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Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

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Katie_France
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Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 3:20 pm

My mother is retired. My father passed away in March and I applied for her visitor visa to come and visit us. I was not able to attend the funeral as my ILR was still in review, and it is still not granted. My husband (British citizen) was a sponsor for my mother's visa. We stated in the application that she would like to visit my husband, his mother, and me for compassionate reasons: to grieve the loss of my father and her husband.
The decision
I have refused your application for a visit visa because I am not satisfied that you meet the
requirements of paragraph(s) V4.2 to V14 of Appendix V: Immigration Rules for visitors
because:
• You have applied to enter the UK for the purpose of tourism and to visit your
daughter. I acknowledge the documents you have submitted from your sponsors.
However, I note that your daughter has claimed Indefinite Leave to Remain in the
UK. Given your daughter's immigration history, I am not satisfied that you are a
genuine visitor and that your ties to Russia are greater than the UK.
• You state that you are retired, receiving an annual income of £10,100 from your
pension. In support of your application, you have supplied documents in relation to
your pension and copies of your personal bank statement. I note that the credits and
balances in your account are not consistent with your declared income. There are
multiple deposits seen throughout your account and the origin of these deposits are
unknown to me. As a result, I am not satisfied you have accurately presented your
circumstances, leading me to doubt your intentions on visiting.
• In light of the above, I am not satisfied that you intend leave the UK at the end of your
visit or that you are genuinely seeking entry as a visitor. Therefore your application is
refused under paragraphs V4.2 (a) & (c) of Appendix V.

What this means for you
Any future UK visa applications you make will be considered on their individual merits,
however, you are likely to be refused unless the circumstances of your application change.
In relation to this decision, there is no right of appeal or right to administrative review.

Any grounds for me to appeal based on Article 8? PAP? Judicial review? Complaint to MP?

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CR001
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Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by CR001 » Sun Aug 20, 2023 3:31 pm

What ties did she show to her home country?

What are the various deposits in her bank account that werent explained where they come from?

You cant appeal a visitor visa.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:09 pm

Ties to home country - only property: 2 apartments, 2 land plots, one with house on it, 2 garages.
From VAF:
Income and expenditure
- Do you have another income or any savings?
Other regular additional income, Savings
- What kind of regular additional income do you have?
Allowance or regular money from your family, Pension
- Total amount of regular additional income that you
get in a year
10100.00 GBP
How much money do you have in savings (in GBP)?
3800.00 GBP

Movement of funds for my mothers bank account was provided, but the bank gave a weird statement, which reflected pension and the rest was like Debit and Credit, without stating what the transactions were.
Date of transaction Transaction name Transaction amount Deposit balance
21.12.2022 Credit 56.56 30697.97
21.12.2022 Credit 56.56 30754.53
29.12.2022 Pension 23432.91 54187.44
16.01.2023 Debit -200.00 53987.44
20.01.2023 Credit 5.09 53992.53
25.01.2023 Debit -31000.00 22992.53

My mother's pension equals £2695.01 a year. The rest is what my father was transferring to her account ( we did not explain those transactions), as thought that full sponsorship from my husband (British citizen) will be enough (good salary, payslips, and bank statement were provided).
She also submitted a certificate from the Bank stating she had :
- One account in the amount of £1911
- Second account in the amount of £9197.79
- Third account in the amount of £3937.5

Now my mother will be dependent on me, I have to replace the income my father had. But we have not stated that in the invitation letter or anywhere else. Does it mean I can never host my mother, especially after I suddenly lost my father?

meself2
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Ireland

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by meself2 » Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:40 pm

Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:09 pm
The rest is what my father was transferring to her account ( we did not explain those transactions), as thought that full sponsorship from my husband (British citizen) will be enough (good salary, payslips, and bank statement were provided).
Even though your mother has a sponsor, it does not mean your financial statements are taken into account. You would've had to explain the money movements in her bank statements in a cover letter.
Also, consider this from the visa officer's point of view - if your motehr has room, board and her daughter abroad, what would make her come back? It's not impossible, but challenging.
Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:09 pm
She also submitted a certificate from the Bank stating she had :
- One account in the amount of £1911
- Second account in the amount of £9197.79
- Third account in the amount of £3937.5
Showing account balance (that she has the money) is different from showing statements (transaction histories), as ECO would want to amek sure your mother did not put 10k pounds on her account just to show it for the visa, for example.
Not a qualified immigration adviser. Use links and references given to gain confirmation and/or extra information.

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 5:05 pm

meself2 wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:40 pm
Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:09 pm
The rest is what my father was transferring to her account ( we did not explain those transactions), as thought that full sponsorship from my husband (British citizen) will be enough (good salary, payslips, and bank statement were provided).
Even though your mother has a sponsor, it does not mean your financial statements are taken into account. You would've had to explain the money movements in her bank statements in a cover letter.
Also, consider this from the visa officer's point of view - if your mother has room, board, and her daughter is abroad, what would make her come back? It's not impossible, but challenging.
Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:09 pm
She also submitted a certificate from the Bank stating she had :
- One account in the amount of £1911
- Second account in the amount of £9197.79
- Third account in the amount of £3937.5
Showing account balance (that she has the money) is different from showing statements (transaction histories), as ECO would want to make sure your mother did not put 10k pounds on her account just to show it for the visa, for example.
So what is the way out? Of course, she has room, board, and me, her daughter, and it will never change. She cannot find a job due to her age and retirement. I am looking for a solution in the situation.

Bank statements were provided together with the movement of funds.

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 5:11 pm

Also, I forgot to mention, she already had a UK visa in 2019, and came to stay with us for a week. No breaches.

meself2
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Ireland

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by meself2 » Sun Aug 20, 2023 5:46 pm

There's no magic recipe for this. She would have to reapply after some time, better prepared, with better documents. Unfortuantely, things changed a lot since 2019 for obvious reasons.

I've outlined issue I've noticed based on the information given (I don't know the full list) - financial statements need to be explained, despite sponshorsip. You have to show to ECO, where do money come from and how does your mother earn it, in a cover letter, or even make an excel sheet, etc if it's too complicated. You can see ECO assumed 10000 is the whole pension amount, which doesn't seem to be true from your explanation.
Other members can provide better analysis.

Also maybe ask for a faster decision on compassionate grounds wrt your ILR? (see post2080846.html#p2080846 )
Not a qualified immigration adviser. Use links and references given to gain confirmation and/or extra information.

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 6:10 pm

meself2 wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 5:46 pm
There's no magic recipe for this. She would have to reapply after some time, better prepared, with better documents. Unfortuantely, things changed a lot since 2019 for obvious reasons.

I've outlined issue I've noticed based on the information given (I don't know the full list) - financial statements need to be explained, despite sponshorsip. You have to show to ECO, where do money come from and how does your mother earn it, in a cover letter, or even make an excel sheet, etc if it's too complicated. You can see ECO assumed 10000 is the whole pension amount, which doesn't seem to be true from your explanation.
Other members can provide better analysis.

Also maybe ask for a faster decision on compassionate grounds wrt your ILR? (see post2080846.html#p2080846 )
Thanks for your response. My mother does not have earnings, and she will not. She had money transferred to her account from my father, who passed away. Further, she will be receiving money from me + that little pension.

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Frontier Mole
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European Union

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Frontier Mole » Sun Aug 20, 2023 9:52 pm

Given the financial situation for your mother it will be doubtful that any future explanation is actually going to help. It might in fact make things worse as it will point to a false declaration in the first application.

There is also the small matter of a mass exodus from Russia in general, and the U.K. is not sympathetic to the migration of Russian nationals into the U.K. especially those with little to return to Russia in any case.

There is also a suggestion that your immigration history is a concern and has been considered in the decision too. I am assuming your previous history has been poor? If it included overstaying then that points very firmly to you and your husband by default are not considered good sponsors

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 10:46 pm

Frontier Mole wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 9:52 pm
Given the financial situation for your mother it will be doubtful that any future explanation is actually going to help. It might in fact make things worse as it will point to a false declaration in the first application.

There is also the small matter of a mass exodus from Russia in general, and the U.K. is not sympathetic to the migration of Russian nationals into the U.K. especially those with little to return to Russia in any case.

There is also a suggestion that your immigration history is a concern and has been considered in the decision too. I am assuming your previous history has been poor? If it included overstaying then that points very firmly to you and your husband by default are not considered good sponsors
What do you mean by false declaration? The declaration was income from Allowance or regular money from your family, Pension. We never declared that it was only a pension.

I wonder a lot about that comment on immigration, actually absolutely shocked. I never overstayed, had fiance visa refused due to the ECO not accepting the correct English test (I had UKVI General, but they somehow wanted Family test). I received a spousal visa after that and applied for ILR on it...

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Sun Aug 20, 2023 10:48 pm

What can be my options? PAP, Judicial review, a complaint to MP? No right of appeal even under Article 8?

meself2
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Ireland

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by meself2 » Mon Aug 21, 2023 12:08 am

Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 10:46 pm
I wonder a lot about that comment on immigration, actually absolutely shocked.
Maybe you should get a SAR and see what HO has on you, once ILR is obtained (or before).
Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 10:48 pm
No right of appeal even under Article 8?
Article 8 and its implementation in UK might be tricky, see, for example, https://freemovement.org.uk/article-8-r ... in-the-uk/ about family life in the UK.
Not a qualified immigration adviser. Use links and references given to gain confirmation and/or extra information.

lolo2
Senior Member
Posts: 733
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 8:14 pm
Venezuela

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by lolo2 » Mon Aug 21, 2023 10:02 am

Katie_France wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2023 3:20 pm
Given your daughter's immigration history, I am not satisfied that you are a
genuine visitor and that your ties to Russia are greater than the UK.
I think it's the first time I see this reason for a visitors visa refusal. Also noted that they put this as the first bullet point!

People with ILR/citizenship have successfully sponsored family members to visit the UK, if that's the case. They might be referring something else?

As advised before, perhaps it's worth requesting a SAR to investigate this further.

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Frontier Mole
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Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Frontier Mole » Mon Aug 21, 2023 11:54 am

I think you are missing the point, there is no absolute right for non U.K. citizens to enter the country. The U.K. is entitled to decide who can have a visit visa and who can’t. Your mother has minimal actual income and appears is greatly supported by you. There are no major ties to her country if she was to leave. It is not unreasonable to conclude the reason for the visit is to enter the U.K. with the intention to remain. I believe you have not stated what the length of the visit was to be?

Russia is a country of concern at the best of times, now because of the Ukrainian war it is now far more difficult for Russian citizens to enter the U.K. Hundreds of thousands ( some reports say over a million) of Russian citizens have fled the country since the war, the country is descending further and further into a chaotic state as sanctions increasingly bite. The economy is broken and corruption is even more rife. I totally get why people want to escape the country. However that does not give them the right to come to the U.K. on a visit visa. What the current circumstances in Russia points to is that there is a greatly increased risk of non-return to Russia and I believe that risk is reflected in the refusal of the visit visa.

The circumstances you have outlined would readily point to the intention to remain in the U.K. in fact that is a point you have not absolutely refuted. The other side of the equation- you are free to visit your mother in Russia so it is not a case that you are not prevented from doing so.

It would seam that you put emphasis on the fact that your husband is a U.K. citizen and you are heading for ILR - neither of those points give additional rights or weight to your mother’s application.

I will follow this case with interest to see what outcome is finally achieved.

Katie_France
Member
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 pm
Russia

Re: Received refusal for my mother's visitor visa application

Post by Katie_France » Mon Aug 21, 2023 3:09 pm

Frontier Mole wrote:
Mon Aug 21, 2023 11:54 am
I think you are missing the point, there is no absolute right for non U.K. citizens to enter the country. The U.K. is entitled to decide who can have a visit visa and who can’t. Your mother has minimal actual income and appears is greatly supported by you. There are no major ties to her country if she was to leave. It is not unreasonable to conclude the reason for the visit is to enter the U.K. with the intention to remain. I believe you have not stated what the length of the visit was to be?

Russia is a country of concern at the best of times, now because of the Ukrainian war it is now far more difficult for Russian citizens to enter the U.K. Hundreds of thousands ( some reports say over a million) of Russian citizens have fled the country since the war, the country is descending further and further into a chaotic state as sanctions increasingly bite. The economy is broken and corruption is even more rife. I totally get why people want to escape the country. However that does not give them the right to come to the U.K. on a visit visa. What the current circumstances in Russia points to is that there is a greatly increased risk of non-return to Russia and I believe that risk is reflected in the refusal of the visit visa.

The circumstances you have outlined would readily point to the intention to remain in the U.K. in fact that is a point you have not absolutely refuted. The other side of the equation- you are free to visit your mother in Russia so it is not a case that you are not prevented from doing so.

It would seam that you put emphasis on the fact that your husband is a U.K. citizen and you are heading for ILR - neither of those points give additional rights or weight to your mother’s application.

I will follow this case with interest to see what outcome is finally achieved.
The length of the visit was 2 weeks. The invitation letters were from 2 British citizens: my husband and his mother, as we planned she stays 1 week with us and 1 week with my mother-in-law. They invitation letter was taken from this forum.

I will request SAR of course, but I never breached immigration laws to state it in first bullet point.

Agree about the risks but she came here before. My aunt comes to visit me from time to time , and as a family we never breached immigration laws.

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