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Moderators: Casa, Amber, archigabe, batleykhan, ca.funke, ChetanOjha, EUsmileWEallsmile, JAJ, John, Obie, push, geriatrix, vinny, CR001, zimba, meself2, Administrator
The data comes actually from the timatic database which other airlines (many? most? all?) use as well. (Ryanair is obviously using the printed manual for example.)Richard66 wrote:Ah, but you go this information from the correct source in the end!
How come then Delta is posting such information? Will they not pay the price for this or are family members allowed in?
So my guess is that, as long as the EU and the non-EU family-members travel together, have both passports and the marriage-certificate with them, it may be possible to gain entry into the UK, according to the UK's own rules.Before an Immigration Officer refuses admission to a non-EEA national under Regulation 11(2) because s/he does not produce an EEA family permit, the IO must give the non-EEA national reasonable opportunity to provide by other means proof that he/she is a family member of an EEA national with a right to accompany that national or join him/her in the UK.
Friend you are very right and most people are awear of this but I guess most (except Richard66) are just scared of giving it a trier and not trying to stand on the rights of family member but agreeing with the UK laws and stuff, I wanted to try this as you might know from my link http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=32232 But almost everybody said I shouldnt try it as surely they will deport me and stuffs like that being the fact I was earlier refused or so.ca.funke wrote:For the UK (not Ireland), I wonder if the following works:
As far as I understand, >>this<<is an explanation of EEA-rules for consular staff by the homeoffice itself.
On page 3 of this paper you will find the following paragraph:
So my guess is that, as long as the EU and the non-EU family-members travel together, have both passports and the marriage-certificate with them, it may be possible to gain entry into the UK, according to the UK's own rules.Before an Immigration Officer refuses admission to a non-EEA national under Regulation 11(2) because s/he does not produce an EEA family permit, the IO must give the non-EEA national reasonable opportunity to provide by other means proof that he/she is a family member of an EEA national with a right to accompany that national or join him/her in the UK.
Did anyone ever try this, or am I wrong somehow?
What are you talking about here? Let us into the secret! Send the link!This family case was just ammending by the EU court couple of weeks ago that family member with a residence card for family issued from any EU country can accompany or join his spouse with the EU and SCHENGEN countries But still ..no changes from both Ireland and UK
What do you mean, Richard?Richard66 wrote:Yes, Charles Funke, the immigration officer will let you in, but the UK has made sure no family member will make it that far by blocking the non-EEA party at the airport.
In what way does it need to be updated? It's wording is accurate, in accordance with Directive 2004/38/EC Article 5(4):Richard66 wrote:It funny, because UK Immigration on the Eurostar is in France, yet I have heard of no one making it. Why?
The document you quoted needs to be updated. I wonder if the UK is looking into it.
Where a Union citizen, or a family member who is not a national of a Member State, does not
have the necessary travel documents or, if required, the necessary visas, the Member State
concerned shall, before turning them back, give such persons every reasonable opportunity to obtain
the necessary documents or have them brought to them within a reasonable period of time or to
corroborate or prove by other means that they are covered by the right of free movement and
residence.
Richard66 wrote:What are you talking about here? Let us into the secret! Send the link!This family case was just ammending by the EU court couple of weeks ago that family member with a residence card for family issued from any EU country can accompany or join his spouse with the EU and SCHENGEN countries But still ..no changes from both Ireland and UK
charles4u,charles4u wrote:Richard66 wrote:What are you talking about here? Let us into the secret! Send the link!This family case was just ammending by the EU court couple of weeks ago that family member with a residence card for family issued from any EU country can accompany or join his spouse with the EU and SCHENGEN countries But still ..no changes from both Ireland and UK
This is was was said and ammended and from what I understand...its either one comes in with a family or spouse visa or a residence card for family members then he can get a family permit automatically....meaning student or visitor cant automatically change to family permit or am I wrong?
On those grounds, the Court (Grand Chamber) hereby rules:
<snip>
This judgement was made for a case unrelated to visa requirements of non-EU family members entering Ireland.charles4u wrote:But even with this Judgement they are still requesting for visa for family members going to Ireland,
Yes, this is correct. Basically, it ended Ireland's prior legal residence in another Member State requirement.charles4u wrote:and the case based mostly on those they refused their application/residence card cus of the status in Ireland as at the time they got married and applied.
Prior residence was never a condition as far as I know (otherwise I wouldn't be in the UK). If you apply form outside the EEA normal immigration rules will apply for the non-EEA partner. I don't know, however, how the UK handles in-country marriages (or if that is possible at all for certain groups).benifa wrote:[Ireland is certainly acknowledging this judgement when processing relevant new and previously rejected Residence Card applications. I cannot confirm or deny the UK's adherence though.
The Irish embassy would say yes with regards your request for a visa because they still want to be relevant within the immigration arena. When i went for my 6 MONTHS stamp 4 GNIB card, they wanted to give me three months, so i kicked off at the guy in the booth and told him to call his supervisor and i got my 6 months, they are all chancers and within 2 months i have my EU fam 4. The only problem i envisage is the airlines but you can always take copies of directive 2004/38/EC and kick off if they try to refuse you boarding and threaten to sue as well because you are within your rights (any lawyer would take your case because it is law). The whole EU thing has shown me that a lot of these immigration and government officials are just a bunch of chancers, they dont like the diplomatic approach (always start by being diplomatic). I would be going to the UK via belfast for Xmas with my partner and i dont have any intention of applying for any rubbish Family Permit, i am not going via Dublin airport because it's an important family function but on my next visit in January i would be going via Dublin airport and i would be ready for a fight (not physical) and if iam refused boarding i would make the airline pay for their mistake.charles4u wrote:Friend you are very right and most people are awear of this but I guess most (except Richard66) are just scared of giving it a trier and not trying to stand on the rights of family member but agreeing with the UK laws and stuff, I wanted to try this as you might know from my link http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=32232 But almost everybody said I shouldnt try it as surely they will deport me and stuffs like that being the fact I was earlier refused or so.ca.funke wrote:For the UK (not Ireland), I wonder if the following works:
As far as I understand, >>this<<is an explanation of EEA-rules for consular staff by the homeoffice itself.
On page 3 of this paper you will find the following paragraph:
So my guess is that, as long as the EU and the non-EU family-members travel together, have both passports and the marriage-certificate with them, it may be possible to gain entry into the UK, according to the UK's own rules.Before an Immigration Officer refuses admission to a non-EEA national under Regulation 11(2) because s/he does not produce an EEA family permit, the IO must give the non-EEA national reasonable opportunity to provide by other means proof that he/she is a family member of an EEA national with a right to accompany that national or join him/her in the UK.
Did anyone ever try this, or am I wrong somehow?
But this fact remains on that paragraph saying the reason for entry refusal will base on the person not having a prove he or she is a family member of the EU citizen in which I have all...ALLL. What can we do or say..am just tired of all, I called the IRELAND embassy here in Romania to comfirm if family members needs visa going to Ireland and they said YES but less application but still requesting for a statement of account. This things will never get better cus its always from one thing to the other.
I dont get what u mean here..r u saying u went to the UK with just ur family member card or? ...if I get u right if one goes with a family residence from another EU to another...he or she should be automatically getting another family card except ofcourse Romania and Bulgaria who still needs to work for one yr cus they are not free to the labour market yet.86ti wrote:Prior residence was never a condition as far as I know (otherwise I wouldn't be in the UK). If you apply form outside the EEA normal immigration rules will apply for the non-EEA partner. I don't know, however, how the UK handles in-country marriages (or if that is possible at all for certain groups).benifa wrote:[Ireland is certainly acknowledging this judgement when processing relevant new and previously rejected Residence Card applications. I cannot confirm or deny the UK's adherence though.