Child Benefits on Tier1 Visa

[umeshk2119]

Hi,

I am on Tier1 Visa. Recently I had a baby and I am granted with child benefit. My visa says no recourse to public funds. My baby is born in UK. I am not sure if i need to worry as i am getting child benefit. if it will cause any problem in the renew of my visa. Can you please assist?

Thanks,

[John]

Your nationality? The nationality of your spouse/partner?

[umeshk2119]

Hi I amd my spouse is Indian

[John]

In that case there is no entitlement to claim Child Benefit while you are still on a time-limited visa ..... unless by chance you or your spouse worked in Canada (where the terms of the Social Security agreement between the UK and Canada would give you the right to claim UK Child Benefit, as long as you have paid Canadian Social Security contributions).

If you are not entitled to claim, contact the Child Benefit office and withdrawn your claim. And don't claim Tax Credits!

[jdk]

In that case there is no entitlement to claim Child Benefit while you are still on a time-limited visa ..... unless by chance you or your spouse worked in Canada (where the terms of the Social Security agreement between the UK and Canada would give you the right to claim UK Child Benefit, as long as you have paid Canadian Social Security contributions).

If you are not entitled to claim, contact the Child Benefit office and withdrawn your claim. And don't claim Tax Credits!

Hi John,

For similar circumstances, but I am a South African citizen (on Tier 1) and my wife is British, can I claim tax credits for child care or is it not allowed?

Thanks

[John]

jdk, can you firstly explain why you are on a Tier 1 visa, rather than a spouse visa, given your wife is British?

[eager2learn]

jdk, can you firstly explain why you are on a Tier 1 visa, rather than a spouse visa, given your wife is British?

posted in wrong place, sorry.

[jdk]

jdk, can you firstly explain why you are on a Tier 1 visa, rather than a spouse visa, given your wife is British?

Yes sure, when I got married last year I was already fairly well into the tenure of my Tier 1 visa, which had been going for 3.5 yrs. So from my point of view, there did not seem to be much marginal benefit in going onto the spousal visa, given that the spousal visa and the remaining period on my Tier 1 visa would both roughly equate to another 18 months, from that point in time, to be able to get ILR (I think it's 18 months until you get ILR for the Spousal; versus 5 yrs minus the 3.5 yrs I already had on Tier 1). Maybe this was not the best move in hindsight? Either way what's done is done. I am due to apply for ILR at the end of this year but have signed up to the Childcare benefits program at work and received 1 payment so far, unfortunately doing this without "joining the dots" to the requirement of No Recourse to Public Funds on my leave to remain visa.

My wife is British and so is our baby. I do not claim any other benefits. I am employed full time etc. I am looking into getting my wife put on as a joint Child benefit account holder, as it seems from guidance given that under these circumstances the claiming of child benefits is an allowable exception? Although she is self employed so I am still looking into what the alternatives are here.

Very grateful for your insights?

Thank you.

[John]

..... have signed up to the Childcare benefits program at work and received 1 payment so far

This "Childcare benefits programme", exactly what is that? Is it designed by the employer, and nothing to do with the Government? More detail please.

As regards public benefits, there is no problem either you or your wife claiming Child Benefit. Also there is no problem, if the family income is not too high, for the two of you jointly to claim Tax Credits.

[jdk]

..... have signed up to the Childcare benefits program at work and received 1 payment so far

This "Childcare benefits programme", exactly what is that? Is it designed by the employer, and nothing to do with the Government? More detail please.

As regards public benefits, there is no problem either you or your wife claiming Child Benefit. Also there is no problem, if the family income is not too high, for the two of you jointly to claim Tax Credits.

Apologies, I was referring to the Child care vouchers that you sign for at work. Whereby they take an agreed amount of pre-taxed money off your salary and place it with the likes of Sodexo to use as credits for registered child care related expenses. So get the tax savings..

[John]

A couple of points. Firstly the vouchers are not provided by the Government, they are provided by your employer, so they cannot possibly be Public Funds. So there cannot possibly be a "No recourse to Public Funds" problem.

Secondly, your income is now less than it would have been, and given you are still on Tier 1, might that cause a problem you getting your next visa? But given the next visa is ILR, I don't think there can be a problem.

Please confirm that Child Benefit is being claimed, and also Tax Credits unless the family income is too high.

[jdk]

A couple of points. Firstly the vouchers are not provided by the Government, they are provided by your employer, so they cannot possibly be Public Funds. So there cannot possibly be a "No recourse to Public Funds" problem.

Secondly, your income is now less than it would have been, and given you are still on Tier 1, might that cause a problem you getting your next visa? But given the next visa is ILR, I don't think there can be a problem.

Please confirm that Child Benefit is being claimed, and also Tax Credits unless the family income is too high.

That's good news thanks. I think I have been confusing the types of child related reliefs. I have just looked up the exact definitions: I do not claim any tax credits or Child Benefits. My British wife does claim the Child benefit of circa £20/week though.
The childcare Vouchers that I receive from my employer are the only thing that could possibly be some kind of benefit. I had thought that the tax relief on the portion of your salary that you "sacrifice" may have been a benefit provided by the government, but if this is not the case then it would seem I am OK on this?

[jdk]

A couple of points. Firstly the vouchers are not provided by the Government, they are provided by your employer, so they cannot possibly be Public Funds. So there cannot possibly be a "No recourse to Public Funds" problem.

Secondly, your income is now less than it would have been, and given you are still on Tier 1, might that cause a problem you getting your next visa? But given the next visa is ILR, I don't think there can be a problem.

Please confirm that Child Benefit is being claimed, and also Tax Credits unless the family income is too high.

That's good news thanks. I think I have been confusing the types of child related reliefs. I have just looked up the exact definitions: I do not claim any tax credits or Child Benefits. My British wife does claim the Child benefit of circa £20/week though.
The childcare Vouchers that I receive from my employer are the only thing that could possibly be some kind of benefit. I had thought that the tax relief on the portion of your salary that you "sacrifice" may have been a benefit provided by the government, but if this is not the case then it would seem I am OK on this?

Found my answer here.
http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=48520

Thanks very much for you assistance. Great board.

[sudhakar_barua]

In that case there is no entitlement to claim Child Benefit while you are still on a time-limited visa ..... unless by chance you or your spouse worked in Canada (where the terms of the Social Security agreement between the UK and Canada would give you the right to claim UK Child Benefit, as long as you have paid Canadian Social Security contributions).

If you are not entitled to claim, contact the Child Benefit office and withdrawn your claim. And don't claim Tax Credits!

This link from hmrc says the rules are different now(applicable from may 2011)
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/childbenefit/sta ... s-uk.htm#4

[Greenie]

In that case there is no entitlement to claim Child Benefit while you are still on a time-limited visa ..... unless by chance you or your spouse worked in Canada (where the terms of the Social Security agreement between the UK and Canada would give you the right to claim UK Child Benefit, as long as you have paid Canadian Social Security contributions).

If you are not entitled to claim, contact the Child Benefit office and withdrawn your claim. And don't claim Tax Credits!

This link from hmrc says the rules are different now(applicable from may 2011)
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/childbenefit/sta ... s-uk.htm#4

what exactly do you think is different as to change John's answer that a Tier 1 migrant from India cannot claim child benefit unless she or her spouse has worked in Canada and paid Canadian social security contributions ?

[sudhakar_barua]

what exactly do you think is different as to change John's answer that a Tier 1 migrant from India cannot claim child benefit unless she or her spouse has worked in Canada and paid Canadian social security contributions ?

The table on the section of the link
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/childbenefit/sta ... s-uk.htm#4
says
[Where you’re from] [When you have a right to reside in the UK]
..................................................................................................
[None of the above countries] [If you have permission to enter and remain in the UK. ]

Also, yesterday in my bounty pack from the hospital the included child benefit form mandates that I fill up the claim form and post it irrespective of my immigration status otherwise HMRC will contact me. I will wait for HMRC to decide whether they approve of my claim.

[Greenie]

what exactly do you think is different as to change John's answer that a Tier 1 migrant from India cannot claim child benefit unless she or her spouse has worked in Canada and paid Canadian social security contributions ?

The table on the section of the link
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/childbenefit/sta ... s-uk.htm#4
says
[Where you’re from] [When you have a right to reside in the UK]
..................................................................................................
[None of the above countries] [If you have permission to enter and remain in the UK. ]

Also, yesterday in my bounty pack from the hospital the included child benefit form mandates that I fill up the claim form and post it irrespective of my immigration status otherwise HMRC will contact me. I will wait for HMRC to decide whether they approve of my claim.

You should not apply for a benefit that you are not entitled to it is a breach of your conditions if your visa says 'no recourse to public funds' and you do not fall into one of the categories highlighted by John (i.e. from a certain country).

If you continue reading the rest of the page, you will see that it says you cannot claim child benefit if you are subject to immigration control. The rules have not changed to allow a tier 1 migrant to claim child benefit.

[sudhakar_barua]

You should not apply for a benefit that you are not entitled to it is a breach of your conditions if your visa says 'no recourse to public funds' and you do not fall into one of the categories highlighted by John (i.e. from a certain country).

If you continue reading the rest of the page, you will see that it says you cannot claim child benefit if you are subject to immigration control. The rules have not changed to allow a tier 1 migrant to claim child benefit.

Thanks Greenie- I just called up the HMRC help line and they insists that I fill up the claim form with my immigration status(Tier1 visa, from India) and post it. They will then take a call whether to reject or approve it. I will update the forum whatever is the HMRC decision.
Thanks!:-)

[Greenie]

You should not apply for a benefit that you are not entitled to it is a breach of your conditions if your visa says 'no recourse to public funds' and you do not fall into one of the categories highlighted by John (i.e. from a certain country).

If you continue reading the rest of the page, you will see that it says you cannot claim child benefit if you are subject to immigration control. The rules have not changed to allow a tier 1 migrant to claim child benefit.

Thanks Greenie- I just called up the HMRC help line and they insists that I fill up the claim form with my immigration status(Tier1 visa, from India) and post it. They will then take a call whether to reject or approve it. I will update the forum whatever is the HMRC decision.
Thanks!:-)

if you claim a benefit to which you are not entitled it is a breach of your conditions. HMRC are not the UKBA. In addition, they are known to make mistakes, and pay someone a benefit to which they are not entitled which can then cause problems when it comes to applications to the UKBA. It is very clear on the HMRC website, if you are subject to immigration control (i.e. a tier 1 migrant with limited leave to remain and no recourse to public funds) you cannot claim child benefit, as child benefit is a public fund.

[sudhakar_barua]

if you claim a benefit to which you are not entitled it is a breach of your conditions. HMRC are not the UKBA. In addition, they are known to make mistakes, and pay someone a benefit to which they are not entitled which can then cause problems when it comes to applications to the UKBA. It is very clear on the HMRC website, if you are subject to immigration control (i.e. a tier 1 migrant with limited leave to remain and no recourse to public funds) you cannot claim child benefit, as child benefit is a public fund.

The HMRC website is not at all clear who qualifies and who doesn't. It uses words like "may" and "some benefits". It doesn't says in clear terms that "Tier 1 migrants from India are not eligible to child benefits".

The website says:-

If you're subject to 'immigration control'
You may not be able to get Child Benefit if you're subject to 'immigration control'. Immigration control means either:

•the Home Office gives you permission to stay in the UK (known as 'leave to enter or remain') - but this permission is given to you on the grounds that you don't claim some benefits, tax credits or housing help paid by the UK government (known as 'no recourse to public funds')

HMRC may not be UKBA, but Question 16 till 20 on the claim form clearly collects the information about my immigration status. So, I believe HMRC is going to take an informed decision whether to reject or approve my application based on these questions.

Dear folks on the forum - have you faced problems with UKBA becuase of your claims with HMRC?

[Greenie]

Read the ukba guidance on public funds which sets out a list of public funds and explains the exceptions to the rule when a person who has no recourse to public funds can claim a benefit that is otherwise a public fund. This does not include tier 1 migrants from India.

there have been numerous examples on the forum of

a) migrants claiming benefits to which they are not entitled and then having problems when making further applications to the UKBA.

b) HMRC paying child benefit and tax credits to migrants who are not entitled to them who then have to cancel the claim and pay the benefits back.

The original poster in this thread had wrongly been granted child benefit.

Don't risk it for £20 a week. the rules are clear.

[John]

sudhakar_barua, what are you trying to achieve? Based upon what you have posted you are clearly not entitled to claim Child Benefit, not until you have ILR.

So worse case, HMRC erroneously agree to pay a claim, you would be in breach of the "No recourse to Public Funds" condition on your visa.

[mnhmnh222]

Hi,

I am on Tier 1 visa in UK. My visa says “no recourse to public funds” but for last one year i have been receiving child benefit (£20/week). My baby was born in Uk. Both my wife and I are Pakistani National.
I had applied for my baby’s visa as a “dependent of Tier 1 visa holder” and at that time i did mention about claiming child benefit in application, and my baby was granted dependent visa until the expiry of my Tier 1 visa. Now i am applying for further extension but not sure if it will affect my visa extension.

Before coming to UK, i had lived and worked in Canada for two years and paid all taxes which would have entitled me to all Canadian Government paid benefits. I read in this thread that one can claim child benefit in UK if previously they had paid social security in Canada.

Regards,
mnh

[John]

Before coming to UK, i had lived and worked in Canada for two years and paid all taxes which would have entitled me to all Canadian Government paid benefits. I read in this thread that one can claim child benefit in UK if previously they had paid social security in Canada.

That is right, if you have paid Canadian Social Security Contributions you are within the terms of the UK-Canadian Social Security Agreement .... whatever your nationality!

So you are totally entitled to claim Child Benefit in the UK. But not Tax Credits.

[mnhmnh222]

Before coming to UK, i had lived and worked in Canada for two years and paid all taxes which would have entitled me to all Canadian Government paid benefits. I read in this thread that one can claim child benefit in UK if previously they had paid social security in Canada.

That is right, if you have paid Canadian Social Security Contributions you are within the terms of the UK-Canadian Social Security Agreement .... whatever your nationality!

So you are totally entitled to claim Child Benefit in the UK. But not Tax Credits.

Thanks for your prompt response. Really appreciate that.

Do i need to mention that in my visa application that i had lived in Canada and paid social security etc. How would UKBA know that i lived in Canada and why i am claiming child benefit?

Many thanks,
mnh