Upcoming Ceremony in 2023/4

[meself2]

I'm not stating it is - I give my opinion, and partly frustration.

[sv23367]

I'm not stating it is - I give my opinion, and partly frustration.

i understand my friend. nothing personal. i have my own personal frustration as well.

[Fred13]

Does anyone know or guess what would be the reason of delay from the full completion of eVetting until receiving the acceptance letter (e.e, the letter for 950 e)?
In other word, do the they first check if all the documents are in order and happy with them and then send for eVetting?

It is worth noting that I am an applicant applied in early 2022 and I know the new applicants in 2023 get the eVetting request very early ....

[pyramid stone]

I don't like your behaviour " unfortunately, 2023 applicants will be there too" I applied in 2022 but your hurtful words need to be checked before insulting the others

with 6 ceremonies planned in Dec, there is a possibility to naturalise 6000 people. unfortunately, 2023 applicants will be there too (if they had already completed the payment and waiting for ceremony). i believe that small number will be included and concluded at the next ceremony. 1000 applications from 2023 got processed in that Q. not all of that 1000 were invited for the ceremony. there will be (may be) 50% remaining in that.

[sv23367]

I don't like your behaviour " unfortunately, 2023 applicants will be there too" I applied in 2022 but your hurtful words need to be checked before insulting the others

hello my friend , it was me who wrote those lines. i have no intention to hurt anyone . i am one of the 2023 applicants. i was only highlighting the following , "just like Oct 2023 ceremony, all the previous years applicants along with 2023 applicants will be invited for ceremony".

[User20123]

Does anyone know or guess what would be the reason of delay from the full completion of eVetting until receiving the acceptance letter (e.e, the letter for 950 e)?
In other word, do the they first check if all the documents are in order and happy with them and then send for eVetting?

It is worth noting that I am an applicant applied in early 2022 and I know the new applicants in 2023 get the eVetting request very early ....

We are both in the same boat, Fred. It will be a month and a half since my evetting is complete, and I still have not received the letter. They will not review the documentation again because they have likely already done so. In a FOI discussion, I read that they review the documents at the early stage, and once that is complete, they are in charge of everything.

FYI - I applied early 2022 as well. Feb to be exact.

[sairsint]

First, congratulations to those who have completed the ceremony and are now one step closer to receiving their passports. Huge congratulations to everyone.

I have been silently reading the comments and share your frustration. In the coming weeks, it will have been 19 months for me, and I still have not received the letter to pay 950EUR. Having said that, a person I know from 2021 has waited more than 31 months for his application to be processed and is now pursuing legal action. He patiently waited and didn't make much noise, but it's time for him to take a legal action now.

One of my friend from March 2023 got completed with the process and paid the fees but wasn't invited. It is good that only a handful of applicants from 2023 were invited, regardless of whether or not they have completed the application process.

Priority MUST now be given to the previous year's applicants in order to clear the backlog before addressing this year's applicants. This is beyond dispute. When there is a backlog of nearly 15,000 applicants, it's shocking to see that only 3,000 have been naturalised. It took them one full day to naturalise 3000, and if they host a two-day ceremony in December, they will have naturalised 6,000 people. However, this is not the case, as the two-day ceremony in June naturalised only 4000/5000 applicants. There is no chance they will clear the backlog.

I believe they should either add more secret ceremonies to clear the backlog or waive the ceremony attendance requirement and permit individuals to take the oath elsewhere.

I'm glad to see someone else being vocal in my frustration about how the numbers simply do not add up to what is being said at the MoJ level. There is no possible way for them to naturalise this many applicants when the ceremonies can only accomplish 3,000-4,000 per event and when they are held on average every three months.

If you do the math it will literally be another year to clear the backlog if they insist on having these ceremonies. To be clear, I'm all for celebrating this event, but not when you have tens of thousands of applicants waiting years. Making them wait many more months hoping to be invited to the next ceremony AFTER being approved seems rather pointless. Then they will need to wait another few weeks or a month or more to receive the actual certificate and finally be able to apply for a passport which could take another two months. It's literally mind boggling when the UK can accomplish the same thing in 6 months start to finish.

With the recent Courts and Civil Law bill signed into law this past July, the MoJ can now opt to skip these ceremonies (due to a large backlog) and have the declaration signed by an official E.g. solicitor, peace officer, notary, etc. once an application is approved, but it appears they are not going to do this as I've seen no mention of it.

I really wish a TD would ask the MoJ this question about the forced ceremonies and new legislation because the numbers do not add up to what they are saying about clearing the backlog in a timely manner

[User20123]

First, congratulations to those who have completed the ceremony and are now one step closer to receiving their passports. Huge congratulations to everyone.

I have been silently reading the comments and share your frustration. In the coming weeks, it will have been 19 months for me, and I still have not received the letter to pay 950EUR. Having said that, a person I know from 2021 has waited more than 31 months for his application to be processed and is now pursuing legal action. He patiently waited and didn't make much noise, but it's time for him to take a legal action now.

One of my friend from March 2023 got completed with the process and paid the fees but wasn't invited. It is good that only a handful of applicants from 2023 were invited, regardless of whether or not they have completed the application process.

Priority MUST now be given to the previous year's applicants in order to clear the backlog before addressing this year's applicants. This is beyond dispute. When there is a backlog of nearly 15,000 applicants, it's shocking to see that only 3,000 have been naturalised. It took them one full day to naturalise 3000, and if they host a two-day ceremony in December, they will have naturalised 6,000 people. However, this is not the case, as the two-day ceremony in June naturalised only 4000/5000 applicants. There is no chance they will clear the backlog.

I believe they should either add more secret ceremonies to clear the backlog or waive the ceremony attendance requirement and permit individuals to take the oath elsewhere.

I'm glad to see someone else being vocal in my frustration about how the numbers simply do not add up to what is being said at the MoJ level. There is no possible way for them to naturalise this many applicants when the ceremonies can only accomplish 3,000-4,000 per event and when they are held on average every three months.

If you do the math it will literally be another year to clear the backlog if they insist on having these ceremonies. To be clear, I'm all for celebrating this event, but not when you have tens of thousands of applicants waiting years. Making them wait many more months hoping to be invited to the next ceremony AFTER being approved seems rather pointless. Then they will need to wait another few weeks or a month or more to receive the actual certificate and finally be able to apply for a passport which could take another two months. It's literally mind boggling when the UK can accomplish the same thing in 6 months start to finish.

With the recent Courts and Civil Law bill signed into law this past July, the MoJ can now opt to skip these ceremonies (due to a large backlog) and have the declaration signed by an official E.g. solicitor, peace officer, notary, etc. once an application is approved, but it appears they are not going to do this as I've seen no mention of it.

I really wish a TD would ask the MoJ this question about the forced ceremonies and new legislation because the numbers do not add up to what they are saying about clearing the backlog in a timely manner

I completely agree. They did waive the ceremony during covid and had people take the oath at a solicitor's office and send them the letter. To be honest, I feel helpless at times and am just waiting for the entire process to be completed. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but even questions posed by TDs do not receive adequate responses from the MoJ. It is always a generic response that does not address the question asked.

People from the May batch are still waiting for the evetting, and those who have completed the evetting, such as myself, have not received the letter.

[sairsint]

First, congratulations to those who have completed the ceremony and are now one step closer to receiving their passports. Huge congratulations to everyone.

I have been silently reading the comments and share your frustration. In the coming weeks, it will have been 19 months for me, and I still have not received the letter to pay 950EUR. Having said that, a person I know from 2021 has waited more than 31 months for his application to be processed and is now pursuing legal action. He patiently waited and didn't make much noise, but it's time for him to take a legal action now.

One of my friend from March 2023 got completed with the process and paid the fees but wasn't invited. It is good that only a handful of applicants from 2023 were invited, regardless of whether or not they have completed the application process.

Priority MUST now be given to the previous year's applicants in order to clear the backlog before addressing this year's applicants. This is beyond dispute. When there is a backlog of nearly 15,000 applicants, it's shocking to see that only 3,000 have been naturalised. It took them one full day to naturalise 3000, and if they host a two-day ceremony in December, they will have naturalised 6,000 people. However, this is not the case, as the two-day ceremony in June naturalised only 4000/5000 applicants. There is no chance they will clear the backlog.

I believe they should either add more secret ceremonies to clear the backlog or waive the ceremony attendance requirement and permit individuals to take the oath elsewhere.

I'm glad to see someone else being vocal in my frustration about how the numbers simply do not add up to what is being said at the MoJ level. There is no possible way for them to naturalise this many applicants when the ceremonies can only accomplish 3,000-4,000 per event and when they are held on average every three months.

If you do the math it will literally be another year to clear the backlog if they insist on having these ceremonies. To be clear, I'm all for celebrating this event, but not when you have tens of thousands of applicants waiting years. Making them wait many more months hoping to be invited to the next ceremony AFTER being approved seems rather pointless. Then they will need to wait another few weeks or a month or more to receive the actual certificate and finally be able to apply for a passport which could take another two months. It's literally mind boggling when the UK can accomplish the same thing in 6 months start to finish.

With the recent Courts and Civil Law bill signed into law this past July, the MoJ can now opt to skip these ceremonies (due to a large backlog) and have the declaration signed by an official E.g. solicitor, peace officer, notary, etc. once an application is approved, but it appears they are not going to do this as I've seen no mention of it.

I really wish a TD would ask the MoJ this question about the forced ceremonies and new legislation because the numbers do not add up to what they are saying about clearing the backlog in a timely manner

I completely agree. They did waive the ceremony during covid and had people take the oath at a solicitor's office and send them the letter. To be honest, I feel helpless at times and am just waiting for the entire process to be completed. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but even questions posed by TDs do not receive adequate responses from the MoJ. It is always a generic response that does not address the question asked.

People from the May batch are still waiting for the evetting, and those who have completed the evetting, such as myself, have not received the letter.

I noticed they did waive them during covid and now by law the MoJ can waive them again for reasons of application volume, but seems to not want to do this. I was actually in the process of writing to TD's to ask the MoJ related questions, but ended up changing my mind after reading the repeated, sometimes word-for-word responses by the MoJ to just about every single question they asked on this topic. It was so infuriating that I just didn't bother to send anything. Maybe I should rethink this approach on the need for a ceremony topic.

I am one of the 22 May evetting invitation recipients and still waiting to get the link to start the process. As I've said in many previous postings, if they would simply communicate more often it would likely lower the overall temperature but they refuse to do this. If you email their "Helpdesk" all you get is a canned unhelpful response so that is mostly pointless as well. I do believe the actual problem here is the lack of any accountability. They can do and say what they want with no fear of any repercussions.

I also noticed the wording of the MoJ has changed recently since the DoJ letter from earlier this year which said something to effect that their expectation is the majority of all applicants, including minor cases from 2023 will be naturalised this year. I saw the following recent wording from the MoJ which changes this to they expect that they will have a decision this year, which means you will then wait many more months for a ceremony invite and more months beyond that for the rest of the stuff I previously mentioned. It's a slight change in wording but carries a very large difference in meaning.

"As a result of these changes, the vast majority of files from 2021 and 2022 are now in the final stages of processing and it is expected to make decisions on them this year, wherever possible."

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/qu ... pplication

[Ola2022]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

[User20123]

First, congratulations to those who have completed the ceremony and are now one step closer to receiving their passports. Huge congratulations to everyone.

I have been silently reading the comments and share your frustration. In the coming weeks, it will have been 19 months for me, and I still have not received the letter to pay 950EUR. Having said that, a person I know from 2021 has waited more than 31 months for his application to be processed and is now pursuing legal action. He patiently waited and didn't make much noise, but it's time for him to take a legal action now.

One of my friend from March 2023 got completed with the process and paid the fees but wasn't invited. It is good that only a handful of applicants from 2023 were invited, regardless of whether or not they have completed the application process.

Priority MUST now be given to the previous year's applicants in order to clear the backlog before addressing this year's applicants. This is beyond dispute. When there is a backlog of nearly 15,000 applicants, it's shocking to see that only 3,000 have been naturalised. It took them one full day to naturalise 3000, and if they host a two-day ceremony in December, they will have naturalised 6,000 people. However, this is not the case, as the two-day ceremony in June naturalised only 4000/5000 applicants. There is no chance they will clear the backlog.

I believe they should either add more secret ceremonies to clear the backlog or waive the ceremony attendance requirement and permit individuals to take the oath elsewhere.

I'm glad to see someone else being vocal in my frustration about how the numbers simply do not add up to what is being said at the MoJ level. There is no possible way for them to naturalise this many applicants when the ceremonies can only accomplish 3,000-4,000 per event and when they are held on average every three months.

If you do the math it will literally be another year to clear the backlog if they insist on having these ceremonies. To be clear, I'm all for celebrating this event, but not when you have tens of thousands of applicants waiting years. Making them wait many more months hoping to be invited to the next ceremony AFTER being approved seems rather pointless. Then they will need to wait another few weeks or a month or more to receive the actual certificate and finally be able to apply for a passport which could take another two months. It's literally mind boggling when the UK can accomplish the same thing in 6 months start to finish.

With the recent Courts and Civil Law bill signed into law this past July, the MoJ can now opt to skip these ceremonies (due to a large backlog) and have the declaration signed by an official E.g. solicitor, peace officer, notary, etc. once an application is approved, but it appears they are not going to do this as I've seen no mention of it.

I really wish a TD would ask the MoJ this question about the forced ceremonies and new legislation because the numbers do not add up to what they are saying about clearing the backlog in a timely manner

I completely agree. They did waive the ceremony during covid and had people take the oath at a solicitor's office and send them the letter. To be honest, I feel helpless at times and am just waiting for the entire process to be completed. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but even questions posed by TDs do not receive adequate responses from the MoJ. It is always a generic response that does not address the question asked.

People from the May batch are still waiting for the evetting, and those who have completed the evetting, such as myself, have not received the letter.

I noticed they did waive them during covid and now by law the MoJ can waive them again for reasons of application volume, but seems to not want to do this. I was actually in the process of writing to TD's to ask the MoJ related questions, but ended up changing my mind after reading the repeated, sometimes word-for-word responses by the MoJ to just about every single question they asked on this topic. It was so infuriating that I just didn't bother to send anything. Maybe I should rethink this approach on the need for a ceremony topic.

I am one of the 22 May evetting invitation recipients and still waiting to get the link to start the process. As I've said in many previous postings, if they would simply communicate more often it would likely lower the overall temperature but they refuse to do this. If you email their "Helpdesk" all you get is a canned unhelpful response so that is mostly pointless as well. I do believe the actual problem here is the lack of any accountability. They can do and say what they want with no fear of any repercussions.

I also noticed the wording of the MoJ has changed recently since the DoJ letter from earlier this year which said something to effect that their expectation is the majority of all applicants, including minor cases from 2023 will be naturalised this year. I saw the following recent wording from the MoJ which changes this to they expect that they will have a decision this year, which means you will then wait many more months for a ceremony invite and more months beyond that for the rest of the stuff I previously mentioned. It's a slight change in wording but carries a very large difference in meaning.

"As a result of these changes, the vast majority of files from 2021 and 2022 are now in the final stages of processing and it is expected to make decisions on them this year, wherever possible."

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/qu ... pplication

Yes, I agree. The MoJ's statements are very hard to understand, and if the Citizenship department thinks they'll have a decision on the backlog by the end of the year, they need to find all the resources they can and use them to clear the backlog. I wake up irritated every day these days, considering the decision on my application and how much longer it will take them to process it.

I hope that you at least get your evetting done in the next few days or weeks and are invited to the ceremony.

[User20123]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

[lxk]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Simon Harris as Minister of Justice stated “I am aware of the delays being experienced by Citizenship applicants and I would like to assure those people that everything possible is being done to clear the existing backlogs”.
That statement is clearly untrue as inefficient and time-consuming ceremonies continue.
Unfortunately, Simon Harris also stated that “Applications for naturalisation are dealt with in chronological order.” The Dublin Inquirer reported that statement as being untrue.
Perhaps TDs should be asked to obtain clarification from the Minister for Justice Helen McEntee as she is ultimately responsible for any false information given to the Dáil by Simon Harris?
She should also be asked to explain why she is continuing with ceremonies when she should be following through on her own promises to clear the existing backlogs.
Links:
https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/qu ... 20backlogs
https://dublininquirer.com/2023/07/05/a ... the-queue/

[sairsint]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

[sairsint]

I have just sent my first (rather lengthy) email to a local TD about the need for these ceremonies given the recent amendments to the law and current backlog we have with the hope they raise this issue to the MoJ.

I will wait a bit and give them time to reply. If they don't then I will move on to the next TD until I receive some kind of acceptable answer.

[Fred13]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I am not quite sure if the backlog is only caused due to the lack or limited number of ceremonies, they are also late in sending the acceptance letter and eVetting letters... I myself got all my eVetting sorted and done in nearly 3 months ago and still didn't get the acceptance letter and I am the early 2022 applicant. I also know someone who is still waiting for his eVetting for months (He has received his consent letter eVetting and replied that for eVetting but the eVetting itself has not come yet.).

So I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

[sairsint]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I am not quite sure if the backlog is only caused due to the lack or limited number of ceremonies, they are also late in sending the acceptance letter and eVetting letters... I myself got all my eVetting sorted and done in nearly 3 months ago and still didn't get the acceptance letter and I am the early 2022 applicant. I also know someone who is still waiting for his eVetting for months (He has received his consent letter eVetting and replied that for eVetting but the eVetting itself has not come yet.).

So I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

It's definitely not only the ceremonies but they are a large part of the issue. The process itself takes time as I am still waiting for the evetting link ever since completing the invitation back in May.

That said, we continuously have thousands of approved applicants that cannot move forward simply because they are waiting for a ceremony invitation, sometimes up to 3-6 months after approval. A ceremony that can only manage about 3,000-4,000 applicants. That just seems completely unnecessary when those same applicants could be naturalised (by signing the declaration) and likely have received a passport in that same amount of time.

[lxk]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

There must be a lot of resources used in arranging and being present at ceremonies. How many staff need to travel from their offices and what costs are involved?
By temporarily suspending the ceremony events I'm sure that more time could be found to get on with clearing the backlog. That is why I also think it important to raise the point with TDs.

[sairsint]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

There must be a lot of resources used in arranging and being present at ceremonies. How many staff need to travel from their offices and what costs are involved?
By temporarily suspending the ceremony events I'm sure that more time could be found to get on with clearing the backlog. That is why I also think it important to raise the point with TDs.

That was one of my many points made to them in my email.

[User20123]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I believe that the Minister will not waive the ceremonies, and they want people to attend in person, which makes no sense whatsoever. To be fair, this is all a publicity stunt. They are only interested in publicising the fact that they have granted citizenship to a large number of people, not in clearing the backlog.

I believe that not even TDs can convince MoJ to waive ceremonies in order to clear the backlog. It is evident that even the responses TDs receive are copied and pasted and do not justify the request. Since we have entered the Q4 so I am hoping to get a customer message soon so that we all are updated as to what is happening.

Could you please share your timelines with me? I applied in February 2022.

[User20123]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I am not quite sure if the backlog is only caused due to the lack or limited number of ceremonies, they are also late in sending the acceptance letter and eVetting letters... I myself got all my eVetting sorted and done in nearly 3 months ago and still didn't get the acceptance letter and I am the early 2022 applicant. I also know someone who is still waiting for his eVetting for months (He has received his consent letter eVetting and replied that for eVetting but the eVetting itself has not come yet.).

So I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

It is not a mystery, but rather the department's sheer laziness. If they have such a large backlog to clear, they need to hire more employees or at the very least reallocate resources to this department so that people can move on with their lives.

[User20123]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I am not quite sure if the backlog is only caused due to the lack or limited number of ceremonies, they are also late in sending the acceptance letter and eVetting letters... I myself got all my eVetting sorted and done in nearly 3 months ago and still didn't get the acceptance letter and I am the early 2022 applicant. I also know someone who is still waiting for his eVetting for months (He has received his consent letter eVetting and replied that for eVetting but the eVetting itself has not come yet.).

So I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

It's definitely not only the ceremonies but they are a large part of the issue. The process itself takes time as I am still waiting for the evetting link ever since completing the invitation back in May.

That said, we continuously have thousands of approved applicants that cannot move forward simply because they are waiting for a ceremony invitation, sometimes up to 3-6 months after approval. A ceremony that can only manage about 3,000-4,000 applicants. That just seems completely unnecessary when those same applicants could be naturalised (by signing the declaration) and likely have received a passport in that same amount of time.

Yup, totally agree with you. I don't know of any alternative to reaching out to the TDs in order to hold this department accountable for their statements and actions besides doing so.

[User20123]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

There must be a lot of resources used in arranging and being present at ceremonies. How many staff need to travel from their offices and what costs are involved?
By temporarily suspending the ceremony events I'm sure that more time could be found to get on with clearing the backlog. That is why I also think it important to raise the point with TDs.

Without a doubt. I believe that on the day of the ceremonies, no applications would have been processed because all office resources would have been at the ceremony.

[Shakey]

Think it may be helpful if many of us who are still awaiting a decision writes to our TD for the need to push for naturalisation without the ceremony until at least the backlog is cleared. This seems to be a deliberate waste of resources and time.

Well, I spoke with my solicitor about it, but she said that the MoJ never mentioned it, and she advised me to wait until my months have passed, which will be next month. 19 months

Do you think someone must have reached out to their local TDs asking the same? This question has not been posted on the Oireachtas site.

Sorry, but the MoJ never mentioned what exactly?

I would really like to see one ore more TD's question the MoJ about why the need for ceremonies continue when, by law, she can eliminate the need and more quickly reduce the backlog. Even if the MoJ's response is once again a canned message, at least it gets addressed and puts a bit more pressure on the issue.

The bill was signed into law by the President this past July, so how many more months have to go by before she enacts this change? Like many of you, I've done a comprehensive search of the Dail debates and this question about the continued need for ceremonies has not be asked. If they insist on having ceremonies then they should at least offer the option for whether someone wishes to wait and attend one or just have their declaration signed in front of an official.

This is the part of the amendments made to the legislation which clarify the change:

(1A) The declaration referred to in paragraph (e) of subsection (1) shall be made, and the undertaking referred to in that paragraph shall be given—

(a) subject to subsection (1B), in a citizenship ceremony, or

(b) in such manner as the Minister, for special reasons, allows.

(1B) The Minister may—

(a) dispense with the requirement under subsection (1A)(a) that the declaration be made and the undertaking be given in a citizenship ceremony, and

(b) allow the applicant to make the declaration and give the undertaking in such manner as the Minister may specify,

where the Minister is of the opinion that, having regard to the number of applications of which he is in receipt, it is appropriate to do so in the interests of ensuring that such applications are dealt with in an efficient manner.”,

I am not quite sure if the backlog is only caused due to the lack or limited number of ceremonies, they are also late in sending the acceptance letter and eVetting letters... I myself got all my eVetting sorted and done in nearly 3 months ago and still didn't get the acceptance letter and I am the early 2022 applicant. I also know someone who is still waiting for his eVetting for months (He has received his consent letter eVetting and replied that for eVetting but the eVetting itself has not come yet.).

So I believe it is not only Ceremonies ... it is a mystery and it is affecting people's life unfortunately ...

It's definitely not only the ceremonies but they are a large part of the issue. The process itself takes time as I am still waiting for the evetting link ever since completing the invitation back in May.

That said, we continuously have thousands of approved applicants that cannot move forward simply because they are waiting for a ceremony invitation, sometimes up to 3-6 months after approval. A ceremony that can only manage about 3,000-4,000 applicants. That just seems completely unnecessary when those same applicants could be naturalised (by signing the declaration) and likely have received a passport in that same amount of time.

Yup, totally agree with you. I don't know of any alternative to reaching out to the TDs in order to hold this department accountable for their statements and actions besides doing so.

My recommendation would be to reach out to specifically Fine Gael TD's. Remind that it is a Fine Gael TD running the department and that most of these frustrated candidates will be able to vote at the next election.

[sairsint]

I stopped quoting others here as the scrolling was getting out of control

I would encourage others to contact their TD's about these ceremonies. It's not much effort to send them an email and ask that this issue be brought up in debates with the MoJ. There's legislation that now supports this very thing (I've pasted the section earlier) so there is no reason other than the MoJ not wanting to do it, which really isn't a good reason in this situation.

At the very least, they can still hold these ceremonies if they truly want to have the publicity surrounding them and I'm sure some will attend, but they should offer the option for an approved applicant to skip it and sign the declaration elsewhere.