Job Lost...Urgent help needed

Visa_Novice · Post by **Visa_Novice** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:04 pm

Hi,
I am an employee of an Indian IT company and working for a client in UK.
Recently our Indian company has lost their UK client and our Indian company has asked us to go to India immediately.
I have applied for WP to tier-1 + 1 dependent few days ago (Before loosing the job in UK). Now I have been left in a trap. The moment I tell them that I have applied for tier-1 they are going to lay me off. Could any one tell me
1) What shall I do? Shall I inform my Indian company that I can not go to India as I have applied for tier-1(In this case I am running the risk of loosing my job without having neither visa nor job.not sure whether I will get visa or not)?
2) Is there any other reason (BAHANA) I can tell them by which I can stay here for next 1.5 months so once I receive my passport I can go back to india ?
3) My wife is working here on dependent visa. If this company lays me off then whether my wife is allowed to do work legally here as my work permit is valid till Dec 2009?
4) What in such cases Indian IT companies generally do ? I mean, Do they initiate cancellatino of work permit of employee if they lay off the employee in the cases as of mine. If they initiate the cancellatino of work permit then I am not with any legal visa so does my wife allowed to do work ?
I am sure my questions are not clear enough and do not deserve any clear cut answer but still if any body has similar experiance then they can share their experience so they I can forsee what can or what might happen to me as well.
Thanks

maheshnair · Post by **maheshnair** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:21 pm

Visa_Novice wrote:Hi,
I am an employee of an Indian IT company and working for a client in UK.
Recently our Indian company has lost their UK client and our Indian company has asked us to go to India immediately.
I have applied for WP to tier-1 + 1 dependent few days ago (Before loosing the job in UK). Now I have been left in a trap. The moment I tell them that I have applied for tier-1 they are going to lay me off. Could any one tell me
1) What shall I do? Shall I inform my Indian company that I can not go to India as I have applied for tier-1(In this case I am running the risk of loosing my job without having neither visa nor job.not sure whether I will get visa or not)?
2) Is there any other reason (BAHANA) I can tell them by which I can stay here for next 1.5 months so once I receive my passport I can go back to india ?
3) My wife is working here on dependent visa. If this company lays me off then whether my wife is allowed to do work legally here as my work permit is valid till Dec 2009?
4) What in such cases Indian IT companies generally do ? I mean, Do they initiate cancellatino of work permit of employee if they lay off the employee in the cases as of mine. If they initiate the cancellatino of work permit then I am not with any legal visa so does my wife allowed to do work ?
I am sure my questions are not clear enough and do not deserve any clear cut answer but still if any body has similar experiance then they can share their experience so they I can forsee what can or what might happen to me as well.
Thanks

Best action :

Tell you employer , your wife or you have a surgery appointed after a month .. Tell them not to pay u , but give leave for a month or more .

Once u get tier1 ....Resign and you are now legal to stay without work for 2- 3 months . Look for Job ...get a new job ....

xpscapable · Post by **xpscapable** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:37 pm

That would be a risky lie. Why don't you just tell them you want some time off, like 3 months to travel and see Europe or something like that? In the mean time look for a new job.

Post by **push** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:58 pm

Your compay will in any case get to know about your tier-1 application when HO approach them for verification process (if they decide to do so). Its better to disclose to them and ask for a leave. Without your passport you cant go back to your country.

tapindersingh · Post by **tapindersingh** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:01 pm

Firstly, you need to evaluate your tier 1 application. If you qualify with required points and you have maintenance funds for yourself and your partner and none of you have breached your visa conditions then you will get tier 1, its a simple yes or no system.

secondly, you need to evaluate your incomes/standard of living/future prospects of living in UK compared to India. If you think UK is better then take your stand & resign.

OR

take unpaid/paid leave, taking leave is your right so you do not need any bahana.

iyanu · Post by **iyanu** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:51 pm

Tarpindersingh wrote

Firstly, you need to evaluate your tier 1 application. If you qualify with required points and you have maintenance funds for yourself and your partner and none of you have breached your visa conditions then you will get tier 1, its a simple yes or no system.

secondly, you need to evaluate your incomes/standard of living/future prospects of living in UK compared to India. If you think UK is better then take your stand & resign.

OR

take unpaid/paid leave, taking leave is your right so you do not need any bahana.

If I were you I will follow tapindersing's suggestions.

Think it through and remember that you also need to disengage from your employer without any rancour because you may need them in the future.

So think very deeply on how to break the news. Though I'll suggest you take an holiday or rest for a month or two. And see if your tier-1 came out successfull, not until then you put yourself in a better position and if not successfull go back to India without upsetting your employer.

I wish you all the best, though it is a delima for you.

yasa · Post by **yasa** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 2:27 am

Tell your employer about everything cuz HO will probably gonna ask about your job from your employer. Dont need to do any bahana. Be loyal and truthful...

Visa_Novice · Post by **Visa_Novice** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 7:26 am

My company is not ready to give any month off or something.

Also, HO does not contact employer always. Does they ?
As of now I am treating my tier-1 application to be simple one (I mean with no complicatinos) so I feel I should get the visa. But until I get it I can not be 100 % sure so I want to avoid any risk of being out of job. Our company is giving 1 week time to rap up everything from UK and come back to India. This one week time they had given after a long discussion otherwise we have been offered only 2 days time to fly back to India, so geting a month off seems to be difficult.

There is one more thing I can do:
I can say that my wife has started job last week on dependent visa but her employer wanted her to work on work permit (so that she can not leave them, taking flexibility out of my wife to work with any body else) so we donot have my wife's passport so we can not travel to India. What say?
In that case I want to know that how long it takes for a company to process work permit if they do not have license (new work permit system) to sponser workpermit ? Also If my company ask us to withdraw her passport then how long does it take to withdraw the application from HO ? I will tell my company that I will be travelling back with my wife only.

Can my Indian employer lay me off in UK (I think as per new visa rules they need to either inform HO that I am not coming to work and I am untracable otherwise they have this responsibility to send me to India). Also by laying me off in UK they are running the legal risk of compensation that they will certainly not like to give me. Even they do not have any proof that I have applied for tier-1.

In the worst case if HO contacts them for my enquiry(possibly after a month) can they lie and say wrong things due to which I do not get visa ?
Kindly suggest...Its very urgent...

anirban_paul · Post by **anirban_paul** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:27 am

If you are really stuck and want to play it safe you can withdraw your application now (in which case you will lose the application fee) and get your passports back.

No need to inform anyone and go back in India and then apply from there (with UK payslips etc) the next day!

When you get the Tier1 you can come back in UK anytime quitting your India job.

This way you save your India job, employer need not know you applied Tier1 from UK , and in the end you get the HSMP anyway. Ofcourse the cost is MONEY.

How does this sound?

Visa_Novice · Post by **Visa_Novice** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:44 am

I can not withdraw my application as I am not eligible in new rules. So I want to continue with my application. By the way what is the procedure to withdraw the application and how long does it generally takes ?

Visa_Novice · Post by **Visa_Novice** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 9:28 am

Also, how long a person can legally stay in UK on his work permit if his project has finished :
1) If company is allowing to stay (but without pay) ?
2) If company is not allowing to stay ?
3) What can a company do if employee is not leaving the country ?

gotcha · Post by **gotcha** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:03 am

Visa_Novice wrote:Also, how long a person can legally stay in UK on his work permit if his project has finished :

You can stay in UK as long as your tier1 application is processed, you need to leave country if it's negative.

1) If company is allowing to stay (but without pay) ?

As above.

2) If company is not allowing to stay ?

I think company as no say in your future. Because, you have already applied for tier1.

3) What can a company do if employee is not leaving the country ?

They can fire you, that's all.

It depend on your negotiation skill.

You can not ride in two boats same time. You need to make decisioni. As said earlier, depend on your negotiation skill. I pesonnally don't like to lie to my employer, as I never did(applied from India). It may come to haunt you sometime in future.

BeHonest · Post by **BeHonest** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:45 am

I am sorry to hear this situation.

As for as I Know, a company can not allow it's employee to stay in the UK without allowance/salary. Work permit holders need to be given the allowances as long as they stay in the UK under that visa. Company, by law need to pay you. Pls google unpaid leaves on workpermit in Uk.
If your company inform HO as soon as you leave the country, the work permit will get cancelled. In that scenario, even if you have the visa until year end in your passport, it has legally no value.
Your wife can not continue to work on cancelled WP, which will result her employer paying 10K as fine. She will be considered as overstayed which could affect ILR and future visa applns.
If for any reasons if WP holder looses his/her job, i read in one of the threads, he can stay here for next 28 days. Not sure though.Thread infos are individual's opinion not HO policy guidance.
When company refuses to stay, do an excel for whose job to be saved.
If UK job, resign and HO allows the stay as transition period which wont affect ILR.

Major operation as a reason to stay: If they ask for NHS proof,it is risky.

ALL THE BEST.

gotcha · Post by **gotcha** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:48 am

BeHonest wrote:If your company inform HO as soon as you leave the country, the work permit will get cancelled. In that scenario, even if you have the visa until year end in your passport, it has legally no value.

You should consider the fact that, he has already applied for tier1, so WP cancellation has no bearing, he can stay here as long as his tier1 decision is given.

nksg · Post by **nksg** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:09 am

Same old story!!

Here is what i feel... (Seniors please correct if i am wrong).

If you have applied for T1 and your Employer asks you to go back, you cannot travel back as you dont have the passport.

You are allowed to work and live in the country untill decision of t1 is made.. even other wise as per the law, you have 28 days to leave the country (or take any action) if you have been made redundant on WP.

If by any chance your t1 is rejected you again have 28 days to leave the country or apply for review.

Also in above cases your wife's right to work is not impacted.

decision is yours.. if you really want to live in UK and considering the fact your wife is working here, its worth taking the risk (as per advice from other members...).. I know job market is not good these days but sooner or later you will find something here .. and with your wifes income you will be able to support yourself....

All the best...

Post by **ChetanOjha** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:48 am

Tell your employer that your have got Chicken Pox

and GP has asked for to stay in home for 3 weeks. I am sure nobody will come to your house to check if you are telling the truth.

But proper way is to tell your employer that you have applied for Tier 1 and your passport is with HO. Also stress that you do not have any intention of leaving the job and want to stay with the company but you need to wait untill your passport arrived. Hopefully you employer will sensibly understand that he cannot do anything if you decide to stay (even if they force you to). They will not take risk of loosing a good resource and it will not be a mature decision from your PM part.

aspirant09 · Post by **aspirant09** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:49 am

hi,
is ur wife a contract employee or permanent? i was thinking if u could simply extend ur stay by asking holidays on the basis of your wife's contract ....u could say the contract would end in 4 weeks and then u both will travel back?

when did u applied for T-1 ?

tier1_king · Post by **tier1_king** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 4:09 pm

Visa_Novice, wat about my idea below ...

Tell your employer that you shall be leaving as per their request ..

But you don't leave. After the day you are expected to be in India, call and tell them some of these reasons for which they can't deny you leave
-you have a fracture in your leg
-you have jaundice or chicken pox
-your father is serious and u need to be with him

and take a leave for a month or so and be here in UK till you get the tier1 visa.

Then if you want, join your company back in India or you can resign and come back to the UK.

Post by **ChetanOjha** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 5:44 pm

Its difficult to confirm employer that you are leaving and not leave. I presume like any other IT company, novice's employer is also providing him travel ticket back to India for him and his wife.

tier1_king wrote:Visa_Novice, wat about my idea below ...

Tell your employer that you shall be leaving as per their request ..

But you don't leave. After the day you are expected to be in India, call and tell them some of these reasons for which they can't deny you leave
-you have a fracture in your leg
-you have jaundice or chicken pox
-your father is serious and u need to be with him

and take a leave for a month or so and be here in UK till you get the tier1 visa.

Then if you want, join your company back in India or you can resign and come back to the UK.

BeHonest · Post by **BeHonest** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:14 pm

gotcha wrote:
BeHonest wrote:If your company inform HO as soon as you leave the country, the work permit will get cancelled. In that scenario, even if you have the visa until year end in your passport, it has legally no value.
You should consider the fact that, he has already applied for tier1, so WP cancellation has no bearing, he can stay here as long as his tier1 decision is given.

I know that transition period is legal (WP- T1) ,he can stay here, his wife can work.That's why I mentioned,if he wanted to save UK job, at the expense of Indian job,it wont affect his ILR.

In my above quote, I took a scenario ,if he withdraws his appln to save his indian job and leave UK,while leaving his wife here in her employment would affect them.

Visa_Novice · Post by **Visa_Novice** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:45 pm

My work permit is valid till Dec. 2009. My wife is working here as my dependent. She is on training but she is receiving salary here.
I have informed my Indian company that I have applied for tier-1 and now I am waiting for their action.
1) If I am out of project and waiting for my tier-1 then does my wife allowed to work on dependent visa in this period (If my Indian company does not fier me in this period)?
2) If I am out of project and waiting for my tier-1 then does my wife allowed to work on dependent visa in this period (If my Indian company lays me off in this period, but do not cancel my work permit)?
3)If I am out of project and waiting for my tier-1 then does my wife allowed to work on dependent visa in this period (If my Indian company lays me off in this period and cancels my work permit as well)?
4) What all legal libalities my Indian company has for me if I am staying in UK on workpermit and waiting for tier-1 visa e.g. Insurance, salary, etc... ?
5) Can I work for a new employer on WP of old company for the transition period(WP to tier-1) ?
6) Do my wife need to inform her employer that I am out of project and my WP might not be valid after few days ?
7) Do I need to inform home office about my change of circumstances (before my employer informs them) or its fine if I inform them after my employer inform them to cancel my WP. I think I need to inform HO for change of circumstance ?

8 ) What all will I have to inform HO about this situatino and what exactly I will have to inform them and how I should inform them ?
9) Does this change of circumstance affect my tier-1 application in positive or negative way ?
10) Can I initiate early consideration of my application to HO based on this abrupt closer of my project and need to travel back to India ?
11) If my Indian company lays me off in UK then what all legal compensatino I can ask from them ?
I know I have a long list of questions, but I am so stuck that I have left with just questions...nothing else...

Please help...

Visa_Novice · Post by **Visa_Novice** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 10:58 pm

Could any experianced member please reply me.
Thanks.

awaiting · Post by **awaiting** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 3:49 am

Its a very tricky situation but you are playing too many risks at one go! I am sure ( not confirmed) That your wife will not be allowed to work she is your dependant understand this technicallly she is there coz of you and your visa status will surely affect hers. Why you want to get into mess just take out some way which you feel will solve is there somebody in that company who will take your views and consider. or else simply inform HO.

If still you want to go ahead it will be best to consult some lawyer there. Because mind you if you are fired your company will cancel your workpermit and you will be illegal migrant there which will be setback for your career and also your wifes so play safe please .

maheshnair · Post by **maheshnair** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 9:04 am

Visa_Novice wrote:My work permit is valid till Dec. 2009. My wife is working here as my dependent. She is on training but she is receiving salary here.
1) If I am out of project and waiting for my tier-1 then does my wife allowed to work on dependent visa in this period (If my Indian company does not fier me in this period)?
2) If I am out of project and waiting for my tier-1 then does my wife allowed to work on dependent visa in this period (If my Indian company lays me off in this period, but do not cancel my work permit)?
3)If I am out of project and waiting for my tier-1 then does my wife allowed to work on dependent visa in this period (If my Indian company lays me off in this period and cancels my work permit as well)?
4) What all legal libalities my Indian company has for me if I am staying in UK on workpermit and waiting for tier-1 visa e.g. Insurance, salary, etc... ?
5) Can I work for a new employer on WP of old company for the transition period(WP to tier-1) ?
6) Do my wife need to inform her employer that I am out of project and my WP might not be valid after few days ?
7) Do I need to inform home office about my change of circumstances (before my employer informs them) or its fine if I inform them after my employer inform them to cancel my WP. I think I need to inform HO for change of circumstance ?

8 ) What all will I have to inform HO about this situatino and what exactly I will have to inform them and how I should inform them ?
9) Does this change of circumstance affect my tier-1 application in positive or negative way ?
10) Can I initiate early consideration of my application to HO based on this abrupt closer of my project and need to travel back to India ?
11) If my Indian company lays me off in UK then what all legal compensatino I can ask from them ?
I know I have a long list of questions, but I am so stuck that I have left with just questions...nothing else...

Please help...

Hi Visa ,

Looks like i already advised your what to do .

If you need to gain something take Risk ...
Your company cannot do anything if you say you are horribly sick or not in a state to travel . They will not come and take u in a wheel chair to the airport ........

My friend took 2 months paternity leave in uk ...without salary .

So as long as you have the Visa validity ......you are legal .....Ho dont care you are paid or you are on leave etc .....

But if i was in that position ... I would request my HR that i have got my leg fractured and may need 2 - 3 weeks time before travel ......Be polite in request .....dont tell them you are applying tier1 ....THEY WILL JUST SCR** YOU .....ONCE YOU ARE IN TIER1 THEY KNOW WHAT WILL BE YOUR NEXT STEP ...DO U WANNA GIVE A STICK TO SOMEBODY AND GET BEATEN ? just make a story ...this is the time to become an actor in life ..

You have so many advantages ....May be harsh ....but it is again for you good ...you can also say your wife is pregnant and had a miscarriage etc etc ......

As krishna says in bhagwath geetha "To achieve a Goal , dont care of the path you take"

Sushil-ACCA · Post by **Sushil-ACCA** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 9:49 am

As krishna says in bhagwath geetha "To achieve a Goal , dont care of the path you take"-AS PER Nair

my friend so lonfg it is as per dharma benefit fine other wise all path are wrong

Regards

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Job Lost...Urgent help needed

Job Lost...Urgent help needed

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