left the UK. I don’t see how a person may be in breach of the UK immigration laws while being outside the UK. You were legally in the UK on your return under the EEA family permit, provided your wife/partner had an initial or extended or permanent right of residence. When did you get married?

Many thanks for your prompt reply Vinny,

we married outside UK in India in March 2012. our wedding is not registered in UK. However, My mrs is from Poland and we registered our wedding in Poland in the end of 2012 as i came to Poland prior to arriving in UK 2nd time on eea family permit which was in February 2013. I must add here that when we tried to marry in Uk in 2011, home office raided on the day at registrar office and did not allow wedding. However, they let me go and the officer insisted that i should leave the country voluntarily which I did. we did not know about eea family permit at that time so we were thinking of Applying for marriage/spouse visa and my wife suggested that it will be easy if we do it from Poland (her home country, know she is dual uk-eea national) so we stayed there for half a year at that time we learned that we could come back to uk on eea family permit and all my adverse immigration history will be over looked.

Vinny - do you think it's safe to apply now in June, given i was outside the country at this time 10 years ago, regardless my status at the time I left the country? or should I wait?
do i need to add a cover letter explaining my situation? they would know anyway all my background.
i will look forward to your reply. Thank you

You are eligible for citizenship & should apply .It seems you would have no issue with this complex matter of good character .The good character policy is nothing more than a tool to play politics with migrants eligible for citizenship.
If within last 10 years there isn't any overstay or illegal work or criminality then they will grant it & if refuse should be challenged. You are best lawyer of yourselves .These days many lawyers dont even bother to know full cases of clients & practice just for currency.

[hope_Is_everything]

Thank you London22, for the positive vibes. it's just I had enough nuisance from HO in the past that I don't want another nervous breakdown by dealing with them in reconsideration etc. Nevertheless, as you, Vinny and Simon advised that my past is irrelevant once i left the country and counted 10 years from leaving date. so i am taking into account your opinions and most likely will go ahead with the application in coming days. I have already passed Life in the UK test, must say it was fun knowing so much, which i would have never learned without this test.

wish me luck guys and I will revert if i need advise.

Thank you so much.

[hope_Is_everything]

Dear All,

Just got a question, might be irrelevant to the subject however, I have only this thread so don't want to leave questions all over the place, it is for the same matter.

I am Requesting personal information from Gov.uk held in the borders, immigration and citizenship system.

There was this question:

Have you ever been included on a family member's visa application? This is known as being a 'dependant'.
The family member could be a parent, partner or spouse.

My question is that I have applied EEA family permit and later residence card as a non EU family member of an EEA national in the past, do these two documents fall under dependent or not?

Many thanks in advance for your help.