How to relieve in 15 days where the notice period is 2 month

[hrissue]

I have a question for which I need suggestions.

I have been working in an Indian IT company for the past 4 years with my overall experience of 6+ years. For the past 2 years I have been deputed onsite(abroad) and have been working at a client location. I have recently got an opportunity with a local employer here. The pay is quite lucrative and I have already made up my mind to join. My present Visa restricts me to work for any other employer unless it is transferred to the new employer.
The new employer is ready to take over the sponsorship for the existing visa but once the change of nomination is lodged with the immigration I need to join the new employer within 15 days as it is a legal requirement from immigration.
Now here's the issue....

Since I am a permanent employee of the Indian IT company and been onsite, I need to serve a minimum notice period of 2 months. Though I am not on a very critical project assignment so the current client where I am deputed should be able to relieve me without any problem and 15 days notice is good enough.
But my Indian IT company will definitely not be happy about it.

Would like to understand the best way going forward-

1) I wish to resign and give a notice of only 15 days but at the same time would try to convince the company of the visa situation.
2) I can assure them I will be available over email, phone etc during the next 2 months to ensure the new replacement can come up to speed and would support in hand over as much as possible. The company only once satisfied can provide the relieving letter post 2 months.
3) My new employer since a foreign company does not require any relieving letter but I would like to leave my present employer in a professional manner.
4) At the same time, 2 months notice is a bit too much and I can at max buy a notice period of extra 15 days (30 days in total with 15 already in my notice period).
5) How can I avoid this extra 1 month, since as per the employment contract I need to provide 2 months notice.


Is there any way where I can get the relieving letter? and what is the best approach going forward?
or should I just leave after 15 days without caring for the relieving letter at all, since as I understand most of the international labour laws enforce a notice period duration of only 15 days and most of the internation companies dont require relieving letter.

Please advice... Do let me know if further information is required.

[meats]

As i'm guessing that this is in relation to a company in Australia or New Zealand i suggest asking on an Australian or New Zealand immigration board if no one responds on here.

[ChetanOjha]

1) I wish to resign and give a notice of only 15 days but at the same time would try to convince the company of the visa situation.
2) I can assure them I will be available over email, phone etc during the next 2 months to ensure the new replacement can come up to speed and would support in hand over as much as possible. The company only once satisfied can provide the relieving letter post 2 months.
3) My new employer since a foreign company does not require any relieving letter but I would like to leave my present employer in a professional manner.
4) At the same time, 2 months notice is a bit too much and I can at max buy a notice period of extra 15 days (30 days in total with 15 already in my notice period).
5) How can I avoid this extra 1 month, since as per the employment contract I need to provide 2 months notice.If your client send you this email, your employer do not have any base (in UK) to hold you for two months(considering legal complexity) and you will be happy man.

Is there any way where I can get the relieving letter? and what is the best approach going forward?
or should I just leave after 15 days without caring for the relieving letter at all, since as I understand most of the international labour laws enforce a notice period duration of only 15 days and most of the internation companies dont require relieving letter.

Please advice... Do let me know if further information is required.

How are you paid here? Are you paid allowances in UK and some salary in India? If yes, then while leaving you will have to pay Indian salary and not UK. As you said, you are working for an Indian company, most of the employment contract, promises you made was in India and not in UK. Employment rules are different both in UK and India. Besides, to be on a safer side, if you are working on a client side and if you have good relation with client, ask him to send an email to you saying he is happy to release you in 15 days instead of 2 months and during this 15 days you will be able to knowledge transfer and other handover activities. Your Indian employer will have no base to hold/harrass you for 2 months.

IN LIGHTER VEIN:Go tell your boss that you love his wife . I can gaurantee he will take care of your release with immediate effect.

[meats]

1) I wish to resign and give a notice of only 15 days but at the same time would try to convince the company of the visa situation.
2) I can assure them I will be available over email, phone etc during the next 2 months to ensure the new replacement can come up to speed and would support in hand over as much as possible. The company only once satisfied can provide the relieving letter post 2 months.
3) My new employer since a foreign company does not require any relieving letter but I would like to leave my present employer in a professional manner.
4) At the same time, 2 months notice is a bit too much and I can at max buy a notice period of extra 15 days (30 days in total with 15 already in my notice period).
5) How can I avoid this extra 1 month, since as per the employment contract I need to provide 2 months notice.If your client send you this email, your employer do not have any base (in UK) to hold you for two months(considering legal complexity) and you will be happy man.

Is there any way where I can get the relieving letter? and what is the best approach going forward?
or should I just leave after 15 days without caring for the relieving letter at all, since as I understand most of the international labour laws enforce a notice period duration of only 15 days and most of the internation companies dont require relieving letter.

Please advice... Do let me know if further information is required.

How are you paid here? Are you paid allowances in UK and some salary in India? If yes, then while leaving you will have to pay Indian salary and not UK. As you said, you are working for an Indian company, most of the employment contract, promises you made was in India and not in UK. Employment rules are different both in UK and India. Besides, to be on a safer side, if you are working on a client side and if you have good relation with client, ask him to send an email to you saying he is happy to release you in 15 days instead of 2 months and during this 15 days you will be able to knowledge transfer and other handover activities. Your Indian employer will have no base to hold/harrass you for 2 months.

IN LIGHTER VEIN:Go tell your boss that you love his wife . I can gaurantee he will take care of your release with immediate effect.

I'm guessing this is in relation to an Australian or Kiwi company seeing as it was originally posted on there.

[ChetanOjha]

IN LIGHTER VEIN:Go tell your boss that you love his wife . I can gaurantee he will take care of your release with immediate effect.

I'm guessing this is in relation to an Australian or Kiwi company seeing as it was originally posted on there.

Well not sure about Aussie or Kiwi rules. But suggestion above would still works

Jokes apart, hrissue please post your query in appropriate forum. Posting in all boards will confuse people who are replying.

[meats]

IN LIGHTER VEIN:Go tell your boss that you love his wife . I can gaurantee he will take care of your release with immediate effect.

I'm guessing this is in relation to an Australian or Kiwi company seeing as it was originally posted on there.

Well not sure about Aussie or Kiwi rules. But suggestion above would still works

Jokes apart, hrissue please post your query in appropriate forum. Posting in all boards will confuse people who are replying.

Yes i reckon that that advice would indeed get you out of a contract

[hrissue]

Yes I am currently based out of Australia and the new employer willing to hire me is also here though its an MNC company.
Regarding my salary I am on a deputation so part of my on site salary is diverted to indian bank account every month, so you can say the entire payroll is in dollars.
So, if I decide to leave within 15 days and say get a no objection letter from my client as well, the chances are very high that my Indian company would still not be willing to relieve me, in that case can I just leave.....
How important is it to get the relieving letter from the company, as I know in future interviews I can always tell the new employers that there was minimum impact to the project and there was no objection from the client as well so I left. In the long run will my relation with managers of the X company sour?? and will I land up intro troubles later on?
please advice...

[ChetanOjha]

Yes I am currently based out of Australia and the new employer willing to hire me is also here though its an MNC company.
Regarding my salary I am on a deputation so part of my on site salary is diverted to indian bank account every month, so you can say the entire payroll is in dollars.

If your salary is diverted to Indian account(or in India), I would still considered to be paid in India and not in Australia. You can phrase the statement in different way too. By using word "diverting" your employer is getting away of paying you onsite salary(which at the moment you are receiving in two parts i.e. India+Onsite) and Basic(+few perks) Salary in India.In this case. You are only gettingt allowances in Australia. As far as I know you can pay them 2month worth of part of the salary(or basic salary) you are receiving in India.

So, if I decide to leave within 15 days and say get a no objection letter from my client as well, the chances are very high that my Indian company would still not be willing to relieve me, in that case can I just leave..... Well..If your client gives you no objection certificate there is no logicall reason why your Indian company should keep you. I know most of the companies do that just to harass people and to make sure their exist is as difficult as possible. Once professionally released from client you can take sick leave and join your new employer. This sick leave will cover your notice period. Tell them you got chicken pox. I am sure they won't allow you to come office. As a result they will want to get rid of you as early as possible otherwise they have to pay you atleast basic salary or some medical allowances(if it is a part of your renumeration package).

How important is it to get the relieving letter from the company, as I know in future interviews I can always tell the new employers that there was minimum impact to the project and there was no objection from the client as well so I left. In the long run will my relation with managers of the X company sour?? and will I land up intro troubles later on?

Releiving letter is not that important. But it helps for Visa processing, ILR(whatever equivalent in Australia) processing etc.You don't have to worry about future inteviewer(since you have client's release email). In the short run, your current employer(along with your HR and manager) are screwing you and making your notice period as difficult as possible. Do you think you will keep relationship with them in the long run especially when such big opportunity is at stake? Gone are the days when people were identified by their company brand. Nobody cares what your previous manager think about you as long as you justify actions by your performance.

Hope this will help.

please advice...

[hrissue]

Thanks so much for the update this really helps..
Just to make things more clear, I am providing the text that is mentioned in my current deputation letter.

We are pleased to extend your assignment at the client xxxx Australia. The terms and conditions are as follows.
1. Salary and Allowances in India
You will be paid your basic, special pay and 12% of your basic as employers contribution towards PF as your Indian salary in indian currency.

2. Allowances while abroad
Global Gross Compensation
Your global gross compensation at your location during assignment in australia is AUD xxxx per month. This amount includs the amount paid to you in india, in indian rupees mentioned in clause 1 above.

My basic indian salary component is of course very minimal,so I dont mind paying them 2 months of basic indian salary as well
so this would just be my basic indian salary with no incentives, hra etc.? as this is hardly around 12000 INR per month.

My worry is what if they ask me in dollars which I get in Australia then I am in trouble. I understand your response earlier, but do you have any link from any of the government agencies or sites that explains what you have just said. It will really help me in arguing with them and something that I can show them as a rule....

You are right, I should be in a position to get the "no objecttion" email from my present client which would help me in future.

Also, it is a worst case scenario and no company would dare to do that, but can i be sued in the court of law by the company by not giving them sufficient notice period of 2 months and instead giving them just 15 calender days?

Thanks so much for all your help!! really appreciated.....

[nm]

Hi

You try negotiate with your HR or your manager, they may waive off your notice period as this
is happend to friend of mine who transfered the work permit and left the company in a week.His manger spoke with HR and waived off his notice period.

[hrissue]

Yes, I shall be doing that..
but can someone reply to the questions i had asked in the last blog...
I just want to make sure I have all options in mind while having discussions with the HR.

[meats]

"Also, it is a worst case scenario and no company would dare to do that, but can i be sued in the court of law by the company by not giving them sufficient notice period of 2 months and instead giving them just 15 calender days?"

If they don't waive your notice period then yes they can take further action against you if you work for someone else during that period.

[ChetanOjha]

Thanks so much for the update this really helps..
Just to make things more clear, I am providing the text that is mentioned in my current deputation letter.

We are pleased to extend your assignment at the client xxxx Australia. The terms and conditions are as follows.
1. Salary and Allowances in India
You will be paid your basic, special pay and 12% of your basic as employers contribution towards PF as your Indian salary in indian currency.

2. Allowances while abroad
Global Gross Compensation
Your global gross compensation at your location during assignment in australia is AUD xxxx per month. This amount includs the amount paid to you in india, in indian rupees mentioned in clause 1 above.

My basic indian salary component is of course very minimal,so I dont mind paying them 2 months of basic indian salary as well
so this would just be my basic indian salary with no incentives, hra etc.? as this is hardly around 12000 INR per month.

My worry is what if they ask me in dollars which I get in Australia then I am in trouble. I understand your response earlier, but do you have any link from any of the government agencies or sites that explains what you have just said. It will really help me in arguing with them and something that I can show them as a rule....

You are right, I should be in a position to get the "no objecttion" email from my present client which would help me in future.

Also, it is a worst case scenario and no company would dare to do that, but can i be sued in the court of law by the company by not giving them sufficient notice period of 2 months and instead giving them just 15 calender days?

Thanks so much for all your help!! really appreciated.....

I had similar issue with my Indian employer who paid me allowances in UK and basic salary in India. Initially they threatened me and pushed me for 2 month UK allowances. But then my arguments was how they can ask for 2 months of "allowances" which is nothing but a living allowances and not salary. No company can ask you to pay allowances. Besides, your contract with your company is to pay 2 month salary (and not allowance).Wordings of your letter above also talk about "allowance while abroad in USD" instead of "salary while aborad". I am not sure about what "special pay" means above?

If you resign and stick to your point, I don't think your employer can push you much to pay for allowances. Sue them if they do so. Release email from client will help you, if your company decides to push you harder. You can always prove using the email that your employer is doing all this will wrong intentions and just to harrass you.


If your manager threatens you for suing(mostly over phone), make sure to send him email confirming what all your have discussed over phone and ask him to acknowledge it. This should put them on backfoot. WHILE DEALING WITH ALL ABOVE, MAKE SURE YOU BEHAVE PROFESSIONALLY AND IN CIVIL MANNER EVEN IF YOUR EMPLOYER THREATENS YOU.

But I hope it will be very peacefull and quick exit.

[hrissue]

I have got quite a lot of points to add to the case now!! if you have some more do let me know.

- Not on a critical assignment at the client location, so can relieve in 15 days.
- no objection email from client.
- legal requirement of immigration of joining within 15 days after a change of visa nomination.
- to be available over phone,email post 15 days to ensure the hand over to the new resource is smooth.
-at max, if they want notice period to be bought, I can use my 15 days of leave + 15 days of my notice period. the remaining 1 month i can pay them in Indian basic salary.. nothing more than that..
-if they still dont agree, post 15 days I shall not come to the office and would apply leave for 1 month saying i am going for holidays to india and would join the new employer. I am sure they will not be giving me relieving in that case...

But I guess, you are right if I follow the process professionally all in writing I can at least have these proofs to be shown to my future employers in case they want to know why I dont have relieving letter.....

[ChetanOjha]

I have got quite a lot of points to add to the case now!! if you have some more do let me know.

- Not on a critical assignment at the client location, so can relieve in 15 days.
- no objection email from client.
- legal requirement of immigration of joining within 15 days after a change of visa nomination.
- to be available over phone,email post 15 days to ensure the hand over to the new resource is smooth. Why available without being paid? Remember this shuold be favour from you to your manager as a good gesture which you are free to revoke anytime. You shouldn't play on this gesture.
-at max, if they want notice period to be bought, I can use my 15 days of leave + 15 days of my notice period. the remaining 1 month i can pay them in Indian basic salary.. nothing more than that.. Yes.
-if they still dont agree, post 15 days I shall not come to the office and would apply leave for 1 month saying i am going for holidays to india and would join the new employer. I am sure they will not be giving me relieving in that case... Yes, you can take leave. Your employer will provide you all releiving letter etc after your notice period expires. They also have to do final settlement etc, which by-law they cannot escape.
But I guess, you are right if I follow the process professionally all in writing I can at least have these proofs to be shown to my future employers in case they want to know why I dont have relieving letter.....
Yes, you can show to your employer to you can keep it as a proof of your professional conduct even on the brink of leaving. This would be very helpful should your employer want to harrass you.

Start your negotiation with positive mind-set. I don't think your employer will want to talk to around to great extent. The reason is, they deal with similar cases very often. If they messed up with you and you sue them, it will set an example for other employees to follow in worst case, which they wouldn't want to do. It's in their best interest.

[SKUK]

no objection email from client

If you ask me, I would say don't get your client to do this. You will be shooting yourself in the foot. It would irk your employer if they were to get an email from the client and things can get messy.

Serving your notice period is between you and your employer. You can always take your client into confidence, tell them that you would like to be relieved sooner and request them to agree on an earlier date if your employer were to enquire with them about this.

[hrissue]

Thanks so much for all your inputs and suggestions....
I shall take all this forward, and let you know what's the final outcome..
lets hope for the best!!
cheers!

[ghulbhai]

hrissue

i hope your visa and work gets screwed.

you have the slightest regard for your employer whatsoever they did to you. you dont have to be loyal, but then you couldnt have been any cheaper. no wonder why employers are laying off people in 1000s.

i wish you get laid off in no time. sorry. let this be a lesson to people who think they can get away easily from everything.

[hrissue]

Well if you dont know the full picture, don't pass any general comments..
lets not get into loyalty and ethics here when we all know what is the model of indian companies onsite!!!
I know lets not be critical about everything, but then I am going to follow the full procedure and give enough notice..
its not that i am going to walk off tomorrow with no notice at all. I am ready to buy my notice period as well..
C'mon we are not bonded labours where the companies dictate what we can or cannot do...
The labour laws of the foreign land and india are also protecting the interest of the employee of course you are expected to follow some procedures and ethics...

[ChetanOjha]

hrissue

i hope your visa and work gets screwed.

you have the slightest regard for your employer whatsoever they did to you. you dont have to be loyal, but then you couldnt have been any cheaper. no wonder why employers are laying off people in 1000s.

i wish you get laid off in no time. sorry. let this be a lesson to people who think they can get away easily from everything.

Since you are from Bangalore, I would quote Narayanmurthy's remark in one of the Infosys's meeting "People should be loyal to their jobs not their employers". Don't think that is cheap. Besides, this person who served his company and in end get screwed just because he wants a early release to persue his dream somewhere else. Everybody has that right. His employer neither provide opportunity nor money to do the same. What would you call cheap?

Besides, some of your posts below, which rather qualifies as cheap. Just because you "can" point fingures does't mean you "should".

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... 481#275481

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#272073

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#225146

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... 656#309656

[vnvijay]

Hi Chetan,

Your very much true, if ghulbhai wants to help others let him help or just give an advise & forget it. Why does he want to talk such things. its very bad . any ways we need to keep going.

VJ

hrissue

i hope your visa and work gets screwed.

you have the slightest regard for your employer whatsoever they did to you. you dont have to be loyal, but then you couldnt have been any cheaper. no wonder why employers are laying off people in 1000s.

i wish you get laid off in no time. sorry. let this be a lesson to people who think they can get away easily from everything.

Since you are from Bangalore, I would quote Narayanmurthy's remark in one of the Infosys's meeting "People should be loyal to their jobs not their employers". Don't think that is cheap. Besides, this person who served his company and in end get screwed just because he wants a early release to persue his dream somewhere else. Everybody has that right. His employer neither provide opportunity nor money to do the same. What would you call cheap?

Besides, some of your posts below, which rather qualifies as cheap. Just because you "can" point fingures does't mean you "should".

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... 481#275481

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#272073

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#225146

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... 656#309656

[ghulbhai]

Well if you dont know the full picture, don't pass any general comments..
lets not get into loyalty and ethics here when we all know what is the model of indian companies onsite!!!
I know lets not be critical about everything, but then I am going to follow the full procedure and give enough notice..
its not that i am going to walk off tomorrow with no notice at all. I am ready to buy my notice period as well..
C'mon we are not bonded labours where the companies dictate what we can or cannot do...
The labour laws of the foreign land and india are also protecting the interest of the employee of course you are expected to follow some procedures and ethics...

buying a notice period - how cheaper can you get?

do you guys understand the purpose of notice at all? notice period is for you to serve any pending issues, help your employer find a replacement and handover jobs. moreover handhold till the client is comfortable with the replacement. and 2 months is not lifetime. and buying notice periods - well - if onyl we could buy mothers and fathers.

[ghulbhai]

hrissue

i hope your visa and work gets screwed.

you have the slightest regard for your employer whatsoever they did to you. you dont have to be loyal, but then you couldnt have been any cheaper. no wonder why employers are laying off people in 1000s.

i wish you get laid off in no time. sorry. let this be a lesson to people who think they can get away easily from everything.

Since you are from Bangalore, I would quote Narayanmurthy's remark in one of the Infosys's meeting "People should be loyal to their jobs not their employers". Don't think that is cheap. Besides, this person who served his company and in end get screwed just because he wants a early release to persue his dream somewhere else. Everybody has that right. His employer neither provide opportunity nor money to do the same. What would you call cheap?

Besides, some of your posts below, which rather qualifies as cheap. Just because you "can" point fingures does't mean you "should".

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... 481#275481

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#272073

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#225146

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... 656#309656

chetanoja
has his employer promised a life in the UK in his employment contract and more money too ??? you seem to suggest as if the employer has promised so many things and failed to keep up.

did our friend blindly sign the employment contract without even looking at it???

we all make choices and then put the blame on employers. im not saying emplyoers are all great. But in the shade of employers, we fail to see our own mistakes.

remember, the mess IT folks create wherever we go. jumping for 5% hikes within 2 months of starting a new job. In your world this is loyalty? and being ambition minded???

Its pure money minded. And moreover, greediness.

[ghulbhai]

well my post is only about the deplorable situation we create for ourselves and setting a bad precedent. nice employees end up getting hit too. just because some of us are greedy and want to work out crooked methods.

employers may not have ethics. atleast employees should.

an eye for an eye policy will only render the earth soulless. when you quit the company, you will look back and your colleagues will only say a happy story about you, provided you came out the right way. not the crooked way of buying notice periods. what all could we buy using money???

can we buy happiness / peace ? can we buy endless life?
you name it.

[ChetanOjha]

chetanoja
has his employer promised a life in the UK in his employment contract and more money too ??? you seem to suggest as if the employer has promised so many things and failed to keep up.

did our friend blindly sign the employment contract without even looking at it???

we all make choices and then put the blame on employers. im not saying emplyoers are all great. But in the shade of employers, we fail to see our own mistakes.

remember, the mess IT folks create wherever we go. jumping for 5% hikes within 2 months of starting a new job. In your world this is loyalty? and being ambition minded???

Its pure money minded. And moreover, greediness.

I am not suggesting his employer made promises and didn't kept them. I am suggesting his employer is not even honouring his service to the company, his good relationship building with client(as inferred from his previous post) and person's personal future aspiration. What kind of employer does that? Do you think employers does this to motivate outgoing employees? Definetly not, but these procedures are designed to drag employees into unnecessary hassles. Perhaps this is what you call loyalty? What do you expect this person to do? Being loyal and do not leave the organisation even if he know his heart doesn't feel working for them? CAN YOU DO THAT? Can you imagine stress everyday you walk into the office seeing faces which has harrassed you and stopped you for chasing your dream?

As far as seeing own mistake is concerned, this person is ready to give "fair" notice period amount AS PER HIS CONTRACT(which is only valid in India but this person is still ready to honour it in good faith). I don;t see this person on the wrong side.

Jumping 5% is something a personal choice. You cannot generalised it for whol IT industry. Yes there was time when attrition was high but was it not employers who were hiring these kind of people. Didn't employer think that if somebody jump for 5%, he can jump again. Besides, employer can reject a talented candidate for 5% salary so what's wrong with jumping for 5%.

As far as loyalty toward employers is concerns, that is a thing of past. IT companies in India are working on "hire and fire" basis so why somebody has to be loyal to these companies.

Anyway....i can go on and on if you like...as I have suffered personally due to one such company.