Refused due to marraige certificate

chand · Post by **chand** » Sat May 16, 2009 12:50 pm

Hi guys jus wondering if anyone has experienced the same outcome. MY hubby applied for settlement visa which was rejected although we submitted both urdu nikanama and english copy of marriage certificate which was certified by an advocate in the kechari in pakistan which is the council. Despite this the refusal said we did not submit a marraige certificate and returned all the evidence including these two marriage certificates. They did not say anything like they believe the marraige certificate maybe fake etc they have said we did not submit when we did

we have now appealed and submitted this same proof again after getting it checked by two solicitors and have a review date for september.

plz advise me and let me know if this has happened to anyone b4 and if u appealed wat was the outcome

Post by **John** » Sat May 16, 2009 2:03 pm

Have you asked the ECM ... Entry Clearance Manager at the British Mission to review the application and its refusal?

On the basis of what you post, the decision of the ECO to refuse the application looks very wrong and accordingly the ECM could well overturn the refusal, a lot quicker than September.

chand · Post by **chand** » Sat May 16, 2009 2:08 pm

my solicitor faxed the appeal to the AIT in the UK and the AIT have written a letter to me that the ECO has up until the 10th sept to review his decision i know it is completly wrong all the correct evidence was their in front of them they just refused it out of spite

Danbrix · Post by **Danbrix** » Sat May 16, 2009 2:16 pm

At the VAC they have a checklist form of items that they use when dealing with spousal visa applications. As I understood, it needs to be signed by the applicant at the time of the application. It clearly has a check box for marriage certificate. Now, I don't know if you have a copy of this but what is your/your husband's recollection of this form at the time of the application?

chand · Post by **chand** » Sat May 16, 2009 2:59 pm

my hubby submitted everything that is mentioned on this checklist form but did not sign this form he just signed the checklist form on the back of the settlement visa application which states submit marraige certificate.

Post by **batleykhan** » Sat May 16, 2009 4:03 pm

my solicitor faxed the appeal to the AIT in the UK and the AIT have written a letter to me that the ECO has up until the 10th sept to review his decision i know it is completly wrong all the correct evidence was their in front of them they just refused it out of spite

He should have not sent it to AIT.He should have posted the Appeal Notice to the BHC in Islamabad.

AIT will now send it to BHC, but it could take upto 6 weeks and by the time ECM looks at it, it could take another 4 weeks. Had you sent it direct,you could have got a quicker response. Its to late to do it now, and you will have to wait till the ECM looks at it and then hope he changes his mind.

If he doesnt then its a 6 months wait for the hearing in the UK..

What does teh Refusal Notice actually stay. I am suprised that the ECO cocked it up so badly

chand · Post by **chand** » Mon May 18, 2009 1:43 pm

it said you failed to submit marraige certificate thereofre i am not satisfied you are married

susy1 · Post by **susy1** » Mon May 18, 2009 2:31 pm

chand wrote:it said you failed to submit marraige certificate thereofre i am not satisfied you are married

Hi Chand,

sorry to hear about the refusal. the same thing happened to my husbands application. We did provide the marriage certs but the embassy (in islamabad) insisted that we didnt even though they returned the certs back to us.

We appealed against this and sent the Appeal docs with the marriage certs again, explaining why we felt the ECO was wrong in refusing the visa, and submitted the docs to the ISB embassy hoping that the ECO would take a look and overturn the decision. It turned out that they had sent the docs to the AIT in UK, without looking at them. The AIT logged it onto their system and sent the docs back to pakistan. Fortunately, the ECM overturned the decision and my husband got his visa. He was refused in June, the decision to overturn the refusal was in October, and he got his Visa in Nov. It took almost 5 to 6 months or so. The advice from the AIT website states it can take up to 8 months.

I wish you loads of luck and hope they overturn the refusal, and also hope its not a long process.

chand · Post by **chand** » Mon May 18, 2009 3:22 pm

so i'm not the only one they have done this to they are so stupid my hubby's appeal was registered with the AIT on the 27th April

six months is so long did you appeal got overturned by the ECO or was it overturnd after a ct hearing

Post by **batleykhan** » Mon May 18, 2009 5:17 pm

Chand

This is one mighty cockup ( sorry for the phrase). It just proves that some of the ECO are a bunch of incompetent twits.

Had it been a visitors visa, I would have said dont bother appealing and reapply again. However because its settlement you cant do, because its so expensive.

I suppose there is nothing to stop you writting to the ECM at the BHC in Pakistan, pointing out this error out and ask him if he could reconsider whilst he is awaiting to recieve the appeal papers from AIT in UK. (Send him copies of marriage certificates).

You never know, he might look into it , but I would not hold your hopes to high because they dont accept their mistakes that easily and certainly make no effort to rectify them immediately

susy1 · Post by **susy1** » Tue May 19, 2009 9:37 am

chand wrote:so i'm not the only one they have done this to they are so stupid my hubby's appeal was registered with the AIT on the 27th April

six months is so long did you appeal got overturned by the ECO or was it overturnd after a ct hearing

They are a bunch of incompetent stupid pathetic exasperating lazy dumb low life scumbags (the list could go on) who cannot read, or understand anything, and love wasting time.

Six months was a long time but compared to other people, we were a bit lucky as sometimes appeals can go on for a longer time.

Thankfully our case didnt get to the hearing stage. When the AIT lodged the appeal, they sent it back for the ECM to review it and it was then that the ECM overturned the original decision.

Thanks to Batleykhan's kind advice, I wrote a detailed, to the point, grounds of appeal, arguing each refusal point and at the end of it I asked the ECM to please reconsider the refusal and overturn it.

Whether you sent the appeal direct to the AIT or the embassy it wouldnt really make a difference as the embassy would only send it to the ait who would send it back to the embassy.

Such a mess - but hang on and dont lose hope. you will get there eventually.

Post by **batleykhan** » Tue May 19, 2009 10:22 am

They are a bunch of incompetent stupid pathetic exasperating lazy dumb low life scumbags (the list could go on) who cannot read, or understand anything, and love wasting time.

Cor blimey, I wouldn't go as far as that. Incompetent some time yes,...but not low life scumbags. They are humans after all. They have a difficult job to do.

A nice polite letter to the ECM might do the trick.

As for where to send the Appeal paper, its always better to send it off to the BHC rather than AIT, for the simple reason that it will get dealt just a bit quicker.

AIT is ok, if you are running out of time to get the Notice in time.

chand · Post by **chand** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 6:06 pm

my hubby appeal has been lodged for the 15th april 2009 and on the AIT 11 it says the ECO has up until 10th september 2009 to decide to give visa or not will they actually take this long or is there any chance that they may decide before that date

Post by **batleykhan** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:04 pm

What will happen next is that the Entry Clearance Mananger at the BHC where you applied will get the appeal papers and any other docs that you sent. He will look at the refusal and your evidence that you have supplied.

He will have to decide whether to stick with the original decision or change it and give visa. If he sticks with original decision then he has till the date mentioned in yoiur post, to get the papers to AIT who will then set a date for an oral hearing (could take upto 6 months).The matter will be hard and the decision made by the adjudicator.

If on the other hand the ECM decides to change his mind and grant visa, it can take up to 2 months to issue you a visa without it going to a hearing

Hope this answers your queury

chand · Post by **chand** » Mon Jul 13, 2009 2:23 pm

its gonna be 3 months on july 15 still not heard anything and i thought this would be an easy case im really stressed out there are two people who i know they have made appeal thru Ait and there bundle date was in june and till this date they not heard anything from eco and the ait have not send them there hearing date either i hope this dont happen to me as well

Post by **batleykhan** » Mon Jul 13, 2009 4:49 pm

Chand

If it is any consolation, I recently dealt with an appeal where none of the papers were sent by Islamabad to AIT and evento the Home Office Presenting Officer who was doing the appeal on behalf of the HO on the day.

The PO said to the Adjudicator that no papers were send by ECM/ECO at the BHC regarding this appeal. The PO then had to log onto the HO computer network to see what the problem was. It turned out that the ECM agreed to overturn the decision 2 days before hearing and didn't bother to tell anyone.

The PO had to withdraw the refusal, and my client was issued the visa. You should have seen the Adjudicator, he blew his top off at the incompetence of the staff at the BHC and HO and said the appellant waited for 9 months for no reason. He ordered the BHC to issue the visa within 2 weeks. This was done to the relief of my client.

Dont be suprised if the same things happen to you.Its just a pity that it had come to this.

If it does and you are successful, I will let you have a copy of a complaint letter that my client wrote to the HO, severely criticizing them for the worry and heartbreak they caused her. They promised they will look into their procedure.... it looks like they've done sod all.

If it has taken over 3 months, then its likely they are not going to budge from their earlier decision and you might have to court to sort it.

chand · Post by **chand** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:50 pm

thanx for your advise batleykhan

2036789 · Post by **2036789** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 11:07 pm

isnt doing a fresh application in this kind of situation an optio, i know itll be expensive 700+, but its better then waiting 6-8 months

Post by **batleykhan** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:22 am

isnt doing a fresh application in this kind of situation an optio, i know itll be expensive 700+, but its better then waiting 6-8 months

No it certainly is not.

If we all take that attidude the BHC will be raking it in money thanks to the likes of you.

To some of us teh above is a lot of money, worked and grafted bloody hard for it.

The trouble with most applications is that they are not thought over and prepared carefully which results in a refusal.

To many people get married and want to be with each other straight away. If you want that then dont get married abroad and stick to someone here.

The idea of getting married abroad should be carefully thought out and be prepared to wait, refused and going through lengthy procedures and the ups and down that brings.

I suppose if you are loaded with dosh, then its not a problem. Unfortunately there very few of these people.

2036789 · Post by **2036789** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:49 pm

baitley i appreciate that but for some of us the waiting can be torture and can affect one health, my wife had to be admitted into hospiotal because of the stress appeal is not an option for me

chand · Post by **chand** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 2:26 pm

im really stressed i dont know whether i've submitted the correct documents i have submitted the original urdu nikanama and a certified english translation of it by the union council in pakistan however the translation is titled Form of Nikanama under muslim law act and is not titled marraige certificate,

on the notice of refusal it said we had failed to submit marraige certificate,

the word nikanama means marraige certificate, my solicitor said that this is the correct translation document despite the fact it doesnt say marraige certificate on the english translation as it says form of nikahnama some1 plz advise

Post by **batleykhan** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 4:02 pm

Chand

PM me with your email address /phone number, I will give you an English version of Form B ( Pakistan Nikkah Namma).

Stop worrying dear,save the stress for when you start married life!!!!!!

Post by **batleykhan** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 6:00 pm

See your email. i have sent an English translation version of the Pakistan nikkah namma to you

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Refused due to marraige certificate

Refused due to marraige certificate