Residence requirements for Naturalization

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:53 pm

Dear all,
I have applied for settlement in January 2011, but due to the nature of my work I will have to work in the USA for few years (minimum 7-8 years) and the company has applied for my Green Card today. It takes 3 months to process as the company I work for is International company and I am in a managerial position. I informed the Legal and HR team that I don't have my passport with me at moment and it's with the Home Office. They have done needful arrangements. I will be going for USA interview by end of February.

My question is, can I apply for British citizenship while living in the USA? I understand, I may have to return for few days to carry out police interview or any other interviews as required. I wont be living in the UK for 12 months after receiving ILR. has anyone gone through such situation before?

any discussions will be helpful.

Thanks.

Post by **John** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:32 pm

A number of points. Firstly, on what basis are you applying for ILR? In particular, are you married to a British Citizen?

Secondly, on the face of it, conflicting information from you, You say :-

I will have to work in the USA for few years (minimum 7-8 years)

-: but also :-

I wont be living in the UK for 12 months after receiving ILR.

Which is correct?

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:02 pm

John,
I am on work permit (Indian Citizen) and have been living in UK with absences for work/ business purposes in European countries...Germany, France and Italy.

The absences are under 90 days per year. I am sure my ILR will be successful.

The question is I want to apply for British Citizenship after 12 months of receiving my ILR. But due to my nature of work, I am been transfered to USA in May 2011 and I will be in USA (with some visits to UK) for next 7-8 years.

Any ideas or any known case where British Citizenship was granted when a person is living out of UK for most of his time after receiving ILR?

Thanks

Post by **geriatrix** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:20 pm

desiworld wrote:The question is I want to apply for British Citizenship after 12 months of receiving my ILR. But due to my nature of work, I am been transfered to USA in May 2011 and I will be in USA (with some visits to UK) for next 7-8 years.

You cannot spend more than 90 days outside UK in the one year preceding the naturalisation application, so you'll have to schedule your departure to US accordingly, after you are granted settlement.
See also 18.2.1 Naturalisation under section 6(1) and 5. Excess absences in the final year.

Reading about Returning residents (IDI) may also be useful.

regards

Post by **John** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:44 pm

Your problem is that you are clearly going to fail the 90-day rule, and fail it to an extreme amount.

The rule of course is that you must not be outside the UK for more than 90 days in the last year up to when you apply for Naturalisation.

Unless your job is working for the UK Government when you are in the USA, I see no way for you to be Naturalised as British.

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:38 pm

Thanks both of you for response.

The Annex B to chapter 18 is quite useful.
I think I have understood pages 8 and 9, 4.1.2 and 5.0 correctly. Its all upto the discreetion of officer. Read below:

c. the excess absences to have been an unavoidable consequence of the nature of a career (for example a merchant seaman or someone in UK-based business or employment which requires frequent travel abroad);

I should be fine with my application for citizenship. I am not fond of having British Citizenship but due to my work I have to travel European countries on regular basis and I have already got 3 Indian passports as they were all stamped with business and work permit visas in the last 5 year period!

It is just difficult to carry all and explain officers at the airport!

Thanks for all your help guys, if anything comes up keep me posted!

Cheers!

Teacup · Post by **Teacup** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:57 pm

Desiworld,

If you have a green card, the case worker can doubt your intentions of living in the Uk, especially if you have been away for a long time. When you fill in the citizenship application form you will have to indicate the country where you will have your main home.My spouse had absenses of just over 90 days, but works for the UK branch of an multinational company and pays taxes here, so had no issues with the application. I am not sure how it is going to be in your case if you are based for work in the US and if you will be paying your taxes in the US.

Good luck
Teacup

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:29 pm

Teacup,
Thanks for your reply, yes I am aware of this. I will be in the USA and will be paid by the business units from there into USA bank account. I realised the concern you raised about paying taxes, so I am going to talk to the HR in the UK to continue paying my NI contributions for couple of years till I get my visas sorted out. Also I will be leaving my bank accounts and all my savings here in the UK to prove my ties here. Have'nt bought any property here.

I will be calling Home Office to find out what they have to say...

Cheers

Backer · Post by **Backer** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 9:24 am

desiworld - You are probably wasting your time or going to lose your application fee. I doubt you will recieve discretion over the absences during the 12 months prior to the naturalization request even if you still receive salary or pay NI in the UK.
And also - spouses of British citizens do not need to have or prove a future intention to live in the UK - You do.

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 10:16 am

Guys,if you have any real hard facts then only reply. Just dont assume what will happen. It's just a waste of time.

If anyone has gone through such situation, I would like to hear from them.

Absences in the last 12 months before application for the British Citizenship or say absences exceeding 90 days to over 300 days in the 12 months immediately after ILR is granted and what was their application outcome for British Citizenship?

Facts only please....

Thanks.

Post by **John** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 11:15 am

desiworld, whether or not you can get Naturalisation is only one of your problems. But what about your ILR? After all the holder of ILR re-enters the UK using their ILR to resume residence. That is, ILR is not like some glorified visitor visa, and whilst you will no doubt not have a problem the first few times, sooner or later expect to be questioned at immigration control, when attempting to again re-enter the UK for yet another short stay.

I think you need to look at this from a different angle, at least for the first 12 or so months after getting ILR. That is, the choice you need to make is whether :-

to stay working in the UK, and have no problem getting Naturalisation, or
go and work abroad, expect to have real problems getting Naturalisation, and even face revocation of your ILR

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:02 pm

Thanks John for response.

yes, I understand what you propose..

I will give a call to Home Office coming Monday or in the week I will update you guys then...

Cheers

ukpl · Post by **ukpl** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:01 am

You don't want to hear assumptions and I can see your point.
But you are also making assumptions about distant future.
You are also taking BIG leap of faith in your current employer - you assume you will be working for them in US for the next 7-8 years. This is a long shot in my view. As you are probably on 3 months notice, have you considered what if...? (could be plenty "what ifs" to consider).
For me you are at the point when you have to decide what do you really want - stay here and apply for BC (which could be refused - you don't have any convictions for traffic offences whilst driving on foreign licence, do you?) or you can go to US. You probably can't have both.
In 7-8 years geopolitical situation could be different so maybe your current nationality will be better for you? Or staying in US and naturalise over there?

newbie1234 · Post by **newbie1234** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:36 pm

Hi Desiworld,

Any response from Home Office regarding your query on absences in final year exceeding 300 days ???

I am in a similar situation and would appreciate your input
Thanks

Backer · Post by **Backer** » Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:25 am

newbie1234 - I'm sure if desiworld ever called the home office and then will post their reply - they (HO) would just repeat the standard guidleines to him which is posted in this thread already.

As far as I know, there is no way you can be absent for 300 days in the year following ILR (unless spouse of a british citizen or in crown service etc.) when the guidance clearly says 90.

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:37 pm

Dear,

Apologies was bit tied up with my work so couldn't reply soon.

Well to be honest not me but my HR department called with my query to the UKBA.

The reply is:
It's up to the Secretary of State to approve/ disapprove the application. Each case is independently judged and permission is granted and absences disregarded case by case basis.

As I have been in this country for last 7 years it should be straight forward case, although I have been absent for some time.

For your information: I work in Nuclear Energy arena, so things are different in my case. A British or say any other country will probably need me to get their citizenship for Security Clearance/ vetting purposes and to get things moving at bit faster pace.

My company will assist and provide all help in my naturalisation application in my absence from the UK.

Secondly, I applied for my settlement as I have posted in previous post and it was approved on 15 Feb. Also my USA application has gone through and hopefully in 1 months time will get my green card. I will have to go to USA embassy, London.....bit of a pain though

Will keep you posted about my developments.

Don't panic if you don't hear from me for a while, cos its difficult to get time and do all this!
Always happy to help my India and other friends

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:46 pm

ukpl wrote:You don't want to hear assumptions and I can see your point.
But you are also making assumptions about distant future.
You are also taking BIG leap of faith in your current employer - you assume you will be working for them in US for the next 7-8 years. This is a long shot in my view. As you are probably on 3 months notice, have you considered what if...? (could be plenty "what ifs" to consider).
For me you are at the point when you have to decide what do you really want - stay here and apply for BC (which could be refused - you don't have any convictions for traffic offences whilst driving on foreign licence, do you?) or you can go to US. You probably can't have both.
In 7-8 years geopolitical situation could be different so maybe your current nationality will be better for you? Or staying in US and naturalise over there?

I liked the way people have posted their comments....one of them has even claimed what response I will get

I liked your point "As you are probably on 3 months notice...." you need widen your view ..... every one is not on a 3 months notice period! There are some instances where an employee and company work co operatively...

well dear I wish you be successful and, once you rise to higher management board position in your work, you will learn way of life and how "organisation" operates ...anyways, thanks it will be helpful to other friends here!
take care

ukpl · Post by **ukpl** » Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:54 pm

desiworld wrote:well dear I wish you be successful and, once you rise to higher management board position in your work

sorry mate but you are barking at the wrong tree...
been there, know it inside out
I like your feel of being invicible
good luck to you, sir

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:09 am

Ukpl,
no need to take it too personal.....I've just put forth my opinion and judgment...i am not saying you are wrong or any way to offend you..if you thought so than apologies from my end..if you read properly, I've thanked you saying your comment will be helpful to some other person who has 3months notice period and other criterion!

desiworld · Post by **desiworld** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:31 am

Dear all,
Thanks for replying. Just to update you, everything is sorted. I am living in USA (at time of application) and got UK citizenship (in USA).
Just for your information, each application is dealt with case by case bases.

Wish you all the best and I hope your things get sorted quickly!

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Residence requirements for Naturalization

Residence requirements for Naturalization