uk citizen returning with non-uk citizen wife

[sausage]

Hi

I'm a UK citizen who's been living in Australia for 7 years. 2 years ago I married my wife, who is Thai. She has just been granted permanent residency in Australia as my wife. She is not an Australian citizen, and she has a Thai passport in her maiden name. We have no children.

We wish to move to the UK, and I understand we'll have to fill in a VAF2 form for my wife.

I do not have a property in the UK - we would probably stay with friends until we get jobs and a flat sorted out. What I would like to know - if someone can help - is will it be disadvantageous to the application if I have no job or own accommodation lined up before we arrive in the UK? IE would we be better off if I returned on my own, sorted these things out, and then apply and hopefully have my wife join me? Or perhaps savings (which would be enough to support ourselves for a year or so) would override the lack of job/accommodation?

Also, I read that if we have been married for 4 years, we are able to get permanent residency more easily. Is this just a case of less paperwork, or is it advantageous in being successful in our application?

Thanks for reading.
sausage

[John]

Hi, good to see your first post.

I read that if we have been married for 4 years, we are able to get permanent residency more easily.

After you have been living together outside the UK for a minimum of four years, yes the overseas British Mission is able to issue ILE (indefinite leave to enter), assuming of course they are satisfied all the usual tests are passed. So the tests are the same .... it is just the type of visa that is issued that is different.

Otherwise it is a two-year spouse visa that would be issued, and near the end of that that would be converted in the UK into Indefinite Leave to Remain.

You are right to think that the VAF2 form is the correct one to use. The supporting evidence is very important. You need to pass a financial test .... to show that your wife will not need to claim certain Public Funds .... an accommodation test .... to show that the accommodation is suitable and certainly not overcrowded ... and that there is "evidence of contact" ... no doubt very easy to prove if the two of you have lived together for years .. but still provide the proof.

You mention savings. Those will certainly help but unless you are the proverbial lottery winner of otherwise very loaded, also document the sort of job you hope to get and how much that is likely to pay. Also if your wife will work when she gets to the UK certainly document that as well.

Accommodation? Your friends confirming details of their accommodation and that you and your wife can stay there initially should be OK. But so would a confirmed hotel booking for at least seven days. The point is that these days in is often the case that with a credit card a hotel can be booked, and if necessary later cancelled, with no charge whatsoever as long as the cancellation is no later than say 3pm on the expected date of arrival. So the plan documented to the BHC could be to stay in a nice hotel for seven days while you find somewhere permanent to live. The confirmed hotel booking would be included in your evidence folder.

I have sent you a PM.

[Kayalami]

sausage (nice festive handle),

I thought it prudent to bring up the matter of citizenship. Permanent residence status for most countries is lost if lengthy absences are accrued outside the relevant country. It might be best to obtain OZ citizenship for both you and your spouse to ease a smooth/ guaranteed return to Oz - afterall the UK you left 7 years ago may not be to your liking. I find that most countries are also making the citizenship process more onerous and costly e.g. the UK has introduced citizenship/language tests etc. I recall Oz was changing the PR timeline for citizenship. Such also ensures that any children born to you outside Oz are Ozzies too by descent. If this means spending some more time in Oz it also helps towards the 4 year timeline to direct ILE.

[sausage]

good point kayalami

i looked into it and - at the moment - an australian permanent visa is valid for up to 5 years, allowing multiple entry. after that you need to apply for a resident return visa, which presumably would be hard to get if you're now permanently living elsewhere

[ajisekanla]

Hi Everyone,

I'm in a similar situation as Sausage – Please bear with me if this is a bit long, I want to ensure you have all the facts.

I am a UK citizen and have been living in Nigeria for the past 7 years. I married my wife, who is Nigerian, about 6 months ago after a 2 and a half year courtship. We also have no children.

Before our marriage, she applied for a visitor's visa to the UK (she's never visited before) so we could to shop for our wedding but it was refused. We appealed and won, after which she was issued a 6 month single entry visa. This process took well over 6 months, which sort of defeated the point.

Would like to move to the UK together and we are unwilling to consider living apart for the time it takes to process a settlement visa in Nigeria (it currently takes about 9 weeks to secure an interview).

We are not willing to consider anything which would be in violation of UK immigration laws. Thus we are torn between applying for the settlement visa now based on our current situation, or going to the UK together to going to the UK together now to sort out our accommodation and for me to secure a job and applying later.

Specifically, we would go on holiday to use her single entry, return and apply for a 2 year multiple entry visa, return to the UK to settle down, build up a few month’s job, bank and accommodation history and then return to apply for the settlement.

Why not apply for settlement before we move? I currently have a good job in Nigeria, working with a local investment bank, however when my earnings are converted in to Pounds, it doesn't come to much, however our savings and such come to about £12,000. Although I do not have a property in the UK, my parents have a 5 bedroom home, with a car, which we can use for free until we find our feet. I am working with a recruitment consultant towards getting a job, and I’m pretty confident I should be able to get a good job in a few months.

Armed with this information, I approached the local embassy. After a few calls and emails I was able to speak with an ECO Line Manager, who said she couldn’t be certain that this would be sufficient – £12,000 can go quickly in the UK, but she felt we stood a fair chance. She suggested I write to the ECM for an opinion.

They emailed me this response:

If you are a British National returning to the UK your wife may apply for settlement to the UK at any time. The current waiting time for a settlement interview at the British Deputy High Commission, Lagos is around 8 weeks. As you say you have no current employment in the UK. This will indeed be a factor in the decision of the Entry Clearance Officer who deals with your case. You should be prepared in particular to produce evidence to the Entry Clearance Officer of finances available to you and your wife.
I cannot of course guarantee the outcome of any future application. In the event the application is not successful the fee is non-refundable.

I would like to know, whether you think we should still go ahead and apply for a settlement visa now based the information provided above, or whether going to secure a job and accommodation, etc first would be advantageous to us. I am not confident that our savings would satisfactorily meet the financial requirements.

I would also like to know, if anyone knows, whether the embassy holds on to the passport while processing the settlement application. We would very much like a situation where she can return to the UK while the application is being process, so that we can still be together. I would really like to avoid a 2-3 month separation.

[yodiyokun]

Segun,
It seems you want to eat your cake and have it... since you dont want to be apart from your wife at all...
I really dont know how that can be possible!!!!

She will definitely submit her passport for at least 1 month with the courier coy be4 she gets an interview date.

Most people that I know in your shoes have left their wife behind to get a job and an accomodation then based on that the wife can apply. If the wife has a visit visa..she can visit b4 she applies for the visa (if she dosent have a job she needs to be at)...but she has to be here to apply for the visa chikena.

I'm sure the moderators may have a different view or help you out in the way to go.....

[John]

segunokubanjo, any ECO will not say specifically that you will succeed or fail. After all they have not yet seen the "evidence folder" you will submit in support of the application.

However if that folder does indeed contain everything it needs to then I think there should be a good chance of your wife getting her spouse visa.

my parents have a 5 bedroom home, with a car, which we can use for free until we find our feet.

That is clearly a very positive aspect to your case. Not only, with the right documentation, will that get you passed on the accommodation test, but also it will help getting you passed the financial one. That is, it merely needs to be shown that your wife will not need to claim certain Public Funds. Lack of outgoings on accommodation will assist with that.

[ajisekanla]

Thanks for the responses guys.

She will definitely submit her passport for at least 1 month with the courier coy be4 she gets an interview date.

Are you certain that her passport would be returned by the courier after a month? The ukvisas website is not clear on what happens besides saying it says that it takes 9 weeks to secure an interview date.

Most people that I know in your shoes have left their wife behind to get a job and an accomodation then based on that the wife can apply. If the wife has a visit visa..she can visit b4 she applies for the visa.

Being that you are based in Lagos, are there other issues I should be aware of specific to applying to this post?

That is clearly a very positive aspect to your case. Not only, with the right documentation, will that get you passed on the accommodation test, but also it will help getting you passed the financial one.

Would a letter from them stating that they are willing to allow us to use the house, along with and documents indicating ownership be okay?

Thanks for all the help!

[yodiyokun]

segun,
have you ever applied thru DHL/UPS to the british embassy be4..........??

If you are called for interview... most of your documents are returned(depends on who is reveiewing at BHC) but i havent seen anyone whose passport was not returned..........

what will you use to enter for the interview at the BHC gate ..you need your passport and interview letter except you were called on phone or emailed to attend interview...then nothing is returned you just appear for interview.

Even if a decision is not made during the 1st interview...your passport is returned to you.

If you still are not convinced visit DHL awolowo road ikoyi..they will tell you what to expect.

as per lagos post........... you can never be too sure.. the watch word is be prepared and pray.

[John]

Would a letter from them stating that they are willing to allow us to use the house, along with and documents indicating ownership be okay?

To deal with this comprehensively I think you need :-

• A letter from them confirming the ability for you and your wife to stay in the house rent-free at least until you find somewhere else.
• Confirmation of ownership ... for an extremely low cost it is possible to download a record from the Land Registry website giving details of the ownership of the property.
• If that record will show there is a mortgage on the property, an up-to-date mortgage statement or a letter from the mortgage provider confirming that payments are up-to-date.
• Details of the house ... ignoring any Spam, bathroom or toilet, how many rooms in the house exceed 50 sq feet in size? Also, assuming the visa is granted, how many people will be living in the place? How many adults and ho many children? And if any children, their ages.
• A few pictures of the property (to show it is not just about to fall down!).

Supplying all of that will clearly show that the accommodation test will be passed .. and the rent-free aspect will help pass the financial test.

Hope that helps.

[Naiad]

To deal with this comprehensively I think you need :-

• A letter from them confirming the ability for you and your wife to stay in the house rent-free at least until you find somewhere else.
• Confirmation of ownership ... for an extremely low cost it is possible to download a record from the Land Registry website giving details of the ownership of the property.
• If that record will show there is a mortgage on the property, an up-to-date mortgage statement or a letter from the mortgage provider confirming that payments are up-to-date.
• Details of the house ... ignoring any Spam, bathroom or toilet, how many rooms in the house exceed 50 sq feet in size? Also, assuming the visa is granted, how many people will be living in the place? How many adults and ho many children? And if any children, their ages.
• A few pictures of the property (to show it is not just about to fall down!).

Supplying all of that will clearly show that the accommodation test will be passed .. and the rent-free aspect will help pass the financial test.

Hope that helps.

John, is it necessary to have all this stuff even if the UK citizen owns the house? We have the mortgage statement and bank accounts showing regular monthly payments as well as various utility bills, council taxes etc all in his name. I also have a photo of the house we can include. There are no other people than us living in the house. We don't have the Land Registry record but could get it. Is it acceptable if we write the description of the house, rooms etc ourselves?

Thanks in advance.

[John]

Firstly, the Land Registry aspect. It is extremely easy to get a copy of the Land Registry record, and indeed a map of the property. Just go to this Land Registry webpage and you will see that a copy of the Title Register costs just £2 and the map a further £2.

John, is it necessary to have all this stuff even if the UK citizen owns the house?

Quite possibly not! What I mean is that it might well be able to convince the ECO dealing with the visa application that the accommodation test is passed even without providing all of that. However, why take the chance?

Is it acceptable if we write the description of the house, rooms etc ourselves?

It is possible to get a report from your Local Authority. That costs money and takes time. But I think you can self-write this, especially if your comments are supported by photos.

But there is another possibility. When the place was bought the developer (if new) or the estate agent (if not new) probably supplied a sheet detailing the measurements of the various rooms. When my wife applied for her visa I supplied the Estate Agent's sheet showing all the room measurements. In other words, an independent report of the size of the rooms.

Just a general comment about the evidence to be supplied with a visa application. At one extreme one could take the minimalistic approach .. supplying as little detail as you think you can get away this. At the other extreme it is possible to supply "War and Peace"! That is, so much detail that the ECO could not possibly read it all.

I think the best approach is to supply information to make it absolutely clear that all the tests have been passed .... whilst at the same time not supplying so much that it could not possibly be read.