Updated: <6 months living in UK

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 5:49 pm

***I am updating this initial post because my goal is now different but related.***

I am a US citizen who wishes to temporarily relocate to the UK for just less than 6 months. My Russian girlfriend will be entering University for a 12 month program starting in October and I'd like to live with her for 5.5 months starting in October.

I am 31yo white male.
I do not have any recent British ancestors.
I do not own a house or land; I will move back with parents while over in the UK to minimize expenses.
I am a self-employed web designer with less than Â£10k in savings. I have worked full-time in my past for a couple of years but am currently freelancing.
I hold a bachelor's degree from an American university.

For a five and a half month visit where I strictly live with my gf in her flat, how much in funds do I need in my bank account? I can only provide bank statements of my income in the states from clients that I get on a regular basis.

I also will need to work on my projects for my American clients while I live in the UK so that I can wire money and support myself, pay for food and living expenses and help contribute to my lifestyle. From what I've read, it's not legal for me to work while in the UK. But does this apply if I'm still doing business for my American clients?

Thank you for your advice and replies!

I am a US citizen who wishes to temporarily relocate to the UK for a year. My Russian girlfriend will be entering University for a year starting in September and I'd like to follow her.

I am 31yo white male.
I do not have any recent British ancestors.
I am a self-employed web designer with less than the required Â£200k capital for Entreprenuer Tier 1 visa. I have worked full-time in my past for a couple of years as well.
I hold a bachelor's degree from an American university.

It is my impression that the only way I might be allowed to work in the UK is for Tier 2, but I am now reading that the amount of positions for non-citizens will decrease on April 1st.

Is there other ways I can look at trying to get a job in the UK by the end of summer 2011? Thank you for your advice and replies!

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:13 am

I tried calling the US Embassy in London but it appears they only help British citizens trying to visit the US and not the other way around. Is there someone in the US I should contact instead?

I'd really appreciate any advice you can provide me. Thank you.

Mr Rusty · Post by **Mr Rusty** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 12:07 pm

You need to have a look at this website:-

http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/en/

But from the scant detail you have given you would appear to have little to offer the UK and your chances of securing any form of employment there are slim to nil.

As a "self-employed web designer" if you just turn up at a UK airport and seek entry as a visitor, unless you can show firm evidence of regular work and income and an intention to return to the US, with a girlfriend in the UK, you might fail to satisfy the Immigration Officer that you are a genuine visitor.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:36 pm

Thank you for your advice! I did look at the border agency website to get details on how to get a visa and it looks quite difficult.

You mentioned my details are scant, but I'd like to know what other information I should provide.

My employment history as a web designer is at least 7 years professionally with a great portfolio of work. I have held two positions in two companies with full-time employment as a web designer as well before going out into my own.

I guess from my research, I'm curious to know what other ways I might be able to legally live and work from the UK. It appears that the tier 2 work visa is my only shot, but ONLY if I somehow get a job offer and sponsor. Is this correct?

I do not plan to study abroad, am not rich enough to get a tier 1, and do not wish to find a seasonal job only. Thus, my options appear to be limited. But, I wanted to know if I'm making the correct assumptions and also to know if there are other options I should consider.

Again, thanks for your reply.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:09 am

In doing more research, I have come across even more discouraging information.

It appears that even to qualify for a work visa, I must show my bank account balance and paystubs to prove I can support myself. Is this also true even if I get a sponsor? I was informed that students in the US that were accepted into a school in the UK are denied based on the financial support fact. Thus, this decreases my chances as well.

It appears that finding a sponsor is just as difficult as getting a job offer. It was suggested to me to fly to London for a few weeks and hit the pavement trying to find a job. Knowing that the unemployment rate for the UK is similar to the US (or is it more?), is it as easy as visiting different companies in the UK, interviewing for a position and getting a job offer? Is this a waste of effort and time or would I produce any results from something like this?

Is it even legal for me to go to the UK for holiday purposes but to seek work anyway? I wouldn't know the first thing about applying for a job there. I am having enough trouble here in the US trying to land work so I imagine it's just as bad or worse there.

I'd really appreciate any feedback, thanks.

krazydude · Post by **krazydude** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:51 pm

It appears that finding a sponsor is just as difficult as getting a job offer. It was suggested to me to fly to London for a few weeks and hit the pavement trying to find a job. Knowing that the unemployment rate for the UK is similar to the US (or is it more?), is it as easy as visiting different companies in the UK, interviewing for a position and getting a job offer? Is this a waste of effort and time or would I produce any results from something like this?

Why don't you start applying from the US itself. You can line up some interviews for yourself and then take a flight down to the UK and see how these interviews go. Finding a job in the UK is as tough (if not more) as it is in the US right now for a lot of job categories. However you might have certain skills which might help you get a job in the UK. Its not as if the job market is totally dead.

malikscompany · Post by **malikscompany** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 10:49 pm

you are US citizen, they will welcome you.

joh118 · Post by **joh118** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:14 pm

dreamsofuk wrote:I am a US citizen who wishes to temporarily relocate to the UK for a year. My Russian girlfriend will be entering University for a year starting in September and I'd like to follow her.

I am 31yo white male.
I do not have any recent British ancestors.
I am a self-employed web designer with less than the required Â£200k capital for Entreprenuer Tier 1 visa. I have worked full-time in my past for a couple of years as well.
I hold a bachelor's degree from an American university.

It is my impression that the only way I might be allowed to work in the UK is for Tier 2, but I am now reading that the amount of positions for non-citizens will decrease on April 1st.

Is there other ways I can look at trying to get a job in the UK by the end of summer 2011? Thank you for your advice and replies!

I presume your Russian girlfriend will be on Tier 4 when she starts university in the UK? You can follow her to the UK as an unmarried partner. You will however need to show you have sufficient funds to maintain yourself. As your girlfriend is studying a degree level course, you can also work in the UK as well.

But this is only temporary as you will only be given permission until she finishes her degree.

I presume she is doing post-graduate level study????
For a student to sponsor a dependant, the student will have to be on a post graduate course (NQF 7 and above) at a university which is of more than 12 monthsâ€™ duration, or a Government Sponsored student.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:34 am

Thank you for all the replies!

Why don't you start applying from the US itself. You can line up some interviews for yourself and then take a flight down to the UK and see how these interviews go. Finding a job in the UK is as tough (if not more) as it is in the US right now for a lot of job categories. However you might have certain skills which might help you get a job in the UK. Its not as if the job market is totally dead.

I'm not sure my skills as a web designer are above and beyond the skills of local web designers in the UK. From my research, these positions I can take must be graduate-level work which cannot be filled by a UK citizen. The companies must advertise for a certain position for no less than a month before they can seek a candidate from a foreign national. Sadly, web design is so ubiquitous that I can't see my job position being "graduate-level".

you are US citizen, they will welcome you.

Haha, yes as a tourist they will gladly take my money from me!

I presume your Russian girlfriend will be on Tier 4 when she starts university in the UK? You can follow her to the UK as an unmarried partner. You will however need to show you have sufficient funds to maintain yourself. As your girlfriend is studying a degree level course, you can also work in the UK as well.

I saw this option that I can apply for, but my funds are currently less than Â£6000 and it wil take a miracle for me to get them anywhere near Â£20,000 or so. I am not sure what the minimum requirement would be but sadly I do not meet it for this type of situation.

I presume she is doing post-graduate level study????
For a student to sponsor a dependant, the student will have to be on a post graduate course (NQF 7 and above) at a university which is of more than 12 monthsâ€™ duration, or a Government Sponsored student.

She is doing post-grad but her program will last only 1 academic year. It sounds like she doesn't even qualify to sponsor me since you state it must be more than 12 months' duration.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 8:50 am

It appears that getting a work visa is going to be next to impossible for someone in my position so I think unfortunately I will dismiss this idea for now.

Our only other option is me visiting as a tourist. I can be in the UK for up to 6 months out of a 12 month calendar year. Thus, i could be there from October until Februrary or March before I must return.

How analogy will Border Patrol be about my stay? I could tell them I'm only staying for a couple of weeks and will purchase my return flight in the UK. But will this work?

If I tell them i'm staying up to 6 months, will they want to check my funds to make sure I can return to the US?

I have no clue what to expect and what I can get away with. Thanks again for all the advice I've received so far.

Post by **Casa** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:11 am

If you apply for a visitor visa you'll have to prove that there are strong reasons for you to return to the US...work, property, family ties etc.
You may be going down a tricky road here if you withhold the truth regarding your intended length of stay in the UK. If you say you're staying 2 weeks and stay 6 months, you'll have problems re-entering the next time. The entry officer will want to see a return ticket.
If you don't mention the fact that your girlfriend is in the UK, you'll be unable to include her in any future applications. eg. proof of contact/length of relationship in a spouse/fiance application.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:40 am

I was thinking about not applying for a visitor visa for the reason you stated: it would be a tricky road.

I would arrive on UK shores as would any person taking a vacation. When I give them my info, I would give them my ticket to the UK. If they ask for my return, I would tell them I'll be purchasing it a 2 weeks before I leave and would state I plan to spend only 3-4 weeks total.

In this way, I would not need to prove any reasons to return to the US.

If you don't mention the fact that your girlfriend is in the UK, you'll be unable to include her in any future applications. eg. proof of contact/length of relationship in a spouse/fiance application.

I wouldn't have to do this for any applications/contracts in the UK. I could easily do this for the US, however. Are you referring only to UK applications and contracts?

Post by **MPH80** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:51 am

That kind of plan is more likely to generate questions than anything else.

You could expect questions about what you plan to do while you're here ... how much funds you have ...

A clear plan - booked into a hotel - with a return ticket is much less likely to generate suspicion.

You need to be aware that if you are caught in a lie at the border, getting back in after that can be very very very hard.

M.

Post by **PaperPusher** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:57 am

Do not lie, I repeat, do not lie.

You must tell the truth about your intentions. It is a criminal offence to use deception to enter or try to enter the UK, and if you get caught you can look forward to a nice little stay in a detention centre before you get put on a return flight, and possibly never being able to come back to the UK as a visitor again.

US citizens already have a reputation for having no compunction about using deception if they want to visit partners in the UK. This is certainly a stereotype, but the Immigration Officer is already on to you and knows how to catch you out in your lies.

Have a look at what evidence of funds is needed for student dependents, and then work from there. Â£6k seems an OK sum for a student lifestyle, especially if you will be sharing accommodation with your girlfriend.

dreamsofuk wrote:I was thinking about not applying for a visitor visa for the reason you stated: it would be a tricky road.

I would arrive on UK shores as would any person taking a vacation. When I give them my info, I would give them my ticket to the UK. If they ask for my return, I would tell them I'll be purchasing it a 2 weeks before I leave and would state I plan to spend only 3-4 weeks total.

In this way, I would not need to prove any reasons to return to the US.

If you don't mention the fact that your girlfriend is in the UK, you'll be unable to include her in any future applications. eg. proof of contact/length of relationship in a spouse/fiance application.
I wouldn't have to do this for any applications/contracts in the UK. I could easily do this for the US, however. Are you referring only to UK applications and contracts?

Post by **Greenie** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:04 pm

PaperPusher wrote:Do not lie, I repeat, do not lie.

You must tell the truth about your intentions. It is a criminal offence to use deception to enter or try to enter the UK, and if you get caught you can look forward to a nice little stay in a detention centre before you get put on a return flight, and possibly never being able to come back to the UK as a visitor again.

US citizens already have a reputation for having no compunction about using deception if they want to visit partners in the UK. This is certainly a stereotype, but the Immigration Officer is already on to you and knows how to catch you out in your lies.

Have a look at what evidence of funds is needed for student dependents, and then work from there. Â£6k seems an OK sum for a student lifestyle, especially if you will be sharing accommodation with your girlfriend.
dreamsofuk wrote:I was thinking about not applying for a visitor visa for the reason you stated: it would be a tricky road.

I would arrive on UK shores as would any person taking a vacation. When I give them my info, I would give them my ticket to the UK. If they ask for my return, I would tell them I'll be purchasing it a 2 weeks before I leave and would state I plan to spend only 3-4 weeks total.

In this way, I would not need to prove any reasons to return to the US.

If you don't mention the fact that your girlfriend is in the UK, you'll be unable to include her in any future applications. eg. proof of contact/length of relationship in a spouse/fiance application.
I wouldn't have to do this for any applications/contracts in the UK. I could easily do this for the US, however. Are you referring only to UK applications and contracts?

I agree the OP seems to be heading down a slippery slope if he is going to practice deception at the airport in order to seek entry as a visitor.

DreamsofUK

The rules require that you and your girlfriend have been living together in a relationship similar to marriage for two years. Have you?

You say your girlfriends course will be one academic year. How many months exactly is it?

Is she going to be studying in a private college or a university?

ouflak1 · Post by **ouflak1** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:42 pm

PaperPusher wrote: US citizens already have a reputation for having no compunction about using deception if they want to visit partners in the UK. This is certainly a stereotype, but the Immigration Officer is already on to you and knows how to catch you out in your lies.

I can't find any evidence that such a stereotype exists. Your post is the first I've ever heard the idea even suggested and I've certainly faced no extra scrutiny that I'm aware of in my extensive travels due to such a 'stereotype'. Can you provide any support for such a stereotype existing outside of your own post? Perhaps a link to an article or an old message board discussion?

Also, if immigration officers really have such ideas as you have, they would simply require all American citizens to have a visa like they do most other non-EU nationalities. If you're stereotype (however untrue it may be) is truly in the minds of all immigration officers as you say, why doesn't the UK have such a requirement? Why are Americans by the droves let in without any scrutiny whatsoever?

Fairtrade · Post by **Fairtrade** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:55 pm

I have seen tv documentries where US nationals get deported from the UK... seems like more and more Americans want to leave the US these days.... wonder why?

Post by **PaperPusher** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:31 pm

http://londonelegance.com/transpondia/usuk/

It also comes up all the time here:

http://talk.uk-yankee.com/index.php?board=17.0

As I said, do not lie about your intentions. If you intend to stay for four months or however long, tell the Immigration Officer that, rather than lie and say you intend to stay for two weeks.

Most American visitors do get in to the UK with no problem, it is the ones that lie that will find themselves with a problem if the get caught out.

A refusal for deception is MUCH worse than a refusal for not meeting the requirements.

ouflak1 wrote:
PaperPusher wrote: US citizens already have a reputation for having no compunction about using deception if they want to visit partners in the UK. This is certainly a stereotype, but the Immigration Officer is already on to you and knows how to catch you out in your lies.
I can't find any evidence that such a stereotype exists. Your post is the first I've ever heard the idea even suggested and I've certainly faced no extra scrutiny that I'm aware of in my extensive travels due to such a 'stereotype'. Can you provide any support for such a stereotype existing outside of your own post? Perhaps a link to an article or an old message board discussion?

Also, if immigration officers really have such ideas as you have, they would simply require all American citizens to have a visa like they do most other non-EU nationalities. If you're stereotype (however untrue it may be) is truly in the minds of all immigration officers as you say, why doesn't the UK have such a requirement? Why are Americans by the droves let in without any scrutiny whatsoever?

ouflak1 · Post by **ouflak1** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:04 pm

PaperPusher wrote:http://londonelegance.com/transpondia/usuk/

It also comes up all the time here:

http://talk.uk-yankee.com/index.php?board=17.0

ouflak1 wrote:
PaperPusher wrote: US citizens already have a reputation for having no compunction about using deception if they want to visit partners in the UK. This is certainly a stereotype, but the Immigration Officer is already on to you and knows how to catch you out in your lies.
I can't find any evidence that such a stereotype exists. Your post is the first I've ever heard the idea even suggested and I've certainly faced no extra scrutiny that I'm aware of in my extensive travels due to such a 'stereotype'. Can you provide any support for such a stereotype existing outside of your own post? Perhaps a link to an article or an old message board discussion?

Also, if immigration officers really have such ideas as you have, they would simply require all American citizens to have a visa like they do most other non-EU nationalities. If you're stereotype (however untrue it may be) is truly in the minds of all immigration officers as you say, why doesn't the UK have such a requirement? Why are Americans by the droves let in without any scrutiny whatsoever?

The first link gives general advice about Americans traveling to the UK and mentions nothing about your stereotype. There are some interesting stories there, but no stereotypes.

The second link is a link to uk-yankee.com message board forum on Visas and U.S. citizenship. A search in this forum on the word 'stereotype' does not turn up a result. Nor does a search on the entire forum. The forum rules there explicitly state that no one can give advice that involves breaking any UK rules.

Can you provide any proof that this stereotype of yours exists outside of your post? Thanks!

Perusing Paperpusher's links a bit more did bring up an interesting site (below) that ought to scare the OP a bit, although his situation is obviously somewhat different. It is a good bit of reading on just how miserable (and from a certain perspective, unfair) an experience it can be to try and make it through UK immigration. I wonder now if some of my traveling experiences (19 different countries) would have been different if I had been a single female instead of a single male.

Nevertheless, the advice that all others have given, and that is eventually given on this website http://londonelegance.com/transpondia/u ... sexp.shtml is quite sound. Tell the truth. Be prepared for a grilling and backing up everything you say with evidence, even if it is the truth. Don't ever try to to deceive.

ouflak1 · Post by **ouflak1** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:45 pm

Fairtrade wrote:I have seen tv documentries where US nationals get deported from the UK... seems like more and more Americans want to leave the US these days.... wonder why?

On the UK Border show, there was an episode where an American guy was visiting his girlfriend. He would have been ok, except that he didn't bring a lot of money with him. The grilling he received was humiliating to both him and the UK. They let him in for just one day. That guy was only telling the truth.

Nevertheless, for fear of dragging this thread off-topic, this documentary does not constitute any support for the statement that any of us Americans want to leave the U.S. 'more and more' these days. It's a wonderful country with wonderful opportunities. But the world is a big place and also full of many wonderful opportunites. Just because we are Americans, doesn't mean that we have, or must have, tunnel vision as to where we seek and find our opportunities in this life. Some of us doing so is no negative reflection on our country in any way. It's just a reflection of the fact that we are human beings just like everybody else. The OP has a meaningful relationship with a non-American. And he very much wants to be with her. That doesn't mean America is suddenly a bad place to be.

Post by **PaperPusher** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:54 pm

Look at the highlighted yellow bits on the first link. Those are quotes from a longer report about how Immigration Officers make their decisions at ports.

I am just warning you because from your posts it does seem that you are planning to use deception to get entry to the UK as a visitor.

Here is one link:

http://www.uk-yankee.com/guide/expat-gu ... mmigration

If you look how long I have been a member of this board, I hope you realise this is experience talking rather than malice. I was also a lurker for a couple of years before I joined.

Put a post on UK-Yankee about using deception to come to the UK and you will get leapt on there, I have seen it.

If you don't believe me about the stereotype, fine, but it seems you are a US citizen, planning to visit your partner, and unfortunately planning to lie to the IO.
The search function on UK-Yankee doesn't seem to be the best, search on "deported" and I did not get many results.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 5:55 pm

Wow, I set off a bomb!

Okay, I totally hear you, no lies. I absolutely do not want any funny business at all nor do I want the chance of never being allowed to come back into the country.

My gf knows friends who have done exactly what I was slyly suggesting. When she brought it up as an option, I was very uninterested in using this method b/c of the exact reasons all of you brought up. One of her friends bought a ticket that lasts only a month and then, while in the UK, extended this ticket once or twice to equal a longer trip. That's a big reason why I wanted to get opinions.

I'm sad that the work visa is such a hassle, honestly. If there was a way for me to get a 6month to 1year job in the UK, I'd be so happy to get that. But it's just not likely at this point.

Ultimately, I am on your side about lying. I am not interested in the option of being deported like this and would MUCH rather do everything as legally as possible so that I am welcome back into the country in the future.

Thank you for your advice and replies; it means a lot.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:02 pm

Greenie wrote:The rules require that you and your girlfriend have been living together in a relationship similar to marriage for two years. Have you?

Which rules? We have been dating for more than 2 years but sadly have not lived together for much of that time.

Greenie wrote:You say your girlfriends course will be one academic year. How many months exactly is it?

12 month program.

Greenie wrote:Is she going to be studying in a private college or a university?

Public. Aren't the majority of uni's in the UK public?

Fairtrade wrote:I have seen tv documentries where US nationals get deported from the UK... seems like more and more Americans want to leave the US these days.... wonder why?

My move would be temporary, to be with my gf while she studies in the UK. There ARE a lot of Americans who are ready to relocate abroad b/c of the policies our lawmakers are coming up with. I know many people who want to just leave for a long time if not for good. I would never do this myself b/c I do not have this same disdain. And besides, I'd really miss a lot of amazing foods you can't find anywhere else!

Post by **PaperPusher** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:23 pm

At last!

Have a look at Tier 5. There are temporary schemes that you may be interested in.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/worki ... exchanged/

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/worki ... tyworkers/

If you have not lived together for two years as unmatched partners you would not meet the requirements of the immigration rules to come to the UK as your girlfriend's unmarried partner.

Apart from that there is still Tier 2 or visits.

dreamsofuk · Post by **dreamsofuk** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:28 pm

PaperPusher wrote:At last!

Have a look at Tier 5. There are temporary schemes that you may be interested in.

If you have not lived together for two years as unmatched partners you would not meet the requirements of the immigration rules to come to the UK as your girlfriend's unmarried partner.

Apart from that there is still Tier 2 or visits.

Trust me, I've looked at all the different tiered visas. The rules and requirements for me to get one of them is, unfortunately, very high. Getting a tier 2 visa requires a job offer, but getting a job offer requires a sponsorship already. It's next to impossible because I do not match any of the job listings where they are looking for a foreign national. There's a list of highly skilled professions, most of which are doctors or post-grad degreed jobs.

Anyway, I do not feel this is an option for me at this point.

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Updated: <6 months living in UK

Updated: <6 months living in UK

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