What tha????

[hopefloats]

Hi there.

I am so upset and angry. I would really appreciate any advice on this.

We applied for a settlement visa for our mother who will be 80 years old in February. It was turned down. We had the appeal hearing two and a half weeks ago and have just received the letter to say it's been rejected because they don't believe our brother can't support our mother there. I am planning on writing to our MP as I don't know what else to do.

Below are the points I plan to include in the letter. If anyone else has any advice, I'd really really appreciate it. I am just so furious and upset. What do they want?

________________________________________________

* Our mother will be 80 years old on the 13th of February 2011.

* For the last 8 months she has been living in extremely difficult conditions, with our brother and his partner in a cramped one-bedroom flat, sleeping on the sofa, waiting for a visa so that she can come to the UK, where my sister owns 3 houses and 10 flats – one of which she has set aside for our mother.

* Despite the fact we have provided all evidence possible to prove that our brother is in dire financial straits and cannot even support himself (evidence we submitted includes an affidavit from a solicitor as well as bank statements, summonses, court orders etc.), the Home Office has decided to reject our appeal regarding the application for a Settlement Visa for our mother – based on the fact that they don’t believe our brother cannot support her. What exactly do they want? They have not stated what it is they want.

We have provided evidence. They say that because our mother is living with our brother this means he can support her. She is sleeping on the sofa in their tiny one-bedroom flat so as not to be literally on the street. At 80 years old in Johannesburg she would be dead before the application for a visa was submitted if she was living on the street! Sleeping on their sofa was supposed to be a temporary situation while she waited for the settlement visa. It is not possible for her to spend the rest of her life sleeping on their sofa!

So does our brother have to literally and physically throw our mother out onto the street in order for her to be granted a visa??

* Our brother and his partner are unable to support themselves, never mind anyone else.

* My sister owns 3 houses and 10 flats in Gloucester from which she makes a good income, she also has no dependants.

* The home office have ignored our concerns for our mother living in one of the highest crime areas in the world unnecessarily since she has a daughter here in the UK who is perfectly capable and more than willing to support her. As my sister mentioned in her statement for the appeal, our mother has been mugged and had a bullet through her roof and window in the past.

* While we have been waiting for this decision, a few days ago our mother went through yet another traumatic experience. An attempt to steal her car from outside the Official Vehicle Licensing Office (out in the middle of nowhere) resulted in her car being damaged, and her suffering terrible shock as she was on her own. She had to wait for the AA, on her own, and phoned us here in the UK when she got home, in tears because the towing cost R1400 (about £140) which we then sent to her, along with an extra £200 to get the car fixed) I am furious that she had to go through this kind of experience again, at her age, when it is completely avoidable. There is NO valid reason she can’t be safe and live out the rest of her days in peace, safety and security with her daughters here in Gloucester!

* We have provided all the evidence asked for, and yet, it seems the Home Office are determined to force us to allow our mother to continue to live in fear and stress and discomfort, endangering her health and safety, when this is completely avoidable!
___________________________________________

Thanks in advance for any advice.

[mtuckersa]

why doesnt your sister send money to SA so that she can live in a better place. I am sure the UK pound goes a long way in SA more so than it does in the UK

[goldfish]

Some background might be helpful too: Why can't your brother support himself (eg, who pays the rent on the apartment)? Where was your mother living before moving in with your brother?

If the application was rejected first time around and on appeal, a lawyer might be your best option.

[hopefloats]

Hi Mtuckersa

Thanks v much for taking the time to answer - I really appreciate it.

We had considered this in the first place, but Johannesburg is a very dangerous place and none of us want our mum living on her own - especially at her age. We know too many people who have been not only mugged, robbed and car-jacked (including my brother - with a gun in his mouth!), but also some who have been shot in their homes. As I mention in the points above, our mother has been mugged (at knife point), and when she was living on her own, had a bullet through her roof one night, and one through her window on another occasion.

A few months ago a friend of ours was upstairs in his study on the computer, and turned round to find three guys had walked into the room behind him (bearing in mind this is despite security, burglar bars etc), he was pistol whipped and tied up and of course the house was robbed(he was very lucky he wasn't killed).

There are many incidents like this, and there is no way we could let our mother live on her own. We did mention this in our original appeal - that it's too dangerous for our mum to live on her own there.

Thanks for the reply anyway.

[hopefloats]

Hi Goldfish

Thanks for replying.
Our brother and his partner had a business which they'd been struggling with for about 7 years (my sister and I were unaware of the extent of their financial problems until March this year). They were living within walking distance of my mum, who was living in a one bedroom house on her own.

My brother and his partner were helping my mum financially and she was helping them with their business where she could (phone calls, post, admin, helping the staff with their English etc.).

When the business failed and they finally had to give up, my brother was in debt of around £40 000. They had to move out of the house they were renting as they couldn't afford the rent. My brother had to sell his car, and they managed to sub-let a one-bedroom flat from a friend - but it's about a 40 minute drive from where my mum was living.

This was when my sister and I found out the full details. My sister took over paying our mum's rent and expenses, sending money to her. But we realised how dangerous it was for her now miles away from anyone she knows and on her own.

So we all agreed the best option would be for her to move here where she can live in one of the flats my sister owns (ground floor, safe, walking distance to town and cinema etc. and round the corner from friends as well as close to my sister).

In the meantime, while waiting for the visa, we were worried about her being on her own, so she moved her things into storage and moved into the one-bedroom flat with my brother and his partner for what we thought would be a few weeks until the visa came through. She doesn't have a room, and is sleeping on the sofa, but at least it's safer than being on her own.

My brother is caring for his partner's father who has Altzheimers and is paid token payments by his partner's step-mum for this. His partner does piece work when she can and gets paid very little. From what I can understand they're behind on their rent, but I assume the friend who they're sub-letting from is able to help them by not evicting them. My sister sends money each month for our mum for food etc. but is hesitant to interfere in our brother and his partner's finances due to previous business disagreements.

Hopefully this should be clearer, but let me know if there are any other details that would help. I'll really do anything to get my mum safe and stress-free and happy.

Thanks so much again for taking the time to reply.

[hopefloats]

PS: We did use a lawyer for the appeal hearing. I haven't spoken to him yet since we received the letter today.

[neosumit]

Hi Mtuckersa

Thanks v much for taking the time to answer - I really appreciate it.

We had considered this in the first place, but Johannesburg is a very dangerous place and none of us want our mum living on her own - especially at her age. We know too many people who have been not only mugged, robbed and car-jacked (including my brother - with a gun in his mouth!), but also some who have been shot in their homes. As I mention in the points above, our mother has been mugged (at knife point), and when she was living on her own, had a bullet through her roof one night, and one through her window on another occasion.

A few months ago a friend of ours was upstairs in his study on the computer, and turned round to find three guys had walked into the room behind him (bearing in mind this is despite security, burglar bars etc), he was pistol whipped and tied up and of course the house was robbed(he was very lucky he wasn't killed).

There are many incidents like this, and there is no way we could let our mother live on her own. We did mention this in our original appeal - that it's too dangerous for our mum to live on her own there.

Thanks for the reply anyway.

A very genuine case I must say.
UKBA has to become generous to understand such
circumstances and be more considerate in its approach.

And very dangerous conditions I must admit. Some friends used to tell me about such activities in Johannesburg and now I think those are damn true.

[mk357]

PS: We did use a lawyer for the appeal hearing. I haven't spoken to him yet since we received the letter today.

I am not sure who applied for your mother settlement whether you or your sister? If its the sister that would be supporting her here then she should apply but she should also prove that she is unmarried because to my knowledge if she is married then her case would be very weak. Also you (I mean your sister) need to prove that financially your mother is dependant on her by sending her money to SA and keeping all the transaction records and your mother bank statements in SA (you hsould submit these with the case) and finally, you should prove that your mother has serious medical conditions and needs regular attention (letters from doctors / consultants would do) at this age. Without these its not possible that you would get settlemtn visa for her.

[goldfish]

I am sorry I do not have any more suggestions to make, but I hope everything goes okay for you, your Mum, and your family.

[NT1234]

This may be useful for some pple to have the background of this case...


http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... highlight=


as the operator neosumit says this case would require the sympathy of the UKBA and these people dont have much so its a tough one for you OP..

I think one OP actually gave you the outcome of this case even before you knew this...OP AVJones.....and though i have been through this i only realised at this stage that you had a very difficult one with no criteria applying to your mum......

Keep fighting, take it to the upper tribunal and pray for divien intervention.

good luck...

[NT1234]

OP mk357 you need to read the previous post but also the rules on elderly settlement visa....

the OP mum is not married and it not a widow and is over 65 yrs old and this is why her case is very difficult as she nothing in the immigration rules that qualify her mum as she is over 65...and over 65 required you to be a widow or married.....its a very sad one, and i am still amazed to know this is the case for unmarried parent...

[geriatrix]

Please don't make multiple posts on the same topic.

[hopefloats]

Hi Sushdmehta

Sorry - I thought it was better to do the new query in a new thread because the old thread was about the previous issue regarding this case.
Sorry

Thanks very much everyone for the supportive replies - I so appreciate them!

I'm waiting to hear back from the lawyer to see what he says about the decision, but I think writing to our MP is going to be the only way now.

I have another question:

Does anyone know if this will affect my mum getting a visitor's visa in the meantime? I have a horrible feeling that because of this she may be refused a visitor's visa and therefore will never be able to come to see us? Or are they not allowed to let this application affect granting a vistor's visa?

Thanks v much in advance.

[MPH80]

Re: getting a visitor visa in the short term

Unless there is very strong proof your mother will leave the UK at the end of the visitor visa - it is likely she'll be refused given the situation. They will just think she is attempting to come and settle on a visitor visa.

M.