Travelling to Ireland with my mother (with “Residence card of a family member of a Union citizen”

[notrouble]

Dear all,

I need advice….

I’m an Irish national who has lived in Spain for over 10 years.
My non-EU mother joined me in Spain about 8 years ago and she has a permanent residence card issued by Spain under the EU Directive (“Residence card of a family member of a Union citizen” as referred to in Articles 5(2) and 10(1) of Directive 2004/38/EC).

She lives in Spain, and over the years she has travelled to Ireland WITH me visa-free.

As the rest of my family live in Ireland, she wants to travel in her own (I have to be in Spain for work and can’t travel with her).

I was checking this forum and someone mentioned new and updated regulations with a link to the EU Commission’s website according to which my mother requires a visa to travel to Ireland…

Yet:

When I check the Irish immigration website, it is clear that:

Please note, if you are the holder of a document called “Residence card of a family member of a Union citizen” as referred to in Articles 5(2) and 10(1) of Directive 2004/38/EC on the rights of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of Member States, then you are not a visa required national for Ireland and can travel to the State without a visa, independently of whether your Union citizen family member accompanies or joins you in this State, for up to but not exceeding a period of 90 days.

Taken from here: https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... -national/

Question: can my mother travel on her own to Ireland in practice or not?

[Vadrar]

I’m going to guess that the answer hinges on the fact that you are an Irish citizen and your mother wants to travel to Ireland. If she were travelling to an EU member state that isn’t yours, she could travel without you. But as she wants to travel to your country, domestic Irish immigration laws are in action, not EU laws that cover freedom of movement. Domestic immigration laws are often not as generous as EU laws.


When you are quoting from the Irish immigration website information is it directed to family members of Irish nationals or non-Irish EU citizens?

In case it isn’t clear from the websites you are checking, I’ll dig out an EU information email address that can provide you with advice.

This email address is for an EU funded advice service, staffed by lawyers (at no cost to the person asking the questions). They should be able to tell you your mother’s rights if you are clear about your nationality, her nationality, her immigration status and destination.

GROW-YOUR-EUROPE-ADVICE@ec.europa.eu

[notrouble]

I’m going to guess that the answer hinges on the fact that you are an Irish citizen and your mother wants to travel to Ireland. If she were travelling to an EU member state that isn’t yours, she could travel without you. But as she wants to travel to your country, domestic Irish immigration laws are in action, not EU laws that cover freedom of movement. Domestic immigration laws are often not as generous as EU laws.


When you are quoting from the Irish immigration website information is it directed to family members of Irish nationals or non-Irish EU citizens?

In case it isn’t clear from the websites you are checking, I’ll dig out an EU information email address that can provide you with advice.

This email address is for an EU funded advice service, staffed by lawyers (at no cost to the person asking the questions). They should be able to tell you your mother’s rights if you are clear about your nationality, her nationality, her immigration status and destination.

GROW-YOUR-EUROPE-ADVICE@ec.europa.eu

Hey there,

Thanks for your comments. I am not sure that is valid, at least there is nothing in the Directive that would suggest this.

Your comment about the difference between the national vs EU legislation is valid but there is an exception to this.

My mother and I fall under the EU Directive as I’ve exercised my Freedom of Movement rights so even if I move back to Ireland my mother would be treated under the Directive and not under the Irish national legislation applicable to its own citizens who have not exercised the Freedom of Movement rights.

Please also note that my mother’s Spanish EU family card does not mention my nationality just my NIE (foreigner’s) number so it’s not possible to establish from the card alone if her right is derived from an Irish citizen or a citizen of another EU member state. If one can travel to Ireland with a Spanish EU family card, it’s highly unlikely they would be asked to bring with them a copy of their family member’s passport and so on as the card is generally sufficient.

Up until a few years ago, it was possible for my mother to travel to Ireland EITHER with me, OR if I were already in Ireland. There was no option 3.

Now, I see that the Irish immigration mentions that this right exists when it comes to Ireland.

On a separate note, I do not have much faith in the EU officials manning that email address… (I have also worked for over 10 years for EU institutions so have no expectations) but thank you for sharing it here!

My question is still the same:

Can my mother travel independently from me to Ireland? When did this change happen?

[Angel99]

Dear all,

I need advice….

I’m an Irish national who has lived in Spain for over 10 years.
My non-EU mother joined me in Spain about 8 years ago and she has a permanent residence card issued by Spain under the EU Directive (“Residence card of a family member of a Union citizen” as referred to in Articles 5(2) and 10(1) of Directive 2004/38/EC).

She lives in Spain, and over the years she has travelled to Ireland WITH me visa-free.

As the rest of my family live in Ireland, she wants to travel in her own (I have to be in Spain for work and can’t travel with her).

I was checking this forum and someone mentioned new and updated regulations with a link to the EU Commission’s website according to which my mother requires a visa to travel to Ireland…

Yet:

When I check the Irish immigration website, it is clear that:

Please note, if you are the holder of a document called “Residence card of a family member of a Union citizen” as referred to in Articles 5(2) and 10(1) of Directive 2004/38/EC on the rights of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of Member States, then you are not a visa required national for Ireland and can travel to the State without a visa, independently of whether your Union citizen family member accompanies or joins you in this State, for up to but not exceeding a period of 90 days.

Taken from here: https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... -national/

Question: can my mother travel on her own to Ireland in practice or not?

Hi,

The simple answer is your mother can travel alone to visit Ireland with her EU permanent card( for Union Citizen family members) for 90 days. Since you are still resident in Spain, the EU freemovement directive still applies regardless of your EU citizenship.

The only thing she can't do is to move and be resident in Ireland alone. Ireland, Denmark, Bulgaria and Romania does not allow EU permanent card that freedom to relocate alone.

[notrouble]

Thanks for your comment!

Would you know as to when the change came about? What happened that Ireland chose to allow unaccompanied family members with EU Family cards to travel to Ireland on their own?

PS: I don’t think my mother has any interest in moving away from Spain. Spain rocks

[Angel99]

Thanks for your comment!

Would you know as to when the change came about? What happened that Ireland chose to allow unaccompanied family members with EU Family cards to travel to Ireland on their own?

PS: I don’t think my mother has any interest in moving away from Spain. Spain rocks

Hi,

Ireland does not choose, since Ireland is an EU country it has to follow EU law and directives. Since 2024, holders of EU directive Residence cards can travel alone to all EU countries unaccompanied.



"Your non-EU family member does not need a visa if they have a residence card.

With this residence card (or permanent residence card) they can travel visa-free to all EU countries (including the country of your nationality) as well as to Iceland, Liechtenstein and Norway, also without being accompanied by you. This applies regardless of which EU country issued their residence card and the country they are visiting"

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/t ... e-card-yes

[notrouble]

Thanks

Do you want regulations were introduced last year or this year that changed this?

I checked the Commission’s webpage but it just recites the same old bits of legislation from years ago…

I learnt over the years that it’s important to have any new regulations studied and printed as airlines often make it difficult…

[Angel99]

Thanks

Do you want regulations were introduced last year or this year that changed this?

I checked the Commission’s webpage but it just recites the same old bits of legislation from years ago…

I learnt over the years that it’s important to have any new regulations studied and printed as airlines often make it difficult…

Sorry i don't understand what you mean. I have sent you the page about the regulations and also copy pasted a part of it above.

It is not necessary to make print out since your mother can just open the webiste page i sent on her phone incase the immigration officer is not aware. The airline are the last to bother your mother with EU residence card.

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/t ... dex_en.htm

*Scroll down on the Commission’s webiste
"Visa requirements for non-EU family members with a residence document"

*What type of residence document does your non-EU family member have? (Choose a residence card as a family member of an EU citizen)

Read the feedback.

[notrouble]

First of all thank you a lot for trying to help me to get to the bottom of this!

Sorry, for some reason I am unable to edit my last post.

I have seen the EC page. It lists applicable laws but does not specify as to what happened and why there is a change in the regulations and all of a sudden the non EU family member is able to travel independently.

Unfortunately over the past 10 years I have been fighting with the airlines (Ryanair, EasyJet, Iberia and Vueling) and each single time my family and I are put aside and asked a lot of questions as to why my mother has no visa. In fact, every second time I spend at least 30 minutes waiting for the airline staff to get feedback from their colleagues god knows where about whether my mother would be allowed into Ireland.

I have never had issues with the immigration officers in Ireland, they always knew what to do and what rights my mother had.

Given my very unpleasant experience over too many years, I now travel with a folder of all documents printed out and translated in multiple languages.

Furthermore, the stress of dealing with people who have never heard of these Freedom of Movement rights has put me off travelling with my mother altogether… so apologies for being extra vigilant and asking for the basis of this change as the Directive itself does not have these rights enshrined in it…

[Angel99]

First of all thank you a lot for trying to help me to get to the bottom of this!

Sorry, for some reason I am unable to edit my last post.

I have seen the EC page. It lists applicable laws but does not specify as to what happened and why there is a change in the regulations and all of a sudden the non EU family member is able to travel independently.

Unfortunately over the past 10 years I have been fighting with the airlines (Ryanair, EasyJet, Iberia and Vueling) and each single time my family and I are put aside and asked a lot of questions as to why my mother has no visa. In fact, every second time I spend at least 30 minutes waiting for the airline staff to get feedback from their colleagues god knows where about whether my mother would be allowed into Ireland.

I have never had issues with the immigration officers in Ireland, they always knew what to do and what rights my mother had.

Given my very unpleasant experience over too many years, I now travel with a folder of all documents printed out and translated in multiple languages.

Furthermore, the stress of dealing with people who have never heard of these Freedom of Movement rights has put me off travelling with my mother altogether… so apologies for being extra vigilant and asking for the basis of this change as the Directive itself does not have these rights enshrined in it…

They allowed EU family members to travel alone now because even other non EU citizens who have normal residence permits in Schengen countries could travel to all schengen countries alone for 90days. So why not family members of EU citizens who have more rights than others?. There were several complaints about this matter. The only difference is EU family members can also travel to Ireland.