Citizenship rule not changed for HSMP !!!!!

[willnotbackHSMP]

Yes , its right. But so far I can remember that all post Nov '06 HSMP and Tire-1 people had signed ( still doing ) in a acknowledgement that they were aware about any changes of immigration rules, if any, in future, wasn't ?

[dr_raihan29]

exactly! that was the point also made to me over the phone when i called up(see prev post) and thats why they said pre nov 06 hsmp has a so called reasonable expectation as we did not sign anything like this

[camcan]

Yes I know the point being reffered to... but this can be easily challenged as the document recently released dosn't say ........ YOU KNEW THAT YOU WILL GET ILR.... rather says LEGITIMATE expectation....
The word to note is LEGITIMATE i believe this guidance definatley gives a LEGITIMATE (Justifiable or lawfull)expectation to believe by the rules in place at that time......thus giving you a lawfull expectation.... The fact that the paper was signed doesn't mean you dont have a LEGITIMATE or (JUSTIFIABLE) expectation, One still has the justification from law and documentation at the time they applied for HSMP.... if it wasn't for the signature than you probably DESERVE TO GET IT ....not JUST legitimate EXPECTATION.....well any ways thats what i understand Legitimate means (something you have a LEGITIMATE (guidance notes) to expect not necessarily deserve it.....

The other thing is HO could have easily said as they say every where else for JR cases. ALL PRE NOV 2006 HSMP holders would be considred instead it was only said HSMP.....they have given me even a further reason to believe with this release because my entry clearence clearly says HSMP and thats what i applied for but i still believe even Tier1 Should be safe as well... as the guidance notes are clear...

Please see wording below for the new statment

legitimate expectation that they would be able to apply for and be granted indefinite leave to remain, in accordance with the Immigration Rules that were in place when they applied to the HSMP.

exactly! that was the point also made to me over the phone when i called up(see prev post) and thats why they said pre nov 06 hsmp has a so called reasonable expectation as we did not sign anything like this

[hsmp2010]

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/manag ... l-it-work/

This page explains how the Government's new earned citizenship system will work.
There will be three routes to citizenship:
Work - for highly skilled and skilled workers who are in the United Kingdom under Tiers 1 and 2 of the points-based system);
Family - for the family members of existing British citizens and permanent residents; and
Protection - for refugees and migrants who have been given humanitarian protection.
For all of these routes, there will be three clear stages which a migrant must complete.

So in bold letters one can clearly see that following rules are for Tier1 and Tier2 of points based system. and we are under scheme of HSMP not Tier 1 or Tier 2 so i am now 100% sure that we are safe enough.

[vc]

You may be right, its possible HO has changed their position on legitimate expectation. Referring to the research paper 09/47 of 22nd May 09 on the Borders Citizenship and Immigration Bill page 46, following is the relevant text –

para 1

The Government’s position is that “a migrant’s only legitimate expectation is to be assessed under the rules in force at the time of their applicationâ€

[camcan]

I think a lot of people under HSMP need to extend under Tier 1 for extension but this doesn't change definately the rules at the time they came here and joined the scheme and i believe for even tier 1 its the RULE AT THAT point when they joined it...... so if HO even messes up Tier 1 or Post Nov 2006 HSMP ...... they might be facing another case... HSMP forum is already active on this i believe if you look on there site...

[quote="vc"]You may be right, its possible HO has changed their position on legitimate expectation. Referring to the research paper 09/47 of 22nd May 09 on the Borders Citizenship and Immigration Bill page 46, following is the relevant text –

para 1

The Government’s position is that “a migrant’s only legitimate expectation is to be assessed under the rules in force at the time of their applicationâ€

[camcan]

vc the document below further gives us further expectation .... Not less

[quote="vc"]You may be right, its possible HO has changed their position on legitimate expectation. Referring to the research paper 09/47 of 22nd May 09 on the Borders Citizenship and Immigration Bill page 46, following is the relevant text –

para 1

The Government’s position is that “a migrant’s only legitimate expectation is to be assessed under the rules in force at the time of their applicationâ€

[vc]

yes it does and also that earned citizenship implementation schedule has been delayed by six months - perhaps just to accomodate the last lot who entered with hsmp in end mid 08 ... will wait and see.


[quote="camcan"]vc the document below further gives us further expectation .... Not less

[quote="vc"]You may be right, its possible HO has changed their position on legitimate expectation. Referring to the research paper 09/47 of 22nd May 09 on the Borders Citizenship and Immigration Bill page 46, following is the relevant text –

para 1

The Government’s position is that “a migrant’s only legitimate expectation is to be assessed under the rules in force at the time of their applicationâ€

[push]

yes it does and also that earned citizenship implementation schedule has been delayed by six months - perhaps just to accomodate the last lot who entered with hsmp in end mid 08 ... will wait and see.

Where did you get that from? Has there been a further change? How does that help ppl who got their HSMP in mid 08? If that was the intention dont you think HO would have said - whosoever entered in UK on HSMP will not be subject to changes in the Citizenship rules? Although I am not suggesting anything to the contrary, either.

[vc]

Push, their press release mentions that the implementation date was postponed by six months to july 2011. The rest I am only hoping is the case since transitional arrangements will be on for the period July 2011 to july 2013 and thereafter the existing provisions will be deleted, like I said will have to wait and see.... About HO saying "whosoever entered on HSMP....", they could have simply mentioned hsmp JR to avoid confusion if that was the case. Besides they could have also delayed implementation further till nov 2011 when the last batch of pre points based hsmp would complete five years.

yes it does and also that earned citizenship implementation schedule has been delayed by six months - perhaps just to accomodate the last lot who entered with hsmp in end mid 08 ... will wait and see.

Where did you get that from? Has there been a further change? How does that help ppl who got their HSMP in mid 08? If that was the intention dont you think HO would have said - whosoever entered in UK on HSMP will not be subject to changes in the Citizenship rules? Although I am not suggesting anything to the contrary, either.

[camcan]

Exactly right VC thats what i think as well... that home office could clearly say JR.... but they have been ambiguous always... even when they changed the rule for Tier1.... They mentioned it won't effect Tire 1 applicants in country... but never mentioned HSMP..... but at they end they said this goes to HSMP as well...... so lets hope they clarify it in a ways its best for all for us on HSMP and also Tier 1.... I Think they should just say that it wont apply to people already in country.....

Push, their press release mentions that the implementation date was postponed by six months to july 2011. The rest I am only hoping is the case since transitional arrangements will be on for the period July 2011 to july 2013 and thereafter the existing provisions will be deleted, like I said will have to wait and see.... About HO saying "whosoever entered on HSMP....", they could have simply mentioned hsmp JR to avoid confusion if that was the case. Besides they could have also delayed implementation further till nov 2011 when the last batch of pre points based hsmp would complete five years.

yes it does and also that earned citizenship implementation schedule has been delayed by six months - perhaps just to accomodate the last lot who entered with hsmp in end mid 08 ... will wait and see.

Where did you get that from? Has there been a further change? How does that help ppl who got their HSMP in mid 08? If that was the intention dont you think HO would have said - whosoever entered in UK on HSMP will not be subject to changes in the Citizenship rules? Although I am not suggesting anything to the contrary, either.

[ashishashah]

This is just nightmare...They promised some thing else while giving HSMP visa.Then keep moving the goal post (They wait for some one to challenge them in court to stop changes applied retrospctively!!!)

[vc]

I think all participants who agreed to "make uk your main home.." in the hsmp form will be okay this time... and if not will be able to successfully challenge.

This is just nightmare...They promise some thing else while giving HSMP visa..Then keep moving the goal post...They would expect some one to challgenge them in court to stop changes applied retrospctively!!!

[push]

Push, their press release mentions that the implementation date was postponed by six months to july 2011. The rest I am only hoping is the case since transitional arrangements will be on for the period July 2011 to july 2013 and thereafter the existing provisions will be deleted, like I said will have to wait and see.... About HO saying "whosoever entered on HSMP....", they could have simply mentioned hsmp JR to avoid confusion if that was the case. Besides they could have also delayed implementation further till nov 2011 when the last batch of pre points based hsmp would complete five years.

yes it does and also that earned citizenship implementation schedule has been delayed by six months - perhaps just to accomodate the last lot who entered with hsmp in end mid 08 ... will wait and see.

Where did you get that from? Has there been a further change? How does that help ppl who got their HSMP in mid 08? If that was the intention dont you think HO would have said - whosoever entered in UK on HSMP will not be subject to changes in the Citizenship rules? Although I am not suggesting anything to the contrary, either.

July 2011 was mentioned even during the discussion on the Bill. The two year transition period you are talking about refers to those who have ILR by July 2011. If I remember correctly, they will have an option to apply for citizenship within two years from July 2011. Pls check the other thread I mentioned earlier on further details. Anyways, its purely academic to discuss on the issue until we see the actual rules and guidelines.

[srirags]

In the extension approval letter (HSMP to Tier 1), it is mentioned that

This extension to your leave to remain completely replaces your previous leave includin any conditions that were attached to that leave

So we those who got their extension under Tier 1 are no more HSMP holders and the chances of considering us as HSMP applicant are meager eventhough we entered on HSMP visa.

As push said earlier, we need to wait for the official document from the Home Office.

[zoro]

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Transitio ... 0209184429