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Firstly, it's an EEA Family Member Residence Card, NOT Family Permit!siddiqr wrote:Afternoon all
I have a questions and hope i can get some clarity.
I am a pakistani national married to a norwegian citizen for last 2 years. We both are in full time professional employment here in the UK. I was issued an EEA2 family permit in 2007. I have travelled to Norway in past on several occasions but always had a valid Schengen Visa. We recently heard that going by EU Directive 2004/38/EC i could travel to Norway with my EU wife without the need of Schengen Visa. My visit was intended for 9 days only.
I rang Norwegian embassy to double check and they dropped the bombshell that i would need Schengen visa to enter Norway. I was silly enough to have bought the ticket so ended up losing 80 pounds and cancelling my holidays from work etc
This question might have been asked few times ... Am i allowed to travel to Norway without Schengen Visa when i have EEA2 family permit stating 'Residence Card of a Family Member of an EEA National’. It just seems bizzare that Sweden and Denmark (closest neighbors) allow non-EU family member to enter without such restrictions?
I would appreciate if anyone could shed some light or perhaps share an experience.
Thanks
Riz
You know this from personal experience or a 3rd party report?siddiqr wrote: It just seems bizzare that Sweden and Denmark (closest neighbors) allow non-EU family member to enter without such restrictions?
OP is right!Plum70 wrote:You know this from personal experience or a 3rd party report?siddiqr wrote: It just seems bizzare that Sweden and Denmark (closest neighbors) allow non-EU family member to enter without such restrictions?
Happy days!Rozen wrote: OP is right!
http://www.amblondon.um.dk/en/menu/Cons ... orDenmark/
http://www.swedenabroad.com/Page____23300.aspx
It won't help you at the moment but Norway (along with Liechtenstein and Iceland) are or will be bound by the Directive, see Decision of the EEA Joint Committee. The implementation, however, appears to have not materialised yet. Don't forget, Norway may be in the Schengen zone but it is not a member of the EU.siddiqr wrote:This question might have been asked few times ... Am i allowed to travel to Norway without Schengen Visa when i have EEA2 family permit stating 'Residence Card of a Family Member of an EEA National’. It just seems bizzare that Sweden and Denmark (closest neighbors) allow non-EU family member to enter without such restrictions?
It was implemented into Norwegian law on 2009-02-13. Please see the following link: http://www.lovdata.no/all/nl-20090109-001.html.The implementation, however, appears to have not materialised yet
Thanks a lot for the info. Do you know what it says regards to Article 5(2) of the Directive, i.e. visa free travel for EEA residence card holders.No Name wrote:It was implemented into Norwegian law on 2009-02-13. Please see the following link: http://www.lovdata.no/all/nl-20090109-001.html.The implementation, however, appears to have not materialised yet
and then you could legally (if you travel with the EEA national or to join the EEA national) cross the border into Norway from Sweden. It would be advicable however to bring with you printout of the law in case the people at the border control does not know the rules.family members of EEA nationals who are in possession of a British "Residence Card of a family member of an EEA national" or "Permanent Residence Card" do not need a visa for visits up to 90 days to Sweden
They obviously have as their implementation is more generous (fewer formalities) than the directive.No Name wrote:The law does not mention residence cards (issued in other member states) at all, however I guess the Norwegians will claim that they have followed their obligations in directive 38/2004 as a visa is not required if the non-eea national travels with the EEA national or to join the EEA national.
No Name wrote:Please see: http://translate.google.co.uk/translate ... ry_state0=
The translation is not perfect, but as you can clearly read from section 111, a non-eea national only needs a valid passport to enter Norway if he/she travels with or joins the EEA national.
The law does not mention residence cards (issued in other member states) at all, however I guess the Norwegians will claim that they have followed their obligations in directive 38/2004 as a visa is not required if the non-eea national travels with the EEA national or to join the EEA national.
The practical problem is of course to be able to travel to Norway (Airlines might not let people board without a visa).
I guess the best approach for someone who wants to travel to Norway without a visa would be:
1. Contact the Norwegian embassy and inform them that the law says that you do not need a visa if traveling with or joining the EEA national (supply them with the link to Lovdata)
2. When the Norwegian embassy confirms that you do not need a visa if traveling with the EEA national or joining the EEA national in Norway: Ask them if they know how to travel to Norway without a visa - Which Airlines or Boats will let you board (the embassy will probably reply that this is not their problem, and cannot give you an answer...)
3. Send a formal complaint to the European Commission where you claim that Norway might in theory comply with the directive by demanding only a valid passport, however you can claim that it is practically impossible to travel for example directly from the UK to Norway without a visa as no Airlines or Boats will let you board without a visa (and therefore Norway should specify in the law that residence card (family member of EEA) does not need a visa)).
You could also travel via Sweden to Norway as according to: http://www.swedenabroad.com/Page____23300.aspxand then you could legally (if you travel with the EEA national or to join the EEA national) cross the border into Norway from Sweden. It would be advicable however to bring with you printout of the law in case the people at the border control does not know the rules.family members of EEA nationals who are in possession of a British "Residence Card of a family member of an EEA national" or "Permanent Residence Card" do not need a visa for visits up to 90 days to Sweden
I guess this is the answer you got from Solvit UK, when you complained to them. Please remember that the Solvit centers are part of the national administrations (as the UK administration does not recognize residence cards from other member states it is not surprising that they answer in this way). A complaint to the European Commission would be a better strategy:http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/en/c ... l#11444_15Many Member States of the EU interpret Article 5.2 as requiring a visa for a non EU national unless that Member State has issued a residence permit; that the permit is not a document that is intended to be recognised by any other Member State, therefore it is not possible to take forward a complaint on your behalf because Norway required you to obtain a visa.
Regards
Christine Korcz
Action Single Market
No Name wrote:I guess this is the answer you got from Solvit UK, when you complained to them. Please remember that the Solvit centers are part of the national administrations (as the UK administration does not recognize residence cards from other member states it is not surprising that they answer in this way). A complaint to the European Commission would be a better strategy:http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/en/c ... l#11444_15Many Member States of the EU interpret Article 5.2 as requiring a visa for a non EU national unless that Member State has issued a residence permit; that the permit is not a document that is intended to be recognised by any other Member State, therefore it is not possible to take forward a complaint on your behalf because Norway required you to obtain a visa.
Regards
Christine Korcz
Action Single Market
It could of course be possible that you made a complaint to the Norwegian embassy and they forwarded this complaint to UK Solvit (but that would be quite unusual)Action Single Market is the UK SOLVIT Centre and is based at the Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform. For further information contact: Celia Kissoon or Christine Korcz
Really sorry ..until now i was under the impression that the reply came from the Norwegian embassy. Yes i did copy in SolvitNo Name wrote:"Action Single Market" is the UK Solvit centre and Christine Korcz works for the UK Solvit centre, so I guess you must have got this answer from UK Solvit.
Please see the following document:http://www.europe.org.uk/files/957_solvit.pdf on page 3 it says:It could of course be possible that you made a complaint to the Norwegian embassy and they forwarded this complaint to UK Solvit (but that would be quite unusual)Action Single Market is the UK SOLVIT Centre and is based at the Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform. For further information contact: Celia Kissoon or Christine Korcz
Hi siddiqr,siddiqr wrote:I am a pakistani national married to a norwegian citizen ... issued an EEA2 family permit ... going by EU Directive 2004/38/EC ... I rang Norwegian embassy ...
We have just established this in this thread (see the 7th message from No Name).ca.funke wrote:On page three of >>above<< thread, it is discussed whether 2004/38/EC is applicable in Norway.
Still no reply from the Embassy. I have tried ringing as well but no one answers the phones. I am getting a little annoyed now86ti wrote:We have just established this in this thread (see the 7th message from No Name).ca.funke wrote:On page three of >>above<< thread, it is discussed whether 2004/38/EC is applicable in Norway.