Applying for EEA2 inside the UK

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:59 pm

Hi,

My parnter and I are due to marry in July/August this year. He's Irish, I'm South African.

I wanted to know would I have to go back to South Africa to apply for the EEA residence card/ family permit? Or can I do it in the UK?

I am currently on a student visa which expires 31st December 2009.

I was told I have to apply for the residence card back in South Africa and then once I've got that come back to the UK and send off for the permit which takes MONTHS!

I just want to know if I can apply for all the EEA stuff without leaving the UK.
Also doe sit cost anything??

I also get so confused when ppl say EEA2/ EEA4 i dont know which is which.

Ur help would be most appreciated.

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:17 pm

The EEA family permit is an entrance clearance that you apply for to be able to enter the UK. Obviously you have to do that from outside the UK.

The residence card (EEA2) is a permit that allows you to stay for longer than 6 months in the UK on the basis that the EEA partner is exercising treaty rights. You apply for the RC while in the UK. Application is free of charge.

EEA4 is permanent residence after five years.

fysicus · Post by **fysicus** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:36 pm

Gabriella,

as you are in the UK already legally you do not need to go back to South Africa to get an EEA FP. Just get married and apply for a residence card using form EEA2. Your right to reside in the UK is not dependent on this residence card; it is derived automatically from your marriage to an EEA national exercising treaty rights in the UK (even if you would be illegally in the UK prior to your marriage). I would recommend that your future husband already now applies for a registration certificate (using form EEA1) if he hasn't done so already. With a bit of luck he will have this certificate by the time you get married, and it will make it easier to provide all evidence for your residence card application.
The application forms can be downloaded from http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/euciti ... ropeanlaw/
and you can find a lot of information via the links on http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=28608

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:54 pm

fysicus wrote:I would recommend that your future husband already now applies for a registration certificate (using form EEA1) if he hasn't done so already. With a bit of luck he will have this certificate by the time you get married, and it will make it easier to provide all evidence for your residence card application.

I don't see why that would help. HO will most likely ask for fresh evidence at the time they consider the application anyway.

fysicus · Post by **fysicus** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 5:00 pm

according to article 10.2 of directive 2004/38 a valid registration certificate is sufficient evidence to prove that you are exercising treaty rights. I know the Home Office always asks for fresh evidence but that is obviously in violation of the directive

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:05 am

Thank you for your help guys.
So basically if im already legally in the UK on my student visa there's no need for me to go back to South Africa and get the family permit...

Also would my husband have to prove he is working through that registration certificate?

Do you reckon it would be worth paying an agency to do everything for us and advise us properly? How much do you think that would cost?

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Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:16 am

86ti wrote:The EEA family permit is an entrance clearance that you apply for to be able to enter the UK. Obviously you have to do that from outside the UK.

The residence card (EEA2) is a permit that allows you to stay for longer than 6 months in the UK on the basis that the EEA partner is exercising treaty rights. You apply for the RC while in the UK. Application is free of charge.

EEA4 is permanent residence after five years.

My partner is Irish so surely he wouldnt need to apply for the registration certificate?????

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:36 am

Gabriella2305 wrote:My partner is Irish so surely he wouldnt need to apply for the registration certificate?????

No, not necessary. So far I only found the Dutch to require it for visa-free travel but otherwise it seems utterly useless.

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:40 am

Gabriella2305 wrote:Also would my husband have to prove he is working through that registration certificate?

You prove employment through an employment letter and recent payslips.

Gabriella2305 wrote:Do you reckon it would be worth paying an agency to do everything for us and advise us properly? How much do you think that would cost?

I believe it should not be necessary in straightforward cases. Yours looks very much like one. For how long have you been married? If longer than 2 years there should be no problem. If shorter you also be required to prove a relationship before the marriage date. Not sure, however, if HO does such checks in your case.

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 12:01 pm

Well, we are gtting married in July/ August this year. We have been together for over a year and living together for about 6 months....

I just want to know if my fiance will have to apply for the Registration Certificate? Is this necessary even if he is Irish? Does it cost anything?

I also need to apply for a certificate of approval.... Do you think we should apply for the registration certificate and the COA at the same time?

Thnx for ur help

fysicus · Post by **fysicus** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 5:30 pm

Gabriella,

applications under European Law are free of charge in the UK. The only cost you will incur is for posting your application (by registered mail preferably). The whole process is very straightforward (though time consuming) so I would never think of using an agency for that (unless you are desperate to get rid of a lot of money).
I did and still do recommend that your (future) husband applies for a registration certificate (form EEA1), even though there is no legal requirement to do so. If he lives here for more than five years already, he can also consider to apply for permanent residency (form EEA3).
Having such a certificate will definitely make things easier for the two of you in the future.
When you are married, you can apply for a Residence Card straightaway (form EEA2). In 2005 we made this application for my wife about a month after we got married, and there were no problems at all. Even though we had met for the first time just six months before our marriage and hadn't lived together until we married.

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:11 pm

Thanks for your reply fyscius- I don't think we have time on our side to apply for the Registration Certificate... Surely payslips and proof of permanent employment be sufficient to prove my husband is exercising his treaty rights?
Is it a necessity to have the Registration Cert?

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:13 am

Gabriella2305 wrote:Is it a necessity to have the Registration Cert?

No. I answered your question already.

fysicus · Post by **fysicus** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:50 am

I think I made my position very clear and it's up to you either to follow or ignore my advice.
For EU nationals (including Irish) there is no requirement to have a registration certificate, and when you don't have non-EU family members there is practically no benefit in having it.
However, in your (Gabriella) case I think there are some clear advantages. For example, it will be easier to convince relevant third parties (e.g. potential employers) that your husband is exercising Treaty Rights (and that you therefore do not need a work permit) without having to disclose on which grounds (which involves giving details of your financial situation). Others might use the EEA FP for that purpose, but you will not have that. Especially now the processing time for an EEA2 application is about a year (twice the legally allowed maximum!) that might be something to consider.
There is no need to worry about timing: whether or not your husband actually gets this certificate before or after your marriage is irrelevant. He will definitely get it much earlier than you will get your Residence Card

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:03 pm

Thank you for both your help, sorry i had to get you to re-clarify things. I just want to be extra sure about the whole thing.
I think il get the registration certificate anyway because there is no harm in having that-it can only benefit me.

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:48 pm

HI 86ti and fysicus

ONE LAST QUESTION i promise:

We are getting married in the UK and are having our honeymoon in South Africa in September.

My student visa expires only in December 09. Even though we are getting married in the UK and my visa is still valid here for about 6 months after our marriage can I apply for the Family Member Residence Stamp in South Africa? Only because it takes 5 days in South Africa and here it takes 6 months!!

Im sure id be able to do this?

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:39 pm

Gabriella2305 wrote:My student visa expires only in December 09. Even though we are getting married in the UK and my visa is still valid here for about 6 months after our marriage can I apply for the Family Member Residence Stamp in South Africa? Only because it takes 5 days in South Africa and here it takes 6 months!!

We are moving in circles here: family permit only outside, residence permit only inside!

If the situation at HO doesn't improve this year it is quite likely that you won't get your residence card before December. The airline is probably happy with the student visa on your return from South Africa before it expires. The UK border guards would have to let you in based on your relationship to an EEA national if you can prove it. Of course, you can also apply for the EEA family permit while in SA if that makes you feel safer.

fysicus · Post by **fysicus** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:48 pm

Gabriela,

please don't confuse the different terms.
A Family Member Residence Stamp is only for family members of EU-nationals from the new member states (who joined the EU in 2004 or later); as your husband is Irish you can ignore that.

You can apply for a Residence Card (with form EEA2) only within the UK. You can send this application already before you go on honeymoon. Of course, only include copies of your passports and marriage certificat. The Home Office will ask for the originals when your application is actually processed which is probably well into 2010 unless the current backlog suddenly disappears.

Of course, you can apply for an EEA Family Permit while you are in SA, but it will require spending a serious amount of time at the British Embassy there (expect very long queues as South Africans will need a UK visa from 1st March 2009) and I can imagine there are more pleasant things to do on a honeymoon trip. And your current visa will still be valid, so you don't need a renewed entry clearance to return to UK after this honeymoon.

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:57 pm

That clears a lot up for me and makes perfect sense. Will apply for EEA2 as soon as we are married and send off copies of passport and marriage cert.

No need for me to apply for the EEA Family Permit then if my student visa is valid until December 2009. May as well just go straight ahead and apply for the EEA2.
Would i still be able to work when my student visa expires and i'm awaiting a decision on the EEA2?

Thank you for taking the time and effort to help me out-i really appreciate it

Ben · Post by **Ben** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:02 pm

Gabriella2305 wrote:Would i still be able to work when my student visa expires and i'm awaiting a decision on the EEA2?

Hi Gabriella,

You can work the moment you are pronounced husband and wife.

fysicus · Post by **fysicus** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:06 pm

yes,

you can work from the moment you are married. Your rights as a family member of an EU national are acquired automatically; the document (i.e. the residence card) is only a confirmation of your rights.
Enjoy your wedding and honeymoon!

Gabriella2305 · Post by **Gabriella2305** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 11:38 am

fysicus wrote:yes,

you can work from the moment you are married. Your rights as a family member of an EU national are acquired automatically; the document (i.e. the residence card) is only a confirmation of your rights.
Enjoy your wedding and honeymoon!

Thank you so so much everyone for giving me advice. Hopefully i'll be able to help and offer advice to another person in my situation one day

xxx

Tyro · Post by **Tyro** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 2:19 pm

Hello Every one,

I am a very serious problem ,please help,

here is my case

I have indian passport and married to a greek cypriot.
Sept 2008, I applied for residence card EEA2, nearly six months,
after seeing its taking too long, we arranged to go to Cyprus next month end of March 2009.
We got our documents back from Home office and talked to Cyprus Embassy London.

Cyrpus Embassy said they won'tbe able to give me entery visa as I don't have any Visa to come to Uk.
I explained I will apply for family permit from Cyprus and will come back as I work in UK.
They said no this is their requirement. If I had residence card I wouldn't need visa to go to Cyprus.

I was on HSMP before applying for residence card.
Please advise what are the EU laws of free movement why I can't go to Cyprus while I am traveling with my wife.

Please help

86ti · Post by **86ti** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 2:39 pm

Tyro wrote:I am a very serious problem ,please help

A residence card subsitutes for a visa but you don't have one. Many UK embassies will issue Schengen visas only to residents and require proof of it. This may be within their right or maybe not. The point is you arranged your trip too early and most likely won't be able to travel before you'll receive your RC. They only other option would be to find an embassy that doesn't check residence (is there one?) or apply from India...

Tyro · Post by **Tyro** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:17 pm

Hi there I wonder if someone can help me with this,

Cyprus Embassy would not give me entery visa for cyprus because my residence card application is still in process in UK.
her is my case

Hi Darlinfe,
I am Indian,
my wife is greek cypriot (cyprus national)
I and my wife both work and live in UK, she is execising EU treat in UK
I have applied for EEA2 in sept 2008 6 months before
I was on HSMP till november 2008.
I am waiting for HO to process my application.
I have planed to go to Cyprus in the last week of March, so I have one month in hand.

Cyprus embassy said they won't give entery as my visa status in uk is not clear.

I think they are not treating me as EU national family member because My wife is cypriot not from another EU nation ( silly isn't it, they give freedom of movement to family member of other states, but to the family member of their nationals, even they are part of cyprus)

Any help would be very much appreciated.

Regards
Shaz

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Applying for EEA2 inside the UK

Applying for EEA2 inside the UK

Cyprus Embassy denied to give entery ( Cypriot family member