Overseas Citizenship of India (OCI)

jaihind · Post by **jaihind** » Tue Mar 07, 2006 11:13 am

basis wrote: IMHO all the consulates, governments understand things if said clearly. india govt is confusing everyone including us and iself - by calling it 'dual citizenship' and putting a condition 'citizens of countries allowing dual citizenship'.

I've forwarded this to the Indian Consulate for clarification. Hope to get a reply soon and I'll post it on this site.

basis · Post by **basis** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 7:50 am

Finally common sense prevails at US Consulate -

http://mumbai.usconsulate.gov/entry_and ... ments.html

Dual Nationality
In 2003, India passed a bill that allows certain persons of Indian origin in sixteen countries (subsequently extended to almost all countries), including the United States, to apply for a form of dual citizenship known as “Overseas Citizenship of India” (OCI). On January 7, 2006, the Government of India issued the first OCI certificate and released the regulations governing applications for OCI status. Persons with OCI status may not vote in Indian elections, hold most government jobs, or purchase certain types of real estate. However, they are free from most visa and registration requirements and receive other rights. Interested parties may view information on Overseas Citizenship of India and how to apply for it at http://www.mha.nic.in/oci/oci-main.htm.

Any person who is considered to have dual nationality as a citizen of both India and the U.S. is subject to all Indian laws while in India. Moreover, a dual national also may be subject to other laws and regulations that impose special obligations on Indian citizens, such as taxation. In some instances such as arrest while in India, dual nationality may hamper U.S. Government efforts to provide assistance abroad. For more information on the official U.S. Government position on the issue of dual nationality, please visit http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_t ... _1753.html.

basis · Post by **basis** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 7:20 pm

And US consulate in Delhi (or New Delhi as they say) is perhaps clearer -

http://newdelhi.usembassy.gov/acsdualnation.html
http://newdelhi.usembassy.gov/acsindvisas.html

The Indian government recently launched a program called “Overseas Citizens of India” or “OCI”. This program often has been mischaracterized as “dual nationality” or “dual citizenship.” However, a person who holds an OCI Card in reality is granted an Indian visa, not Indian citizenship. Thus, an American citizen who obtains OCI status remains a citizen only of the United States. The OCI Card is a special visa which grants the holder the right to indefinitely visit, study or work in India, and also the right to own most types of property in India (excluding certain agricultural and plantation properties). A holder of an OCI card also need not register with local immigration authorities, unlike other holders of Indian visas. An OCI holder, however, does not receive an Indian passport, and has no other political rights in India, including the right to vote or eligibility for government employment.
An American citizen who wishes to obtain an OCI Card, may apply outside of India at the Indian Embassy in Washington, DC, or at an Indian consulate in New York, Chicago, San Francisco or Houston. An American citizen who resides in India can apply at the Foreigner’s Regional Registration Office (FRRO) in New Delhi (tel. 2671-1348). The FRRO also maintains offices in Mumbai, Chennai (known as the Chennai Immigration Office), Calcutta and Amritsar. For more information on the OCI program, please see http://www.mha.nic.in/oci/oci-main.htm.

basis · Post by **basis** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 7:36 pm

http://www.newkerala.com/news2.php?acti ... s&id=22720

Proposal to establish Overseas Centres in United States, Gulf, Malaysia
New Delhi, Mar 8 : Government is examining a proposal for establishing Overseas Centres, initially in the US, Malaysia and the Gulf, the Lok Sabha was informed today.

The proposal to establish the Centres is under examination in consultation with the Ministries of External Affairs and Finance, Overseas Affairs Minister Vayalar Ravi said in a written reply.

Three centres are proposed to be opened initially -- one each in the US, Malaysia and the Gulf, he said.

They are expected to be established at the earliest, he said adding these centres will inter alia extend legal and medical counselling services.

Diaspora: The government is considering a proposal to establish the Diaspora Knowledge Network (DKN) that can utilise the knowledge resources of the Indian diaspora, Ravi said.

It will also facilitate interaction between the providers of knowledge and its users in India such as educational institutions, research laboratories, industry and government programmes, through the use of information and communication technologies, he said.

The DKN will be established after consultation with the relevant stakeholders like the UN, Diaspora Knowledge hubs, private sector partners and concerned state governments in India, Ravi said.

PIOs: At least 4278 Overseas Citizens of India (OCI) documents have been issued to Persons of Indian Origin (PIOs) mainly from the US, Australia and Canada, Ravi said, adding no OCI holds any post in India.

mhunjn · Post by **mhunjn** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:59 am

A clarification on the following point... OCI's can own agricultural land. However, it would have to be cleared with the local administration whether or not the said land is classified as 'not purchasable' for OCI's.

So, there is NO blanket restriction for purchasing agricultural land by OCI as hinted in the comments earlier.

And, from some enquiries, there are no restrictions for NRI's to acquire land in India.

Hope this helps!

basis wrote: An OCI can own land but not the agricultural land. Even an Indian citizen resident abroad cannot make fresh qcquisitions of agricultural land.

basis · Post by **basis** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 9:12 am

mhunjn wrote:A clarification on the following point... OCI's can own agricultural land. However, it would have to be cleared with the local administration whether or not the said land is classified as 'not purchasable' for OCI's.

So, there is NO blanket restriction for purchasing agricultural land by OCI as hinted in the comments earlier.

And, from some enquiries, there are no restrictions for NRI's to acquire land in India.

mhunjn - Where did you get this info from ? MHA site clearly says NRIs and OCIs cannot buy agricultural land. They can continue to hold any land which they acquired while resident. And only way I can see OCIs being allowed to buy agri land is perhaps when they are resident in India (i remember reading somewhere about it).

If you have definitive sources substantiating what you have said above let us know.

mhunjn · Post by **mhunjn** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 9:22 am

I checked up with the following...
Commissioner
Tehsildar
NRI Sabha

If anybody knows the details about this... it's bound to be them, as they are the local law enforcers for this matter... especially when it comes to buying agricultural land in particular.

I must add however, that this was an unoffical enquiry... before anyone starts asking for contact details

Also, from your own post earlier, ...

(excluding certain agricultural and plantation properties).

basis · Post by **basis** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:29 pm

What's NRI Sabha ?

I am really scared off these unofficial enquiries and responses. Very easy to say anything - no one is answerable for what has been said. but would you put your money in buying a plot of agricultural land based on this type of info.

How could the locals be the best knowledgeable on the laws passed by National Parliament and most pundits among the world are struggling to interprete. I can understand they can tell about the local / state level laws because sometimes these rules are restrictive than the national laws. But they cant allow what has been disallowed by National legislation.

mhunjn · Post by **mhunjn** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:56 pm

Please read my above/earlier post carefully...then decide and comment!

... my note above was to help and I'll leave it to people to check on their own with the relevant authority.

As previously said... they don't mention ALL types of agricultural property, but only 'certain'...

And US consulate in Delhi (or New Delhi as they say) is perhaps clearer -

http://newdelhi.usembassy.gov/acsdualnation.html
http://newdelhi.usembassy.gov/acsindvisas.html

The OCI Card is a special visa which grants the holder the right to indefinitely visit, study or work in India, and also the right to own most types of property in India (excluding certain agricultural and plantation properties).[/u]

Also... the 'locals' mentioned here are the employees of the civil service...the very people who enforce the law in that area... they are the authority who sign at the bottom of every legal document an Indian citizen living in India possesses... so in my opinion they would know the law better than you.

basis · Post by **basis** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:42 pm

Look at http://mha.nic.in/oci-chart.pdf a very clear and recent document by Ministry of Home Affairs. It says -

PIOs and OCIs are allowed - (iii) Parity with Non resident Indians (NRIs) in respect of economic, financial and educational fields except in elation to acquisition of agricultural or plantation properties. No parity shall be allowed in the sphere of political rights.

The word certain is not there. I would think MHA would know our laws better than US Delhi Consulate. I had posted that more from point that now rest of the world also recgnises that OCI is not dual citizenship.

mhunjn · Post by **mhunjn** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:59 pm

Still can't find 'cannot buy agricultural land' mentioned in there.

[quote]PIOs and OCIs are allowed - (iii) Parity with Non resident Indians (NRIs) in respect of economic, financial and educational fields except in elation to acquisition of agricultural or plantation properties.
quote]

Agreed that it says Non Parity... is there any more detail available for it?... or are you just assuming that it means 'cannot buy agricultural property' from it?...

The point I have been trying to make is that on query the local administration replied that NRI's and OCI's can buy and keep agricultural property and they haven't received any information to say the contrary.

I fail to understand how people like the Commissioner/Tehsildar of the district wouldn't spot such an important clause and keep on registring property for Indian's abroad............................. unless there is none!

Not that difficult, is it?...

Again...as before, I would leave this with the people do make their own checks and decisions... but would suggest to not to assume that agriculture land is a no-go area for OCI's.

We can discuss this to death... but I really can't see any point of doing it!...

basis · Post by **basis** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 2:23 pm

OK. If you need further readings then look at -

http://www.indiainfoline.com/lega/nri/ch10.html

Clearly says other than agri land ...what else does one need ? In India at local levels people are so ignorant and reckless. the general attitude is everything goes. Many times they do it on purpose and can easily put on you that you did not tell about being NRI. e.g. As per an estimate more than 90% NRIs continue to hold resident accounts in form or the other (which is not allowed), people make investments in PPF / NSC while being NRI again strictly prohibited by law. Now if you go to a bank / post office and produce a Indian address they dont even bother to check whether you are an NRI or not. the whole attitude is 'everything goes'.

Now in case of immovable properties generally the investments involve large sums of money. It is covered by FEMA which is a stricter law than many others. Anyways in every matter a person can and should discuss / consult further than relying on an MB. But as responsible members we can share things which can be substantiated as much possible.

With this I rest my case mylord.

jaihind · Post by **jaihind** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 7:55 pm

Any forum available to impress upon the GOI about how obsolete certain restrictions such as Mountaineering; Missionary or Research activities are for OCI holders. Most OCI holders have been former citizens anyway and now to have such restrictions imposed upon them, I consider them superfluous.
The remit of none of the above mentioned activities are clearly defined in law and hence to impose such restrictions on OCIs is frankly laughable.

rogerroger · Post by **rogerroger** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:30 pm

hey i was wondering if one needs to let the indian high commision know immediately of one's acquiring british nationality.

if i tell them about it a month after my acquiring naturalisdation, is that a problem?

lemess · Post by **lemess** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 7:25 am

You don't have to ever tell them formally if you don't want to bother. As long as you don't use your old Indian passport there is no issue.

Technically you are meant to return your Indian passport for cancellation but there is no specified time limit for that. You can do that if and when you apply for PIO or OCI status.

anonymous10 · Post by **anonymous10** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 9:43 am

It appears that HCI London do not keep track of cancelled passports. AFAIK they just cut off the edges and stamp "cancelled" on the passport and hand it back to you. So it should not really matter if you do that yourself.

rogerroger · Post by **rogerroger** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 9:59 am

thanks for the info people

dabar · Post by **dabar** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:30 pm

Hi Guys,
Just to keep you updated on the progress of my OCI application, I still haven't received any communication from HCI, London.

But my gut feeling tells me that the time, when I would hear from HCI, London, is approaching closer.

I will inform you when that happens.

rogerroger · Post by **rogerroger** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:38 pm

can we have a timeline for oci thread similar to the time for naturalisation thread?

basis · Post by **basis** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 7:52 am

dabar wrote:Hi Guys,
Just to keep you updated on the progress of my OCI application, I still haven't received any communication from HCI, London.

But my gut feeling tells me that the time, when I would hear from HCI, London, is approaching closer.

I will inform you when that happens.

Dabar - Have you called / mailed them. The experience from other boards show that followups help. Anyway you are not in a hurry so may prefer to wait.

dabar · Post by **dabar** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 9:08 am

As instructed by the HCI, I will have to wait for 12 weeks before contacting them. And that's what I have decided to do.

I am also in touch with a couple of persons who applied at the same time as me and whose OCI status changed to Granted on the same date as mine. And none of us have heard anything from HCI yet.
So I am waiting patiently.

Patience is the key thing when dealing with these govt departments.

rogerroger · Post by **rogerroger** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 9:14 am

your status has nto changed to granted as yet?

is the status granted by the home office in india? or by the HCI?

can one apply for a visit visa to india in the meantime?

basis · Post by **basis** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:06 am

Dabar - Agreed if you are in no hurry then no need to call them up.

However, from experience of most people around the globe incl UK enquiring with the Indian missions sooner has found to be working and helpful. Choice is yours.

Rogerroger - you can take visiting visa if you need to travel asap. If it can wait for three weeks or so then go for PIO - you can convert PIO to OCI later at your convenience. If it can wait for more than 3 months (on a safer side considering experiences I know of so far - the process has lot more streamlined in last four weeks than earlier and people have got OCI cards / visas worldwide within 7-8 weeks of applying).

If you wish to continue to stay out of India for most of the time then PIO or OCI - frankly no difference. But if you wish to R2I (return to India) then OCI is better - no registration related formalities.

jaihind · Post by **jaihind** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 9:23 pm

Darbar - What you need to do is watch and see when your OCI is granted on the OCI website. Once it is granted, it takes roughly a month for it to be sent from India to the local consulate. All stickers are produced there along with the registration booklet. Once the consulate receives the sticker + booklet, it will contact you and arrange to have your passport sent to them for affixing he sticker. You may have to go in person to receive it ...

This is how I got my OCI visa.

The whole business should take about 50 days from the date of filing your application.

dabar · Post by **dabar** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:15 pm

Jaihind,
Thanks for the info.
That makes sense.

And Congratulations for getting the OCI.

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