Zambrano Settled Status EU settlement scheme Paper Application Form - NEW

[marcidevpal]

Hi Wishfulgirl,

You may want to see if you qualify for legal aid. If so, you may want to find a lawyer who will work with you. Your case is strong.

Eventhough you lost in the first round, you got your judge to make really important findings of fact.

If the Home Office see you have a lawyer behind you, given the fact you know what you are talking about, plus the findings of the FtT judge, there is a chance they will work with you. Otherwise, when they lose, they will have to pay your lawyer's fees.

At this point, the key thing is to get the email sent and the IATF-4 filed.

[marcidevpal]

Possible ways to win

1.) You email the Home Office, they agree with the judge's findings that you are a family member with a right to permanent residence. They grant you settlement.

2.) Or, you win permission to appeal from the First-tier Tribunal. The Upper Tribunal judge agrees the Home Office should have helped you and that you are a family member with a right to settlement.

3.) Or, you are refused permission to appeal from the First-tier Tribunal. You apply for permisison to appeal from the Upper Tribunal. The Upper Tribunal judge says yes. The second Upper Tribunal judge agrees the Home Office should have helped you and that you are a family member with a right to settlement.

4.) Or, you are granted permission to appeal from either the FtT or the UT but the judge does not agree you should get permanent residence as the family member. The UT judge then considers whether you should get settlement as a Zambrano carer. The argument the FtT judge made is the same argument almost all Zambrano carers are fighting. It is also the subject of Akinsanya's current judicial review. Therefore, the UT judge decides to delay a decision on your appeal until Akinsanya concludes.

This last scenario shows why it is important that you make the judge aware that your case mirrors Akinsanya's judicial review. Provide a link to the announcement by the Hackney Law Centre, so the judge can see that the case is ongoing.

In your appeal before the FtT, it doesn't seem like you mentioned Celik. It doesn't really matter at this point. However, you do want to make sure you mention the current Akinsanya jr. to protect yourself.

[marcidevpal]

IATF-4 - Permission to appeal

If you lose at the First-tier Tribunal and want to appeal to the Upper Tribunal, the Court will give you an IATF-4. You may want to treat it like a cover page. In the box that asks for you can write something like, "Please refer them to the document".

When you open your new word document, I suggest you put your case number, your name and date of birth in the header.

I also suggest you put the page number in the footer and the date (there is a macro that automatically inserts the day).

YOUR APPEAL REASONS DOCUMENT

1. Briefly summarise why the judge refused you in 1 or 2 sentences.

2. Highlight the findings of fact the judge made which help you.

3. List the facts the judge failed to recognise.

4. List the Articles in the Withdrawal Agreement the judge should have considered.

5. List the Errors of Law the judge made.

[Wishfulgirl]

IATF-4 - Permission to appeal

If you lose at the First-tier Tribunal and want to appeal to the Upper Tribunal, the Court will give you an IATF-4. You may want to treat it like a cover page. In the box that asks for you can write something like, "Please refer them to the document".

When you open your new word document, I suggest you put your case number, your name and date of birth in the header.

I also suggest you put the page number in the footer and the date (there is a macro that automatically inserts the day).

YOUR APPEAL REASONS DOCUMENT

1. Briefly summarise why the judge refused you in 1 or 2 sentences.

2. Highlight the findings of fact the judge made which help you.

3. List the facts the judge failed to recognise.

4. List the Articles in the Withdrawal Agreement the judge should have considered.

5. List the Errors of Law the judge made.

Thank you again for this info Marcidevpal,

I thought about getting a lawyer but I'm yet to find interested and willing in helping with an EU application let alone an appeal. l'm not sure if it's allowed but if anyone can point me in the direction of a solicitor willing to take such a case like mine to appeal I'd be delighted.

(Again I'm not sure it's allowed here)

For now, l'll have to do with what I can and this is making sure I make the appeal within the next 13 days.

I'm not sure if it's possible but for reference is there a draft copy I could use to write this letter. I know you've illustrated the steps above and I appreciate that. Is there like a draft copy I can use for demonstration purpose of how I'd write in into context in the appeal reason erros of law, step one two etc. I mean something like the drafted skeleton Argument you’ve graced us all with previously. I know it's a silly question, and you've explained but I have no experience whatsoever and I want to get it done the right way without making any mistakes. I also want to be seen as I know and understand what I'm saying.

Will the header be something similar to the drafted skeleton argument I provided in my previous appeal? Were My name Appellant and Home Office Name Respondent was the header? Or will it just be a document stating the facts right off the bat with my name and DOB at the top.
I over think things quite a lot so sorry if it seems l've written the same thing twice in a different way. Just gathering my thoughts in word format.

So for confirmation, I fill in the IAFT-4 and in the box provided I then note please refer to attached document. (Which is the ERROS of Law) Got it! After this, am I meant to attached the First Teir Tribunal decision a-swell as all the supporting documents I sent in the previous appeal. Or is it just the lAFT-4 form and the letter stating the facts? Please let know thanks. I appreciate your response and hope others on the forum who may be in my situation find the information helpful just as much as I did back in December and here right now.

[marcidevpal]

Hi Wishfulgirl,

Regarding finding an immigration lawyer, I think Obie might know some people.

Regarding the email letter request to the Home Office, have you tried artificial intelligence apps like ChatGPT? You can ask it to write a business letter that asks for help making an application. You can then update the letter with your points. There is a free version on the app stores. The knowledge is accurate up to the year 2021.

Regarding the IATF-4, yes, fill in the IAFT-4 and in the box provided I then note please refer to attached document. That way your IATF-4 is done and ready to go! You can now focus on the document.

I can't remember if you are supposed to create an "IATF-4 bundle" with the the previous information. I don't think so. I think they have all of that already. Remember, you are appealing to the First-tier Tribunal. They should have all of that stuff already. If the IATF-4 doesn't ask you for it, then you don't need to resend the info. I think the Court's administrators do that for you. The judge considering your permission to appeal isn't supposed to look at new evidence. I don't think he or she would look at your documents, anyway.

A document has three parts: A header, a body and a footer. Regarding the header in your IATF-4 Reasons document, are you using Microsoft Word? If so, in the menu, go to Insert > Header or Footer. Choose header. Put the information such as the case number and You v SSHD. That sort of thing Return to the menu bar. Choose Insert Header or Footer. This time, choose Footer. Put the information. The key thing is if someone drops your paper, the judge will quickly and easily know which appeal it belongs to. If you don't want to bother with using the header, just put all the information in the body.

[marcidevpal]

Hi,

I asked ChatGPT to

Write a letter to the UK Secretary of State for the Home Department asking her to reconsider her decision to refuse my visa application and work with me to prove I have the right to permanent residence

This is what I got as a response:

[Your Name]
[Your Address]
[City, Postal Code]
[Email Address]
[Phone Number]
[Date]

Rt Hon. Priti Patel MP
Secretary of State for the Home Department
Home Office
2 Marsham Street
London SW1P 4DF

Dear Secretary of State,

I hope this letter finds you well. I am writing to respectfully request your reconsideration of the decision to refuse my recent visa application. I believe there may have been misunderstandings or miscommunications during the assessment process, and I kindly ask for your assistance in working together to provide the necessary evidence to prove my right to permanent residence in the United Kingdom.

Firstly, I would like to express my appreciation for the diligent work carried out by the Home Office in ensuring the integrity and security of the UK immigration system. I understand the importance of thorough evaluations to maintain the country's immigration policies. However, I firmly believe that a reconsideration of my case is warranted due to the following reasons:

[Explain any discrepancies or misunderstandings that may have influenced the initial decision.]

[Highlight any additional evidence or documentation that supports your claim for permanent residence.]

[Mention any exceptional circumstances or compelling factors that should be taken into account.]

I am committed to cooperating fully with the Home Office and providing any additional information required to facilitate a fair assessment of my situation. I am confident that, with your support, we can address any concerns or doubts regarding my eligibility for permanent residence.

Furthermore, I would like to emphasize my contributions to the UK community during my time here. I have been actively involved in various community initiatives, volunteering my time and skills to support local charities and organizations. I strongly believe in the values and principles that underpin the United Kingdom, and I am committed to making positive contributions to society.

I understand that the Home Office is responsible for safeguarding the interests of the nation and ensuring compliance with immigration regulations. In light of this, I would be grateful for the opportunity to meet with you or a representative from your department to discuss my case further. Such a meeting would enable me to provide additional information and address any concerns directly, thereby helping to establish a clearer picture of my situation.

I kindly request that you review my case with the utmost consideration and undertake a thorough reassessment of the available information. I am confident that, upon careful examination, the decision to refuse my visa application can be reconsidered in a fair and just manner.

Thank you for your attention to this matter. I eagerly await your response and the opportunity to work collaboratively with you and the Home Office to demonstrate my right to permanent residence in the United Kingdom.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Name]

As you can see, ChatGPT chose Priti Patel. The free version is accurate up to the year 2021. At that point, Priti Patel was still the Secretary of State.

[marcidevpal]

ChatGPT 3 versus 3.5 - Are Zambrano carers covered by the WA?

I asked the free version of ChatGPT if Zambrano carers (the non-EU parents of British children, not the other Zambrano carers who are obviously covered) were covered by the Withdrawal Agreement. It said no, basically. It also said it didn't have access to the full text of the Withdrawal Agreement. That means, its answer was based on information it scraped off the web. We all know that various actors put out disinformation or misinformation on their websites about UK Zambrano carers. The truth will out!

Then, I upgraded my account. Now, I have access to ChatGPT 3.5. (I am still figuring out how to get access to ChatGPT 4.). First, I asked 3.5 if it had access to the full text of the Withdrawal Agreement. It said yes. Then, I asked 3.5 if non-EU parents of British children were covered by the Withdrawal Agreement. Here is what it said:

Yes, the Withdrawal Agreement includes provisions that protect the rights of non-EU parents of British children. Under the agreement, these parents are eligible for residence rights in the UK, allowing them to live, work, and access public services. This provision is aimed at ensuring the unity of families and safeguarding the rights of children who are British citizens.

To be eligible for these rights, non-EU parents of British children must meet certain criteria outlined in the Withdrawal Agreement. The specific requirements and conditions may vary, so it's important to refer to the agreement itself or consult with relevant authorities for detailed information based on individual circumstances.

It's worth noting that the Withdrawal Agreement primarily focuses on the rights of EU citizens in the UK and UK citizens in the EU. However, it does include provisions for certain family members, including non-EU parents of British children, to ensure their rights are protected during and after the UK's withdrawal from the EU.

Note: The average person with cognitive impairment has an IQ of 65. Einstein's IQ was 165. ChatGPT 4's IQ is around 155. ChatGPT 6 (when released) will be several times smarter than the smartest human.

[marcidevpal]

Hey ChatGPT 3.5! What are the criteria for non-EU parents of British children to be eligible for residence rights under the WA?

Under the Withdrawal Agreement, non-EU parents of British children can be eligible for residence rights if they meet certain criteria. The specific requirements may vary depending on individual circumstances, but here are some key points to consider:

1. The child must be a British citizen: To be eligible, the child in question must hold British citizenship. This typically includes children who were born in the UK and have at least one British parent.

2. The parent-child relationship must be genuine: The parent must have a genuine parental relationship with the British child. This can be established through various means, such as legal documentation, custody agreements, or proof of financial and emotional support.

3. The parent must be the primary caregiver: The non-EU parent should be actively involved in the child's upbringing and must have assumed primary responsibility for their care. This could be demonstrated through evidence of day-to-day involvement, such as providing accommodation, financial support, and being involved in the child's education or healthcare decisions.

4. The child must be under a certain age: The eligibility criteria may specify an age limit for the child. Generally, children under the age of 18 are more likely to be covered by these provisions, but there can be exceptions in certain circumstances.

It's important to note that individual circumstances can vary, and specific eligibility requirements may differ based on factors like the immigration rules in place at the time and any subsequent updates or agreements. It's advisable to consult the relevant authorities, such as UK Visas and Immigration or an immigration lawyer, for precise and up-to-date information based on your specific situation.

You see? Nothing here about Appendix FM being a disqualifier for UK Zambrano carers for settlement. The Home Office's requirements about Appendix FM is unlawful and should have been challenged a long time ago.

[Wishfulgirl]

Hey ChatGPT 3.5! What are the criteria for non-EU parents of British children to be eligible for residence rights under the WA?

Under the Withdrawal Agreement, non-EU parents of British children can be eligible for residence rights if they meet certain criteria. The specific requirements may vary depending on individual circumstances, but here are some key points to consider:

1. The child must be a British citizen: To be eligible, the child in question must hold British citizenship. This typically includes children who were born in the UK and have at least one British parent.

2. The parent-child relationship must be genuine: The parent must have a genuine parental relationship with the British child. This can be established through various means, such as legal documentation, custody agreements, or proof of financial and emotional support.

3. The parent must be the primary caregiver: The non-EU parent should be actively involved in the child's upbringing and must have assumed primary responsibility for their care. This could be demonstrated through evidence of day-to-day involvement, such as providing accommodation, financial support, and being involved in the child's education or healthcare decisions.

4. The child must be under a certain age: The eligibility criteria may specify an age limit for the child. Generally, children under the age of 18 are more likely to be covered by these provisions, but there can be exceptions in certain circumstances.

It's important to note that individual circumstances can vary, and specific eligibility requirements may differ based on factors like the immigration rules in place at the time and any subsequent updates or agreements. It's advisable to consult the relevant authorities, such as UK Visas and Immigration or an immigration lawyer, for precise and up-to-date information based on your specific situation.

You see? Nothing here about Appendix FM being a disqualifier for UK Zambrano carers for settlement. The Home Office's requirements about Appendix FM is unlawful and should have been challenged a long time ago.

Good Morning Marcidevpal,

It is so sad to see the above because I met all these conditions and the Judge clearly seen it as such but because of the Home Office’s policy regarding Appendix FM it was clearly taken away from me. I’ll never understand the need to force us down the Appendix FM route for another 10 years when the evidence shows we’re all clearly eligible for settlement under Appendix EU (Zambrano) it’s mind blowing.


Thank you for you recommendation for using ChatGPT, it is amazing and very helpful. It will go along with helping me with my appeal as well as any further information for the future.

Regarding the letter I needed to send to the Home Office, would this be by the same email I sent my appeal bundle or is it something else?

[marcidevpal]

Regarding the letter I needed to send to the Home Office, would this be by the same email I sent my appeal bundle or is it something else?

Good morning Wishfulgirl,

Yes, the legal team that is handling your appeal at the Home Office should be made aware of your offer.

Just to be sure, I would also cc the EUSS complaints team at the Home Office. This is all I could find -

https://eu-settled-status-enquiries.ser ... okie-check

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... ation-form

https://www.gov.uk/complain-uk-visas-immigration

or on complaints@homeoffice.gov.uk I think there is an administrative review email, too.

Earlier, I said to give them a week to decide. I take that back. I think we both know they aren't going to decide in a week. I would give them a month to accept your offer. If they accept your offer after you have been granted permission to appeal, you can just write to the Court and let them know that you want to put your appeal on hold because you are in negotiations with the Home Office.

[marcidevpal]

Sample letter

[Your Name]
[Your Address]
[City, Postal Code]
[Email Address]
[Phone Number]
[Date]

Rt Hon. Priti Patel MP
Secretary of State for the Home Department
Home Office
2 Marsham Street
London SW1P 4DF

Dear Secretary of State,

I hope this letter finds you well. I am writing to respectfully request your reconsideration of the decision to refuse my recent visa application. I believe there may have been misunderstandings or miscommunications during the assessment process, and I kindly ask for your assistance in working together to provide the necessary evidence to prove my right to permanent residence in the United Kingdom.

Firstly, I would like to express my appreciation for the diligent work carried out by the Home Office in ensuring the integrity and security of the UK immigration system. I understand the importance of thorough evaluations to maintain the country's immigration policies. However, I firmly believe that a reconsideration of my case is warranted due to the following reasons:

The Withdrawal Agreement is a legally binding international treaty between the European Union (EU) and the United Kingdom (UK). The Withdrawal Agreement was ratified by both the EU and the UK, and it has the force of law in both jurisdictions. It provides a legal framework for the orderly withdrawal of the UK from the EU and aims to ensure a smooth transition and the protection of rights and obligations for individuals and businesses affected by the withdrawal.

The Withdrawal Agreement includes provisions that protect the rights of non-EU parents of British children. Under the agreement, these parents are eligible for residence rights in the UK, allowing them to live, work, and access public services. This provision is aimed at ensuring the unity of families and safeguarding the rights of children who are British citizens. To be eligible for these rights, non-EU parents of British children must meet certain criteria outlined in the Withdrawal Agreement. Although the Withdrawal Agreement primarily focuses on the rights of EU citizens in the UK and UK citizens in the EU, it does include provisions for certain family members, including non-EU parents of British children, to ensure their rights are protected during and after the UK's withdrawal from the EU.

Under the Withdrawal Agreement, non-EU parents of British children can be eligible for residence rights if they meet certain criteria: To be eligible, the child in question must hold British citizenship. This typically includes children who were born in the UK and have at least one British parent. The parent must have a genuine parental relationship with the British child. This can be established through various means, such as legal documentation, custody agreements, or proof of financial and emotional support. The non-EU parent should be actively involved in the child's upbringing and must have assumed primary responsibility for their care. This could be demonstrated through evidence of day-to-day involvement, such as providing accommodation, financial support, and being involved in the child's education or healthcare decisions. The eligibility criteria may specify an age limit for the child. Generally, children under the age of 18 are more likely to be covered by these provisions, but there can be exceptions in certain circumstances.

Eventhough I applied as a Zambrano carer, I am also a family member who completed 5 years residence. Since I obtained the right to permanent residence, my residence rights have not ended. The FtT judge accepted I am a family member and a Zambrano carer. He also accepted the fact that I have resided continuously in the UK since YYYY. The WA gives family members the right to permanent residence after five years. This right can not be taken away unless the applicant leaves the UK for 5 years. Title 2, Chapter 1, Article 18 of the Withdrawal Agreement says the host country must help applicants to prove their eligibility and to avoid any errors or omissions in their applications and give applicants the opportunity to furnish supplementary evidence and to correct any deficiencies, errors or omissions.

I am committed to cooperating fully with the Home Office and providing any additional information required to facilitate a fair assessment of my situation. I am confident that, with your support, we can address any concerns or doubts regarding my eligibility for permanent residence.

Furthermore, I would like to emphasize my contributions to the UK community during my time here. I have been actively involved in various community initiatives, volunteering my time and skills to support local charities and organizations. I strongly believe in the values and principles that underpin the United Kingdom, and I am committed to making positive contributions to society.

I understand that the Home Office is responsible for safeguarding the interests of the nation and ensuring compliance with immigration regulations. In light of this, I would be grateful for the opportunity to meet with you or a representative from your department to discuss my case further. Such a meeting would enable me to provide additional information and address any concerns directly, thereby helping to establish a clearer picture of my situation.

I kindly request that you review my case with the utmost consideration and undertake a thorough reassessment of the available information. I am confident that, upon careful examination, the decision to refuse my visa application can be reconsidered in a fair and just manner.

Thank you for your attention to this matter. I request confirmation of receipt as soon as possible and a response within 20 business days. I look forward to the opportunity to work collaboratively with you and the Home Office to demonstrate my right to permanent residence in the United Kingdom.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Name]

[marcidevpal]

President Lane, Pre-settled status case, Appendix FM

In the recent case about pre-settled status, President Lane said it was unlawful for the Home Office to require pre-settled people to apply for settled status after 2.5 years, or lose their status.

The President looked at the Withdrawal Agreement, looked at Appendix EU, and said nothing in the Withdrawal Agreement required another application. Therefore, Appendix EU was unlawful - in this regard.

If we accept that Zambrano carers are covered by the Withdrawal Agreement - even if only in a tiny way - we can conduct the same exercise. The Agreement does not say anything about Appendix FM being a disqualifier for permanent residence. Appendix EU does. Appendix EU is therefore unlawful, in the same way asking people to submit a further application for settlement is unlawful.

The key difference between the pre-settled people and Zambrano carers is that submitting an application is not anywhere near as damaging as refusing people the right to permanent residence.

[marcidevpal]

What bothers me about the FtT judge's decision is this: he equates any discussion of human rights with Appendix FM.

Appendix FM is an application one makes when they literally have no other basis for being in the UK.

It is not the category 'where human rights are considered'.

Human rights can be raised on any part of the Immigration Rules. That includes Appendix EU.

When judges refuse to consider how an Appendix may violate human rights, they abandon their responsibilities under the ECHR, the UN Conventions and the UK's Human Rights Act.

Besides, the Political Declaration calls on judges to consider ECHR and the Withdrawal Agreement protects the European Charter of Fundamental Rights.

See the Charter here - https://www.europarl.europa.eu/charter/pdf/text_en.pdf

Article 8 ECHR right to family and private life is like Article 7 of the Charter, right to family and private life.

[Wishfulgirl]

What bothers me about the FtT judge's decision is this: he equates any discussion of human rights with Appendix FM.

Appendix FM is an application one makes when they literally have no other basis for being in the UK.

It is not the category 'where human rights are considered'.

Human rights can be raised on any part of the Immigration Rules. That includes Appendix EU.

When judges refuse to consider how an Appendix may violate human rights, they abandon their responsibilities under the ECHR, the UN Conventions and the UK's Human Rights Act.

Besides, the Political Declaration calls on judges to consider ECHR and the Withdrawal Agreement protects the European Charter of Fundamental Rights.

See the Charter here - https://www.europarl.europa.eu/charter/pdf/text_en.pdf

Article 8 ECHR right to family and private life is like Article 7 of the Charter, right to family and private life.

That’s the information I’ve gathered on this forum overtime. Why is the decision left with the Home Office regarding whether a judge considers human rights under Appendix EU particularly in our case ( Zambrano)

When the ball is in the Home Office’s Court, Of course they will say to the Judges “No you cannot consider human rights claim “ That way it becomes more difficult for us.

I mean why would they? They know very well if the go ahead is given within an appeal to apply human rights in majority of ( Zambrano) cases, just as it is under Appendix FM, the majority of Zambrano carer would win and they cannot allow that to happen. It is very sad though, I made the Zambrano application 2021 and here I am almost 2 years later and none the closer to being successful.

[marcidevpal]

Why is the decision left with the Home Office regarding whether a judge considers human rights under Appendix EU particularly in our case ( Zambrano)

The rule was initially passed to stop people from raising human rights considerations - after - the Home Office had already considered human rights.

The Home Office an judges are allowing the rule to be misapplied to all applications.

With the EUSS applications, the Home Office admit in their EUSS refusal letter that they have not considered human rights.

Therefore, people have never had their human rights considered but are still blocked from having human rights assessed in Court.

The judges must know this.

The European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) and Human Rights Act (HRA) are very clear that judges must consider human rights where relevant if the applicant raises it.

That's why the Celik case is so important. It is a challenge to the idea that judges can refuse to consider human rights because of some random rule.

Call me cyncial, but I believe the goal is to get as many Zambrano carers and derivative card holders over to Appendix FM as possible.

Once everyone has moved over to Appendix FM, they will acknowledge that the rule was wrong and pretend it never happened.

[marcidevpal]

Hi Wishfulgirl,

You and Celik match in (at least) two ways. One, neither judge is willing to consider your human rights. A lot of people have this complaint.

Two, you both filled out the wrong form! Celik should have applied under the EEA Regulations and then under EUSS. You should have applied for EUSS as a family member instead of a Zambrano carer - although it shouldn't matter either way, as both groups should get settlement.

I am not sure why you wouldn't mention Celik... .Anyway, if the Court of Appeal agrees the Home Office should have worked with Celik to help him fill out the correct forms, that same argument applies to you.

Article 18(1)(r) says the following:

the applicant shall have access to judicial and, where appropriate, administrative redress procedures in the host State against any decision refusing to grant the residence status.

The redress procedures shall allow for an examination of the legality of the decision, as well as of the facts and circumstances on which the proposed decision is based.

Such redress procedures shall ensure that the decision is not disproportionate.

So, your judge needs to ask if the Home Office's refusal to help you is proportionate and reasonable.

(o) the competent authorities of the host State shall help the applicants to prove their eligibility
and to avoid any errors or omissions in their applications; they shall give the applicants the
opportunity to furnish supplementary evidence and to correct any deficiencies, errors or
omissions;

Also, Article 4 says

The provisions of this Agreement and the provisions of Union law made applicable by this
Agreement shall produce in respect of and in the United Kingdom the same legal effects as those
which they produce within the Union and its Member States.

Accordingly, legal or natural persons shall in particular be able to rely directly on the provisions
contained or referred to in this Agreement which meet the conditions for direct effect under Union
law.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... munity.pdf

[marcidevpal]

ChatGPT - Create and/or Edit your submissions

ChatGPT (or Bard, if you prefer Google) can create draft content but it can also EDIT your draft content, too.

I asked ChatGPT (version 4) to edit an earlier paragraph (see above posts). Here's what it provided:

Even though I initially applied as a Zambrano carer, I am also a family member who has completed five years of residence in the UK. Since obtaining the right to permanent residence, my residency rights have remained intact. The judge at the First-tier Tribunal (FtT) acknowledged both my status as a family member and a Zambrano carer, and also recognized my continuous residence in the UK since YYYY. According to the Withdrawal Agreement (WA), family members are entitled to permanent residence after five years, which cannot be revoked unless the applicant leaves the UK for a continuous period of five years. Under Title 2, Chapter 1, Article 18 of the Withdrawal Agreement, the host country is obligated to assist applicants in proving their eligibility, ensuring there are no errors or omissions in their applications, and granting them the opportunity to provide supplementary evidence and rectify any deficiencies, errors, or omissions.

[marcidevpal]

Hi Wishfulgirl,

Celik had two organisations make interventions on his behalf. One even wrote letters to the Home Office.

Even if you can't find a lawyer, you may be able to get an organisation to write letters or join your legal challenge.

Also, there is a massive community on other social media platforms for EU nationals (and their family members) applying to EUSS.

[Wishfulgirl]

Hi Wishfulgirl,

Celik had two organisations make interventions on his behalf. One even wrote letters to the Home Office.

Even if you can't find a lawyer, you may be able to get an organisation to write letters or join your legal challenge.

Also, there is a massive community on other social media platforms for EU nationals (and their family members) applying to EUSS.

Good afternoon Marcidevpal,

Thanks for the suggestion, I will look into this it really would be helpful if anyone here can suggest a solicitor( I've saved up for a solicitor specifically for this day should it came to pass, now that is here, I'd really appreciate a suggestion from someone who knows a good solicitor not one who will take my funds and not make the effort. )

Marcidevpal , I have gone ahead and sent the letter to the Home office I'll now wait and see their response. Moving on....

Regarding my appeal, I am gonna start preparing the letter today, Is it best point referencing all identified errors of law then explaining the case laws separately. Or just pinpoint the errors and that's it's.

( Even though the judge may disregard it) Can I still use human rights claim as another point of error of law?

Btw, ChatGpt is brilliant, I wish I knew about it when I was making my appeal back in December.

[Wishfulgirl]

Hi Wishfulgirl,

Celik had two organisations make interventions on his behalf. One even wrote letters to the Home Office.

Even if you can't find a lawyer, you may be able to get an organisation to write letters or join your legal challenge.

Also, there is a massive community on other social media platforms for EU nationals (and their family members) applying to EUSS.

I have just had a look again at the appeal decision and it said it was heard at Taylor house on the 19th june 2023 and the decision and reason promulgated on the 07th July 2023 but it was signed on the 1st July 2023.

When does the 14 days start for the appeal? Is is the 07th?

[marcidevpal]

Is it best point referencing all identified errors of law then explaining the case laws separately. Or just pinpoint the errors and that's it's.
When does the 14 days start for the appeal?

Hi Wishfulgirl,

The 14 days starts from the day you receive it. I assume you got an email?

Permission to appeal
I would just make a list of all the points you want to make. Here's what ChatGPT suggests:

Prompt used for ChatGPT: How do I structure the reasons for an application for permission to appeal in the UK?

When structuring the reasons for an application for permission to appeal in the UK, it is essential to provide a clear and concise explanation of the grounds on which you are seeking permission to appeal. Here is a suggested structure for presenting the reasons:

Introduction:
Begin with a brief opening statement expressing your intention to seek permission to appeal against the decision.
Clearly state the case reference number and the name of the judge who made the decision.

Grounds of Appeal:
Present each ground of appeal in a separate paragraph, numbered or labeled for clarity.
For each ground of appeal, clearly state the specific legal error, procedural irregularity, or misinterpretation of facts or law that forms the basis for your appeal.
Provide a concise explanation of how the error or irregularity impacted the decision and why it warrants reconsideration.

Supporting Evidence:
Mention that you have attached all relevant supporting documents, such as the decision letter and any additional evidence, to strengthen your case.
Indicate that these documents are enclosed for the tribunal's review.

Compliance with Deadlines and Procedures:
Assure the tribunal that you understand the strict requirements for obtaining permission to appeal.
State your commitment to adhere to all necessary deadlines and procedures if permission to appeal is granted.
Express your willingness to provide any additional information or attend further hearings as required.

Conclusion:
Request the tribunal's thorough consideration of your application for permission to appeal.
Express your belief that the grounds presented merit a reconsideration of the decision.
Conclude with a respectful and hopeful tone, indicating your trust in the fairness of the process.

Remember to maintain a clear and logical flow throughout your application, using concise and precise language to convey your points effectively. Ensure that your reasons are grounded in legal principles and supported by relevant facts and evidence.

[Wishfulgirl]

Is it best point referencing all identified errors of law then explaining the case laws separately. Or just pinpoint the errors and that's it's.
When does the 14 days start for the appeal?

Hi Wishfulgirl,

The 14 days starts from the day you receive it. I assume you got an email?

Permission to appeal
I would just make a list of all the points you want to make. Here's what ChatGPT suggests:

Prompt used for ChatGPT: How do I structure the reasons for an application for permission to appeal in the UK?

When structuring the reasons for an application for permission to appeal in the UK, it is essential to provide a clear and concise explanation of the grounds on which you are seeking permission to appeal. Here is a suggested structure for presenting the reasons:

Introduction:
Begin with a brief opening statement expressing your intention to seek permission to appeal against the decision.
Clearly state the case reference number and the name of the judge who made the decision.

Grounds of Appeal:
Present each ground of appeal in a separate paragraph, numbered or labeled for clarity.
For each ground of appeal, clearly state the specific legal error, procedural irregularity, or misinterpretation of facts or law that forms the basis for your appeal.
Provide a concise explanation of how the error or irregularity impacted the decision and why it warrants reconsideration.

Supporting Evidence:
Mention that you have attached all relevant supporting documents, such as the decision letter and any additional evidence, to strengthen your case.
Indicate that these documents are enclosed for the tribunal's review.

Compliance with Deadlines and Procedures:
Assure the tribunal that you understand the strict requirements for obtaining permission to appeal.
State your commitment to adhere to all necessary deadlines and procedures if permission to appeal is granted.
Express your willingness to provide any additional information or attend further hearings as required.

Conclusion:
Request the tribunal's thorough consideration of your application for permission to appeal.
Express your belief that the grounds presented merit a reconsideration of the decision.
Conclude with a respectful and hopeful tone, indicating your trust in the fairness of the process.

Remember to maintain a clear and logical flow throughout your application, using concise and precise language to convey your points effectively. Ensure that your reasons are grounded in legal principles and supported by relevant facts and evidence.

Thank you very much for this. I received the decision on the 7th so that means 14 days from that date. Got it!

Any idea how long or short the permission to appeal normally takes to be looked at ? ( A week, A month, Months? ) I don't mind the wait, I just like to have an idea to put my overthinking mind at ease.

[marcidevpal]

Any idea how long or short the permission to appeal normally takes to be looked at ?

Well, there are many factors to consider. People will be taking holidays. Also, because you mentioned your anxiety issues, they will probably try to match you with a judge who can communicate in an appropriate manner. If you raise Celik, that could delay it. If you raise the pending Akinsanya judicial review, that could also delay it.

But, then again, it is just a permission request. If you write it clearly, someone should be able to get through it pretty quickly. It's really up to the courts. Your file may get bundled in with other people's and get seen quickly. I suspect the EUSS appeals are calming down, but I wouldn't be surprised if the asylum appeals are ramping up.

You may want to develop a coping strategy for if and when you feel stressed. It could take months. The key thing is to listen to the warning signs from your body - a headache, heart palpilation, tense neck or shoulders, etc. - and take action with the coping strategy. You can always come onto this forum and vent. Others prefer things that take their mind off this ridiculous situation. Or, do both.

[Wishfulgirl]

Any idea how long or short the permission to appeal normally takes to be looked at ?

Well, there are many factors to consider. People will be taking holidays. Also, because you mentioned your anxiety issues, they will probably try to match you with a judge who can communicate in an appropriate manner. If you raise Celik, that could delay it. If you raise the pending Akinsanya judicial review, that could also delay it.

But, then again, it is just a permission request. If you write it clearly, someone should be able to get through it pretty quickly. It's really up to the courts. Your file may get bundled in with other people's and get seen quickly. I suspect the EUSS appeals are calming down, but I wouldn't be surprised if the asylum appeals are ramping up.

You may want to develop a coping strategy for if and when you feel stressed. It could take months. The key thing is to listen to the warning signs from your body - a headache, heart palpilation, tense neck or shoulders, etc. - and take action with the coping strategy. You can always come onto this forum and vent. Others prefer things that take their mind off this ridiculous situation. Or, do both.

Good Morning Marcidevpal,

You're right, I come here day to day to read your post ( or anyone who might post ) to get an idea on zambrano update or anything pertaining to zambrano.

My biggest concern and worry is, with the recent appeal dismissed, my situation may have became a little bit more complex living wise, this is because I did not renew the flr when it expired in 2022 because I am still relying on the COA for benefits, housing etc and (If they refuse to acknowledge my retained rights) I may be seen as an over stayer. (if) and when I exhaust all my appeal rights, this could put myself and my children in a destitute situation which will immediately prompt an application under Appendix FM.

[marcidevpal]

This could put myself and my children in a destitute situation which will immediately prompt an application under Appendix FM.

I really think you should start expanding your network today. Here are some ways:

- Contact organisations that support EU nationals and family members in the EU settlement scheme
- Find pro bono law firms.

For example, on google search for either " "pro bono immigration lawyer uk" or "non-profit organisation of EU citizens in the UK"

Go to the Upper Tribunal's website on https://tribunalsdecisions.service.gov.uk/utiac/ Enter search terms like "EUSS" or "Zambrano". Look at EUSS cases. Find lawyers who represented EUSS applicants. Email those firms. Ask ChatGPT to help you write the email.

Find the group for EUSS applicants on Facebook.

It is good you are ready to file under FM. It is your plan B. Just have the application ready to file if you lose.