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New 5 Year ILR Rule

Archived UK Tier 1 (General) points system forum. This route no longer exists.

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kumar78
Junior Member
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 11:16 am

New 5 Year ILR Rule

Post by kumar78 » Mon Apr 10, 2006 5:37 pm

Hi Guys,

Can any one tell me what is the new rule of HSMP candidates going for ILR in future. I have already got 3 year extension after spending 1 year.

According to new rules HSMP candidates will get 2 year + 3 year visa leading to ILR.
Old rule was 1 year + 3 Year for ILR.

Can any one tell does this new rule effect the old immigrants alraedy consuming 3 year time? will they have to wait for another year ( fifth one) before applying for ILR now ?

Markie
Senior Member
Posts: 681
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:17 am
Location: Surrey

Re: New 5 Year ILR Rule

Post by Markie » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:20 pm

kumar78 wrote:Hi Guys,

Can any one tell me what is the new rule of HSMP candidates going for ILR in future. I have already got 3 year extension after spending 1 year.

According to new rules HSMP candidates will get 2 year + 3 year visa leading to ILR.
Old rule was 1 year + 3 Year for ILR.

Can any one tell does this new rule effect the old immigrants alraedy consuming 3 year time? will they have to wait for another year ( fifth one) before applying for ILR now ?
What I heard from HO - they are still in the process of finalising their decision for those individuals approved using the old scheme. The new scheme will apply immediately for those applying/will be approved after 03-April.

IMHO, there would be a transition period wherein the HO will grant ILR to the old entrants using the old rule.

Would appreciate feedback from the moderators on this matter.

jaas
Junior Member
Posts: 55
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:30 pm

Post by jaas » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:22 pm

I think it is clear ..... It was 4 years for ILR before 3rd April and 5 years now after 3rd April....!!!!

Markie
Senior Member
Posts: 681
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:17 am
Location: Surrey

Post by Markie » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:28 pm

jaas wrote:I think it is clear ..... It was 4 years for ILR before 3rd April and 5 years now after 3rd April....!!!!
yep, this is clear for those applying and will be approved fter 03-April. however, for the previous HMPS approved individuals under the old rule, it is not the case.

The old rule was: 1 yrs + 3 yrs extension summing up to 4yrs

the new rule is: 2 yrs + 3yrs extension summing up to 5yrs.

In the case for individuals with an upcoming application for FLR, even thuogh the HO will grant 3yrs extensionm the total yrs of stay in the Uk is short by a year if we base it on the new rule. Do anyone wish to be granted another 1 year extwnsion after having been granted 3-yr FLR before? do not believe so...

sunny158
Junior Member
Posts: 88
Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 5:52 pm

Post by sunny158 » Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:24 pm

It affects everybody who did not apply ILR before 3rd April, now all of us have to hold HSMP for 5 years to get ILR. Now HO issues 4 years hsmp extension. I know your guys dont wanna believe it, but it is this case.

olisun
Diamond Member
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 2:01 am

Post by olisun » Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:33 am

Point to be noted, it's 5 yrs from the date you ENTERED the UK and NOT 5yrs from the date the visa was issued

kumar78
Junior Member
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 11:16 am

Post by kumar78 » Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:06 pm

Yes, every one is effected by 5 year rule, I had posted the below email and got the reply from the Home office,

Dear Work Permits,

I have heard that a new 5 year Rule is taking place to get the ILR for HSMP and WP candidates. This is new 2 year initial leave and a subsequent leave for 3 year. I am living in UK under HSMP category. Before I had actually applied, I remember the rule at the time of my application were 4 years for ILR. In other words, in old rules it was 1 year initial leave and a subsequent leave for 3 year. I am living in UK and at the moment consuming the 3 year further leave, will I have to get another 1 year leave after consuming this 3 year extension? or if the new rule is only for new applicants for HSMP application?

Regards

Kumar



Dear Kumar,

Thankyou for your email.

You are correct; in order to obtain Indefinite Leave to Remain you will need
to apply for another extension at the end of your current three-year visa.
You can do this in the same way as your previous extensions, using the FLR
(IED) form.

I hope this helps

Daniel Stanley
Customer Services Advisor

Customer Contact Centre
Work Permits UK
Managed Migration
Home Office
PO Box 3468
Sheffield
S3 8WA

Tel: 0114 207 4074
Fax: 0114 207 4000


kumar78
Junior Member
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 11:16 am

Post by kumar78 » Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:13 pm

what is the total period now any person can go outside with new 5 year rule.

I know earlier with old 4 years rule, it was 6 months total duration and maximum 3 month exit in a single go.

If the 6 months total duratio is same then it will be absurd.

Dr-Java
Newbie
Posts: 31
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 11:17 am

Old Immigrants also have to wait for another 5 years

Post by Dr-Java » Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:43 pm

-----Original Message-----
From: WPCustomers [mailto:wpcustomers@ind.homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk]
Sent: 13 April 2006 14:34
Subject: RE: Enquiry.

Dear

Thank you for your email.

You must now complete 5 years before you can apply for indefinite leave
to
remain. As such, you will have to apply for a 1 year extension to your
HSMP
visa in March 2008.

I hope this helps.

Kind regards,

Matt Jones

Customer Service Advisor


> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: 13 April 2006 08:38
> To: wpcustomers@ind.homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk
> Subject: Enquiry.
>
> HI,
>
>
>
> I came to the UK as a Highly Skilled Migrant in March 2004 and in
March
> 2005 I got further leave to remain for 3 years now in March 2008 I
will
> complete 4 years in the UK please advise me will I eligible to apply
for
> indefinite stay in March 2008 or I will have to wait for 1 year more.
>
>
>
> As now there is a new rule for indefinite stay to complete 5 years
before
> applying indefinite stay.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>

shoque
Newly Registered
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:31 am
Location: MK

Re: New 5 Year ILR Rule

Post by shoque » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:37 am

We would like to see recent examples of this new rule, (1+3+1) = 5 yrs. Please publish these examples (circulate the words) so that many of us as "existing HSMP" could raise our awareness and ACT TO REACT against this policy.

kumar78
Junior Member
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 11:16 am

Post by kumar78 » Wed Apr 19, 2006 2:03 pm

Totally absurd, as old HSMP candidates applied on the promise of 4 years period to ILR and now they have chnaged the rules to 5 years and included the old HSMP guys as well, rather then only putting the rule on new applicants..........

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:58 am

I sent an email to HO regarding 4 to 5 year rule change in ILR on 11th of April 2006.I got the following reply today.

Dear Sir

Current visa holders are not affected by the changes.

Regards


HSMP Team


I sent an email on

hsmp.workpermits@ind.homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk

shoque
Newly Registered
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:31 am
Location: MK

Post by shoque » Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:13 pm

aj77

what about the earlier HSMP reply sent to Kumar which says the "opposite answer".


aj77 wrote:I sent an email to HO regarding 4 to 5 year rule change in ILR on 11th of April 2006.I got the following reply today.

Dear Sir

Current visa holders are not affected by the changes.

Regards


HSMP Team


I sent an email on

hsmp.workpermits@ind.homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:21 pm

I don't have any trust on their replies anymore.

Earliar in the month of March some guys also got same sort of reply from HSMP team but later one of us got the following interpretation of these words from Customer Service Advisor of Work Permits:
Sent : 31 March 2006 16:47:07
Subject : RE: ILR confusion

| | | Inbox


Dear XXX,

Thank you for your email.

The e-mail from the HSMP team says that 'current visa holders will not be
affected'.

This means that if an individual has already been granted the first year
visa,( which up to now has been the rule for HSMP), they will still apply
for the 3 year extension, as before, but then a further year will be needed
because, after 3rd April 2006, all Overseas Nationals, whether they hold a
Work Permit or a Highly Skilled Migrants Visa, will need to show evidence
that they have ALREADY worked in the UK for FIVE YEARS.

I hope this clarifies the situation.

Regards,

Sarah Oxley
Customer Services Advisor

Customer Contact Centre
Work Permits (UK)
Home Office
PO Box 3468
Sheffield
S3 8WA

olisun
Diamond Member
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 2:01 am

Post by olisun » Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:48 pm

will need to show evidence that they have ALREADY worked in the UK for FIVE YEARS. <== this doesn't sound nice...

wonder what HO will start looking at incase you guys take legal action against them

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:52 pm

I found the details of my MP from the following link:

http://www.locata.co.uk/commons

I sent the following email to my MP

Constituency...........
Nameof MP...........
Party.................

Subject: Objection about retrospective implementation of 4-5 year rule change in immigration policy

Respected Sir,

As you would be aware that Parliament has passed the changes in Immigration rules(HC 1016)on 30/03/06.According to this all immigrants related to work related catagories i.e HSMP/Work permit holders etc can apply for ILR after 5 years now instead of 4 years.The implementation on this policy has been started from 03/04/06 retrospectively.

I don t have any objection on this policy as it might be in best interest of UK, my only objection is about it's retrospective implementation.

As we were told when we chose to enter this country that we would be qualified for ILR after 4 yrs if we satisfied all the criteria set forth. The retrospective implementation of this proposed change has a number of negative effects on the practical life of people who entered under the old rules and have faithfully satisfied the stringent rules for approval of Further Leave to Remain (ability to get mortgages on residential property, children's ability to study at UK universities, etc.), but the principle involved goes far beyond the practical problems.

We are neither refugees nor asylum seekers, but Highly Skilled people who felt we were entering into a contract by choosing to come here under the stated conditions at the time we applied. We are shocked and dismayed that, having kept our part of the bargain, we see the more powerful party changing the rules of the game. We understand the wish to change the rules to make you more in line with European norms, and to create a more coherent long-term immigration policy; but any such changes should in fairness only apply to new applicants, people who choose to migrate to the UK knowing what the (new) rules are. Retrospective changing of the rules is unfair, in civil contracts illegal, and to our minds not in keeping with what we imagined was the British sense of fair play.

As legal skilled immigrants in the UK, we came here because we like this country and its people. Once here, we become ambassadors for the UK in our countries of origin. We work hard and want to integrate into society, but this sudden retrospective change, without anything like proper consultation, makes us have doubts about the wisdom of our choice. We are convinced that other persons having the sort of skills that the Government itself says the country needs, and especially the most qualified amongst them (who definitely have a choice as to where to go), will think twice about signing on to a programme where the rules can be changed without notice, retrospectivelyy and without appeal. To alienate us may be an acceptable side effect to a desirable policy change; to alienate thousands of potential high-quality migrants bringing badly needed entrepreneurial and other skills would seem to be bad policy indeed.

For your convenience and to remind you Government assured us in old policy of HSMP that future changes wont affect us.Here are some extracts of old HSMP policy under which I applied and got HSMP visa.

24.9 Q: What if the scheme changes?

A: As with any immigration scheme we reserve the right to adapt some of the criteria or documentation associated
with the scheme and will inform you via our websites of any such changes. All applications will be treated on the
basis of the HSMP provisions at the time that they were submitted.

24.10 Q: I have already applied successfully under HSMP. How does the revised HSMP affect me?

A: Not at all. It is important to note that once you have entered under the programme you are in a category that has
an avenue to settlement. Those who have already entered under HSMP will be allowed to stay and apply for
settlement after four years qualifying residence regardless of these revisions to HSMP



26.5 Q: How long can I stay in the UK if I enter as a skilled migrant?

A: You will initially be given 12 months stay. If you want to remain in the UK under the HSMP, you should apply for
an extension of your stay in the last month before the expiry of your permission to stay in the UK. For further
information, please see “Extension of stay in the United Kingdom” section. You will be able to amalgamate leave
in other categories that lead to settlement for example, please see “Extension of stay in the United Kingdom
section.” towards the end of that period you can apply to remain in the same capacity for a further period of up
to three years.
After four years in the UK as a highly skilled migrant you can apply for settlement. The main criteria for
settlement will be that you have spent a continuous period of four years in the UK (except for trips abroad of
three months or less, totalling less than six months in the four year period) in a category leading to settlement
and that you continue to be economically active in the UK as a highly skilled migrant
.

I hope you would agree with my concerns about retrospective implementation of these changes and will discuss this issue with your fellow Parliamentarians and immigration Minister and will try to convince them about side effects of retrospective implementation so that changes should be implemented to those who know at the time of entering in the UK about these changes.

I look forward for your reply.Thank you

Regards

Anybody who want to send email to his MP can find the details from above link and can make necessary changes in the above letter.

It will take maximum 10 minutes to send an email to your MP.If we could send this sort of email to every MP,it might make some impact on them.Atleast everybody should have a try

baskey
Member
Posts: 245
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 1:01 am
Location: Milton Keyens

Post by baskey » Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:58 pm

Hi Aj,

Nice job. I have already copied and sent an email to my MP. IF more people try this, it may be effective i believe.

Regards,

Baskey

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 5:10 pm

Thank You Baskey

Kindly inform all other friends too who are unaware of this change and ask them to send this letter to their MPs .Keep this in mind that less than 3 weeks left and if No parliamentarian made any objection it will become law

sunny158
Junior Member
Posts: 88
Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 5:52 pm

Post by sunny158 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 5:44 pm

ok, i will drop my local mp this lettle, cus her office and my flat are in the same house.

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:17 pm

Hello guys,we have got an encouraging reply from Nick Clegg, shadow home secretary of libdems
hey, just got a reply from Nick Clegg, shadow home secretary of libdems:

Thank you for contacting me regarding the changes to immigration rules
(House of Commons Paper 974, replaced by HC1016) including changes to
the qualifying period for Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR).

I am concerned that this situation is unfair to those already in this
country who have made plans on the reasonable assumption that the
qualifying period would not change, and unnecessarily prejudices those
skilled immigrants who contribute significantly to this country and its
economy. We feel that the Home Office has not given sufficient notice
of these changes and that if they were justified; they should apply only
to those entering the country now, and not retrospectively.


To this end we have laid a motion against these changes which we hope to
debate in committee before the deadline as stipulated by parliamentary
procedure (we anticipate this will be in the next month).


I will write to you again when the outcome of the committee is known.


Thank you for raising this vital issue with me.


Yours sincerely
Sent on behalf of Nick Clegg MP
If everybodody could get in touch with his MP by email or letter,we still have the hope that they wont implement these changes retrospectively.
Keep continueing the good work guys.

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:25 pm

conservatives will also be opposing retrospective element of these changes.

Hello Friends,

I had already informed that shadow home secretary of conservatives Mr Damian Green MP, had agreed that the retrospective nature of these changes is unjust and conservatives will be opposing this element of the changes.

Now, shadow home secretary of Liberals Mr Nick Clegg MP, sent me a message saying in short that they find it unjust too, and they will act accordingly in parliament in order to change this

kumar78
Junior Member
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 11:16 am

Post by kumar78 » Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:00 pm

Thanks guys to keep this thread active,
I think it is in best of all HSMP guys living in UK to persude this case. We were promised to get ILR if we continue to spend 4 years .....
If Home office can change it to 5 years for the people those already have HSMP obtained then there is not gurantee simlar thing can happen in future .... this can be 6 years in future or more.

I will be posting same question to MP very soon.

olisun
Diamond Member
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 2:01 am

Post by olisun » Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:06 pm

kumar78 wrote:We were promised to get ILR if we continue to spend 4 years .....
you may want to rephrase it.. :)
kumar78 wrote: If Home office can change it to 5 years for the people those already have HSMP obtained then there is not gurantee simlar thing can happen in future .... this can be 6 years in future or more.
The HO has never said you will NOT get ILR after 5 years and at the end of the day it's their country and they can do whatever they want....

aj77
Member
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:37 pm
Contact:

Post by aj77 » Sat Apr 22, 2006 12:43 pm

olisun wrote:
at the end of the day it's their country and they can do whatever they want....
Yeah you are absolutely right.I also realised it after observing these statement

Now just observe the statements given by different persons and Departments after these changes

1) Now after these changes minister said in a meeting with Christine Lee on 14th March 2006 that there is no need to consult on this change of rules. In other words legal requirements not necessarily need to be fulfilled.The Government has decided on this and it will be brought in

2) Home secretary said about his past official letter (sent to RobinLondon in Feb 2005) stating that current Visa holders wont be affected by the changes that that was a standard reply.It's not a big deal.In other words whatever they have said in the past could be standard reply and can be denied at any time.

3) He further stated in the letter retrospective effects are not significant either.In other words he is accepting it to be retrospective.

4) His under secretary says in a letter to Sowhat that It is not retrospective law by any means.

5) HSMP sent the reply of my email on 18th April 2006 , after detailed consideration that these changes wont affect the current Visa Holders

6) Customer Service Advisor of Work permits says that this statement means that they will need to show evidence that they have ALREADY worked in the UK for FIVE YEARS
At the end of the day,it is their country and they can do whatever they want............
Now question is, Creating this sort of image in the minds of immigrants will worth or will cost them more?

olisun
Diamond Member
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 2:01 am

Post by olisun » Sat Apr 22, 2006 8:29 pm

Now question is, Creating this sort of image in the minds of immigrants will worth or will cost them more?
It doesn't / won't make any difference to them... there are many people in this world who are ready to work at low wages and are not bothered about ILR or BC

and regarding the contradicting statements, they are all politicians and you should expect this from them.... :-)

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