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Southern_Sky wrote:Correctomundo Senor!
Never has a truer article been written by Kevin Myers. There's no denying the facts, that the facial demographics of Ireland are changed forever. Much like Britain in the 50' & 60's. It was only a matter of time in Ireland with Globalisation, Economic Prosperity & céad mÃle fáilte policy of successive Irish governments.
Even if, tomorrow, the most conservative of governments & immigration policy were to be voted in & implemented, the fact remains is there is no reversal of the melting-pot that Ireland has already become.
Even in the throws of the deepest economic meltdown in Irish history, the majority of legal non-EU migrants would prefer to stay here, not only because they have now planted roots, started families, have investments here but also compared to the comparatively & consistently worst situation back home in their Third-World / Developing countries.
Being the 'quintessentially native' & rightfully proud Irishman that you are....Its only natural for you to feel the way you do through a period of such dramatic change in your country's history...and as such entitled to have your say true free speech using whatever forums/outlets/avenues to express your objections, criticisms, rants etc.. backed up by mostly valid statistics.
But, at the end of the day and inspite of the sometimes constructive arguments on these forums, there is only one way forward now for Ireland....and its clearly stated the the very title of that Kevin Myers article.
Integration, Integration, Integration and proper use of the best examples of the many developed nations around the globe that has gone through the demographic change that Ireland is now experiencing, granted it was over centuries & not in a single decade But any new government policy should include policies that learn from the mistakes of a lack of proper integration in other countries. eg. Muslims in the Netherlands, Somalians in Scandinavia, Turks in Deutschland (more than 3 generations), the Humans on Pandora etc... etc...
If you're complaining & think its 'bad' now...just imagine Ireland in 20 years when the children of the Celtic Tiger's EU & non-EU migrants are all out of school, and about to have kids of their own... a 3rd generation born & bred on the Emerald Isle...hopefully an Ireland they can be finally be considered equal & fully integrated. But that process of education, acceptance & integration in all levels of society has to start now. Else the repercussions are well-documented by good 'ole straight-talking Kevin Myers.
Nothing stays the same, the only constant is change, and success is determined by how best one accepts it & adapts to it.
Perhaps much like the proposals being submitted on 'Your Country, Your Call' : http://www.yourcountryyourcall.com/index.html submissions can be made on best to proceed with such integration in Ireland.
Irish Tom is a raving lunatic and is in desperate need of a loony asylum. He can make all the noise but it aint going to change a thing. The Irish aint exactly staying in their country and Kevin Myers is a deluded nonentity and a dearly beloved.homingpigeon wrote:I have been following your trolling posts on this forum Irish Tom. In some instances you're funny but most of the time I find you gutless. Its all too easy to pick on people that are looking for help re-immigration. Like an e-thug or a comedian picking on disabled people. Most OP's don't have a great handle on the English language and would not know how to respond back to you. Keep it up champ, because most other people have lives hobbies and on this forum you feel like a winner!
Nah, it will be just grand! Surely, nothing like immigrant ghettoes on the outskirts of Paris can possibly exist in DublinKevin Myers wrote:... Dail Eireann has never had a single debate on immigration. Not one. ....
Well, we could be well on the way to creating a multi-ethnic, multicultural, multiracial dystopia. ...
I note your location, Vic. Hope you are being sarcastic.....victor8600 wrote:Nah, it will be just grand! Surely, nothing like immigrant ghettoes on the outskirts of Paris can possibly exist in DublinKevin Myers wrote:... Dail Eireann has never had a single debate on immigration. Not one. ....
Well, we could be well on the way to creating a multi-ethnic, multicultural, multiracial dystopia. ...
No country, post WW2 has seen such a change in the demographics. None what so ever. What is even more scandalous, is that the people of Ireland were never considered or asked to voice their opinion. Nobody voted for mass immigration.Southern_Sky wrote:Correctomundo Senor!
Never has a truer article been written by Kevin Myers. There's no denying the facts, that the facial demographics of Ireland are changed forever. Much like Britain in the 50' & 60's. It was only a matter of time in Ireland with Globalisation, Economic Prosperity & céad mÃle fáilte policy of successive Irish governments.
I agree to a certain extent, those who are legally in the Irish state should be allowed to remain for as long as they so wish. But then there is those who used unscrupulous methods of entering the state. Those on dodgy language school visas, those who have partaken in marriages of conveinience, those who submitted bogus asylum claims and those whom are simply illegally in the state. All can, and indeed should, be repatriated.Southern_Sky wrote:Even if, tomorrow, the most conservative of governments & immigration policy were to be voted in & implemented, the fact remains is there is no reversal of the melting-pot that Ireland has already become.
Those legal non EU immigrants whom have been issued with work permits, have been issued with just that, a work permit. Not leave to remain. We should adopt the methods of Australia and Canada. Once your work permit or visa runs out, slan abhaile.Southern_Sky wrote:Even in the throws of the deepest economic meltdown in Irish history, the majority of legal non-EU migrants would prefer to stay here, not only because they have now planted roots, started families, have investments here but also compared to the comparatively & consistently worst situation back home in their Third-World / Developing countries.
Thank you.Southern_Sky wrote:Being the 'quintessentially native' & rightfully proud Irishman that you are....Its only natural for you to feel the way you do through a period of such dramatic change in your country's history...and as such entitled to have your say true free speech using whatever forums/outlets/avenues to express your objections, criticisms, rants etc.. backed up by mostly valid statistics.
Which is.......Southern_Sky wrote:But, at the end of the day and inspite of the sometimes constructive arguments on these forums, there is only one way forward now for Ireland....and its clearly stated the the very title of that Kevin Myers article.....
I agree 100%. But we are already seeing instances of ghettoisation.Southern_Sky wrote:Integration, Integration, Integration and proper use of the best examples of the many developed nations around the globe that has gone through the demographic change that Ireland is now experiencing, granted it was over centuries & not in a single decade But any new government policy should include policies that learn from the mistakes of a lack of proper integration in other countries. eg. Muslims in the Netherlands, Somalians in Scandinavia, Turks in Deutschland (more than 3 generations), the Humans on Pandora etc... etc...
We already have repeated the same mistakes, we already have. The time for debate was ten years ago. The horse has long since bolted.Southern_Sky wrote:If you're complaining & think its 'bad' now...just imagine Ireland in 20 years when the children of the Celtic Tiger's EU & non-EU migrants are all out of school, and about to have kids of their own... a 3rd generation born & bred on the Emerald Isle...hopefully an Ireland they can be finally be considered equal & fully integrated. But that process of education, acceptance & integration in all levels of society has to start now. Else the repercussions are well-documented by good 'ole straight-talking Kevin Myers.
Yes, I am aware of the site. Great idea.Southern_Sky wrote:Perhaps much like the proposals being submitted on 'Your Country, Your Call' : http://www.yourcountryyourcall.com/index.html submissions can be made on best to proceed with such integration in Ireland.
No one is forcing a chinese national to take up the Irish Citizenship in the first place. They could always seek permanent/long term residency and after 8 years seek residency without conditions. Its a small price to pay, when you consider the additional bonus of EU citizensip.Most chinese knew about those risks the second they sent in the applicationDarkhorse wrote:Southern_Sky wrote:Correctomundo Senor!
Never has a truer article been written by Kevin Myers. There's no denying the facts, that the facial demographics of Ireland are changed forever. Much like Britain in the 50' & 60's. It was only a matter of time in Ireland with Globalisation, Economic Prosperity & céad mÃle fáilte policy of successive Irish governments.
Even if, tomorrow, the most conservative of governments & immigration policy were to be voted in & implemented, the fact remains is there is no reversal of the melting-pot that Ireland has already become.
Even in the throws of the deepest economic meltdown in Irish history, the majority of legal non-EU migrants would prefer to stay here, not only because they have now planted roots, started families, have investments here but also compared to the comparatively & consistently worst situation back home in their Third-World / Developing countries.
Being the 'quintessentially native' & rightfully proud Irishman that you are....Its only natural for you to feel the way you do through a period of such dramatic change in your country's history...and as such entitled to have your say true free speech using whatever forums/outlets/avenues to express your objections, criticisms, rants etc.. backed up by mostly valid statistics.
But, at the end of the day and inspite of the sometimes constructive arguments on these forums, there is only one way forward now for Ireland....and its clearly stated the the very title of that Kevin Myers article.
Integration, Integration, Integration and proper use of the best examples of the many developed nations around the globe that has gone through the demographic change that Ireland is now experiencing, granted it was over centuries & not in a single decade But any new government policy should include policies that learn from the mistakes of a lack of proper integration in other countries. eg. Muslims in the Netherlands, Somalians in Scandinavia, Turks in Deutschland (more than 3 generations), the Humans on Pandora etc... etc...
If you're complaining & think its 'bad' now...just imagine Ireland in 20 years when the children of the Celtic Tiger's EU & non-EU migrants are all out of school, and about to have kids of their own... a 3rd generation born & bred on the Emerald Isle...hopefully an Ireland they can be finally be considered equal & fully integrated. But that process of education, acceptance & integration in all levels of society has to start now. Else the repercussions are well-documented by good 'ole straight-talking Kevin Myers.
Nothing stays the same, the only constant is change, and success is determined by how best one accepts it & adapts to it.
Perhaps much like the proposals being submitted on 'Your Country, Your Call' : http://www.yourcountryyourcall.com/index.html submissions can be made on best to proceed with such integration in Ireland.
@Southern_Sky..... you are 100% correct.
@IrishTom.... you seems to dislike the foreigner so much. Event though some of those and been permitted to remain here. Some of those may have citizenship. I am sure you are aware some countries only allow 1 citizenship (e.g China). If a Chinese has been granted citizenship here, it is no longer possible for this individual to go back to China because he/she is foreigner in their own original country.
As Southern_sky said, the only way forward is integration. Believe me, majority of foreigner in Ireland will try to remain here for better or for worst.
Your words reminded me of the Igbinedion case where the judge told the jury to forget about their "white, western, christian values".walrusgumble wrote:
however, there are many values and attitudes in say eg, lagos, we in the western world, whether the prejudices are true or false, can not and will not accept. Some immigrants may consider themselves to be discriminated on such and brand it dearly beloved etc, but they should should get use to it as they would know well in advance the country's position.
Its matters like that one in the RTE link that can not be expected to be allowed to continue in this country without proper procedure/laws in place. Certain cultures are not accepted in places like Ireland (eg marriage of more than 1 wife) and the immigrant can not expect this country or others like it to bend over and apply this. (not saying by the way that immigrants are insisting on same)remember the nonsense with the reserve garda and their uniformIrishTom wrote:Your words reminded me of the Igbinedion case where the judge told the jury to forget about their "white, western, christian values".walrusgumble wrote:
however, there are many values and attitudes in say eg, lagos, we in the western world, whether the prejudices are true or false, can not and will not accept. Some immigrants may consider themselves to be discriminated on such and brand it dearly beloved etc, but they should should get use to it as they would know well in advance the country's position.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/1007/igbinediono.html
Irishtom I had a work permit before and after 7 years I have long term residency. I have an Irish born son Irish passport only but not white Irish like you! i have a good job as an engineer.Those legal non EU immigrants whom have been issued with work permits, have been issued with just that, a work permit. Not leave to remain. We should adopt the methods of Australia and Canada. Once your work permit or visa runs out, slan abhaile.
IrishTom wrote:How do you know I am white? Please stop bringing race into the equation. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with the numbers.smalltime wrote:.............
It'll defo make the Irish people as a whole a lot more attractive if nothing else. The gene pool here needs some serious improvement.Southern_Sky wrote:
If you're complaining & think its 'bad' now...just imagine Ireland in 20 years when the children of the Celtic Tiger's EU & non-EU migrants are all out of school, and about to have kids of their own... a 3rd generation born & bred on the Emerald Isle...
ha good one, not a tad bit dearly beloved? (what ever that means now a days) Looks aren't every thing you know! (throws silk scarf over to one side of the shoulder dramatically) By the way, "Emerald Isle" is a wee bit condensending and annoyingsovtek wrote:It'll defo make the Irish people as a whole a lot more attractive if nothing else. The gene pool here needs some serious improvement.Southern_Sky wrote:
If you're complaining & think its 'bad' now...just imagine Ireland in 20 years when the children of the Celtic Tiger's EU & non-EU migrants are all out of school, and about to have kids of their own... a 3rd generation born & bred on the Emerald Isle...
Sure who cares if we will have future multi ethnic riots, as long as we get a second generation immigrant sports star. The Italians probably said the same last month.walrusgumble wrote: Still, if it improves Irish sporting success, I see no problems