While I was in FAS today....

[Italybound]

So I have gone down to FAS to register and I have to bring the famous ID that is not an ID card my GNIB card.

Anyway I was being helped by 2 people and they took my card to check the stamp (not all can register with FAS). Anyway the section for my stamp is the following: Stamp No: 4

Now I ahve never thought anything of it until I came on here, and I noticed that you called it 4 FAM. I had it renewed last year (in June) for 6 years with just the four, but I have noticed reading here there that the 6 years is unusual and it would seem by the reaction at FAS, that the 4 is unusual. I say this because when the FAS girls were looking at it one said to the other she is on stamp 4, she is here on her own an dI am sure she said it was not a 4 Family.

the thing is I am not here on my own, I am here as I am married.

Do the FAS folk know not what they talk about (not unusual if you know what I mean ) or is there somethign unusual about my stamp?

So does anyone else have soemthing similiar?

[sideshowsue]

I'm on a Stamp 4, renewable each year. To make it even more incomprehensible, I'm the spouse of an EU national, so technically, I should have that famous EUFAM stamp. I think, looking back on the registration of my residency in Ireland, it's been one giant muddle.

When my husband (French national) and I (American) arrived in Ireland in 1999, no one in any position of authority was able to tell us what my entitlement to residency was. For instance, when we rang the Irish embassy in Paris, they told me that 1. I would have to apply for a visa to enter the Irish state (huh?) and 2. to be entitled to work, I would need a work permit (double huh?).

When I phoned the American and French embassies in Dublin, they told me this was total nonsense and that the Irish authorities hadn't a clue what they were talking about. The French embassy also added 'To get used to it' (i.e. that the Irish authorities hadn't the first clue about anything that was within their remit).

It just so happened that on the day that we showed up to register at the main Garda station in Cork, we happened upon a woman who seemed to be very new in her job, but otherwise quite pleasant and accommodating. She then registered me in accordance with the old Green paper book system until the expiry of my passport.

By the time my passport needed to be renewed and my residency here was due to expire (I think this was around 2001), they had changed over to the GNIB cards. At that time, they still processed the spouses of EU nationals like the spouses of Irish nationals so I got put on the Stamp 4.

I never bothered to apply for the EUFAM card for two reasons: 1. I don't need it to travel visa-free in Europe and 2. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. The Stamp 4 keeps me in the country legally and the less I have to deal with anything INIS-related, the happier I am.

So even if staff at FAS may not be familiar with 'Stamp 4,' it's totally normal and fully compliant for work and registration purposes.

[Italybound]

Thanks for that, but yours is different to mine, mine does not need to be renewed until 2014, we got married in 2003, so well within the new guidelines, I just thought it was odd that they said that I was on my own, when I am not.

The reason I ask is that we are thinking of moving to Italy and I need OH to be there (to comply with directive) with me but logistically he may have to spend more time in Ireland but I wanted to get to Italy for new school year.

I read somewhere else, that it would seem that if you have 5 years plus in the EU, that you are under your own steam if I can prove this in some way, that may help us in Italy.

[Ben]

Italybound, is your spouse Irish or other EEA? Note that spouses of Irish nationals should (usually) be on Stamp 4. Spouses of EEA nationals should be on Stamp 4 EUFam.

sideshowsue, since you have lived here as the family member of an EEA national for over 5 years, you have acquired Permanent Residency. So you should be on Stamp 5. Actually, "Stamp 5 EUFam", but I don't think the DoJ have invented that yet (they need to - they're legally obliged to). Apply for your Permanent Residence card using form EU3.

[Italybound]

Hi Benifa

Yes he is Irish born, but everyone else talked about EU Fam 4, so I was just wondering. The main reason I thought there was something different was that the girl in FAS said to the other 'She is here on her own.'

Should I apply for the permanent residency as well? Or leaveit until 2014, i ownder if the premanent residency will look bettter in my passport if we end up in Italy?

[sideshowsue]

Good god, the amount of paperwork they require for permanent residency. Thanks for posting the link for the application, but the sheer mountain of paperwork is enough to give me the vapours!

[Ben]

Hi Italybound.

Yes he is Irish born, but everyone else talked about EU Fam 4, so I was just wondering.

Unless your spouse exercised a Treaty right in another Member State and subsequently returned to Ireland, your right to reside is governed by Irish national law - not EU law - hence you get Stamp 4 rather than Stamp 4 EUFam. Not an awful lot of difference, practically speaking, unless you are a visa-required national and plan to travel to other Member States.

The main reason I thought there was something different was that the girl in FAS said to the other 'She is here on her own.'

I'd take that with a pinch of salt. Stamp 4 means "permitted to remain in Ireland until a specific date". As well as spouses of Irish citizens, Stamp 4 is the stamp number granted to a range of other non-EEA nationals, including, for example, successful asylum seekers.

Should I apply for the permanent residency as well? Or leaveit until 2014,

I'm not 100% on this, but I believe that spouses of Irish nationals, since their right to reside is decided by Irish national law and not EU law, may apply for permanent residency only after 8 years of "reckonable residence" in the State, the same as any other non-EEA national is.

i ownder if the premanent residency will look bettter in my passport if we end up in Italy?

Makes no odds.

Good god, the amount of paperwork they require for permanent residency. Thanks for posting the link for the application, but the sheer mountain of paperwork is enough to give me the vapours!

Another pinch of salt. Proof of your relationship to the EEA national, proof that the EEA national has been exercising Treaty rights for the last 5 years, together with proof of residency for at least the last 5 years should be all you need to submit, apart from the application forms.