nationality application : criminal convictions/referees

[sywahu]

Hi,

The guide says that no details are required for fixed penalty notices. but should I still check the no box in answer to the question? Or is it that we check yes (since I have several fixed penalty notices) but then not provide any details etc?

Also, can I use my boss as one of the referees? The forms says "must have known you personally (rather than just professionally)..". So it looks like they will not accept such a reference?


Thanks

Sy.

[ppron747]

I think the point is that fixed penalty notices aren't convictions - AIUI, you pay the penalty in order to avoid being convicted in court. So I wouldn't mention them at all.

Bosses aren't explicitly listed as being unacceptable as referees, so I guess the answer is going to depend on whether you see him socially outside work. If so, then I see no problem. But I wouldn't use him if you're not that friendly - remember he may have to answer questions about you, if they decide to interview him...

[sywahu]

hmm. thanks.

i guess i will use the NCS for the application and will leave "convictions" section blank for them. Just to be sure.

Regarding the reference, my boss has known for many years but I am not sure what qualifies as "must have known personally as well". I am thinking that he doesn't know my children's names so can't use him. Maybe its not relevant.

Just checking whether someone else on the board was able to use such a reference.

[Dawie]

Well, you'll probably have to stretch the truth a bit as far as references go. That's what I intend to do when I apply for BC in a few months time.

I'm in the ridiculous situation myself where I do not know any BC who can act as a reference for me because I have not known them for the required length of time. People who I do know for the required length of time are all non-BCs. So what I will probably have to do is ask the BC's who have known me for a short-time to lie on my behalf. Sad but true.

Believe it or not, in today's multicultural London it's actually possible to spend 4 and a half years in London and not know any BC well enough to act as a reference. So wing it.

[ppron747]

I don't want to be too controversial here, but there is an alternative. You could wait until you and your referees are in a position to tell the truth....

[sywahu]

Paul - thats a noble thought but.....I will pass

by my reckning I should be able to use the reference I am after. but to be honest I have my doubts about this vague "must have known personally" statement. Can understand the logic behind it but they could have made it a bit simpler.

The last thing one would want is to get held up because "the reference did not know you personally, only in a professional capacity....". That would be very upsetting to say the least.

[olisun]

use your GP if you have been registered with him for more than 3 yrs... he will charge you about £15 for signing the document

[bbdivo]

use your GP if you have been registered with him for more than 3 yrs... he will charge you about £15 for signing the document

My goodness £15!!! They are already earning on average £100k per year!!! They should do it for free!

[sywahu]

Olisun,

Yes I have for 6 years. Thats a good idea but don't we then run into the same kind of a problem? My GP wouldn't even know my middle name for example, or what I do, my age etc without resorting to the database. So he only knows me in a doctor-patient capacity, not "personally".

If thats acceptable, using one's boss should certainly be ok since he at least has spent more time "knowing me" than just treating me 5-6 times year.

But I wouldn't mind handing out £15 if that means having peace of mind that there is not going to be any silly problems later on.

Did you use your GP for your application (if you applied for BN that is)?

[olisun]

the GP is only bothered about the money...

check my reply in the following post

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ght=#39703

[ppron747]

the GP is only bothered about the money...

check my reply in the following post

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ght=#39703

I don't know how well you know your GP, olisun, but it may be that you were lucky...

On a passport applicatio the countersignatory is only attesting to your identity - nothing else. If UKPS decide to follow it up, the questions asked are likely to be restricted to "Did you really sign this form?" "How long have you known this person?" "How do you know it's him?" etc.
On a naturalisation application, he is saying that he knows you well enough to know that you are of good character, and a suitable candidate for naturalisation. Any follow-up is likely to ask questions of a more searching nature, about the character and behaviour of the applicant. My GP knows me well enough to sign my passport application, but he has no idea what I get up to in the evenings and at weekends. He knows nothing about my private life. He would not be able to give a "good interview" about me to anyone taking up a reference, because we only know one another professionally.
I really don't think I'm alone in this. Most people's lives aren't like The Archers, and most people's GPs are not suitable as character references....

[Dawie]

On a passport applicatio the countersignatory is only attesting to your identity - nothing else. If UKPS decide to follow it up, the questions asked are likely to be restricted to "Did you really sign this form?" "How long have you known this person?" "How do you know it's him?" etc.

Does anyone know why they require a countersignatory for your photograph when they already have your home country's passport as proof of identity?

[ppron747]

On a passport applicatio the countersignatory is only attesting to your identity - nothing else. If UKPS decide to follow it up, the questions asked are likely to be restricted to "Did you really sign this form?" "How long have you known this person?" "How do you know it's him?" etc.

Does anyone know why they require a countersignatory for your photograph when they already have your home country's passport as proof of identity?

- Not everyone has a home country apart from the UK
- They want recent confirmation of the individual's identity, which another country's passport (or any other ID document) might not offer
- They want someone who can be held accountable in the UK in case of fraudulent applications
I'm sure there are some more...

[olisun]

do you think the HO is going to call up the GP and ask him about you?

and where does it say on the form that the refree has to know the candidate's private life...

rest I leave it to you to decide....

the GP is only bothered about the money...

check my reply in the following post

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ght=#39703

I don't know how well you know your GP, olisun, but it may be that you were lucky...

On a passport applicatio the countersignatory is only attesting to your identity - nothing else. If UKPS decide to follow it up, the questions asked are likely to be restricted to "Did you really sign this form?" "How long have you known this person?" "How do you know it's him?" etc.
On a naturalisation application, he is saying that he knows you well enough to know that you are of good character, and a suitable candidate for naturalisation. Any follow-up is likely to ask questions of a more searching nature, about the character and behaviour of the applicant. My GP knows me well enough to sign my passport application, but he has no idea what I get up to in the evenings and at weekends. He knows nothing about my private life. He would not be able to give a "good interview" about me to anyone taking up a reference, because we only know one another professionally.
I really don't think I'm alone in this. Most people's lives aren't like The Archers, and most people's GPs are not suitable as character references....

[ppron747]

do you think the HO is going to call up the GP and ask him about you?

rest I leave it to you to decide....

That is why they ask for referees, olisun - so they can do precisely that - or interview them in person. I have been inteviewed in person, so I know it happens, although I don't know how often....

[Chess]

By the way starting October 2006 - All passport applicants including indegenous Brits will have to attend an interview..

..I wonder what sort of questions they will be asking babies?

[olisun]

and where does it say on the form that the refree has to know the candidate's private life...

you missed this line and also

I don't know how well you know your GP, olisun, but it may be that you were lucky...

nope, the GP hardly knows me... lol

My GP knows me well enough to sign my passport application, but he has no idea what I get up to in the evenings and at weekends. He knows nothing about my private life. He would not be able to give a "good interview" about me to anyone taking up a reference, because we only know one another professionally.

Once again do you think the HO will ask the "GP" to attend an interview

[ppron747]

and where does it say on the form that the refree has to know the candidate's private life...

you missed this line and also

I don't know how well you know your GP, olisun, but it may be that you were lucky...

nope, the GP hardly knows me... lol

My GP knows me well enough to sign my passport application, but he has no idea what I get up to in the evenings and at weekends. He knows nothing about my private life. He would not be able to give a "good interview" about me to anyone taking up a reference, because we only know one another professionally.

Once again do you think the HO will ask the "GP" to attend an interview

I don't have a copy handy, but AFAICR the referee needs to know the candidate in a personal capacity - not just professional. If substituting "personal" for "private" in my earlier post makes you happy, please feel free...
As to whether people are interviewed, the answer is yes... As to how likely it is, the answer is "don't know.

[ppron747]

By the way starting October 2006 - All passport applicants including indegenous Brits will have to attend an interview..

..I wonder what sort of questions they will be asking babies?

As I understand it ABI will apply to all first-time, adult applicants for British passports in the UK - not to children, and not to all applicants.

[JAJ]

By the way starting October 2006 - All passport applicants including indegenous Brits will have to attend an interview..

..I wonder what sort of questions they will be asking babies?

As I understand it, interviews will be used for first time adult passport applications only.

[bbdivo]

do you think the HO is going to call up the GP and ask him about you?

Possibly, its not unheard of, some people on this board have said there referee's had been contacted recently.