HSMP JR redundant how 2 show economically active

[daisysdream2]

Arrived UK I Oct 2006 HSMP
Extended Tier 1 Oct 2008
Expires 3 Oct 2011

I was intending to apply under Tier 1. I meet the earning criteria in place at the time I applied £40k plus iand all other criteria,
I have passed LIUK test as I thought I had to.

However I have only VERY recently become arware that I qualify under HSMP JR and therefore can not apply under Tier 1.
This would have been okay until when in June 2011 I was made redundant.
I am still out of work.
Employment history
Jan 07 - Dec 09 worked for a company, role function transferred to another part of the country so made redudant.
Took time out to spend with 2 dependants.
Sept 10 - Jun 11 worked for a company until made redundant.
Last pay received June 11 (payslip)
Holiday pay taxed and payout not taxed received July 11. I received a Payslip.

I am looking for advice as to what evidence I can provide to support that I am economically active, although not working. Which I know sounds like a contradiction.
I have a good amount of savings and earnings potential is above £40k once I have work.
I am registered with job agencies.

Any advice/ ideas welcome.
I am inteding to do a same day application.

Thank you in advance for your time.

[mk357]

Arrived UK I Oct 2006 HSMP
Extended Tier 1 Oct 2008
Expires 3 Oct 2011

I was intending to apply under Tier 1. I meet the earning criteria in place at the time I applied £40k plus iand all other criteria,
I have passed LIUK test as I thought I had to.

However I have only VERY recently become arware that I qualify under HSMP JR and therefore can not apply under Tier 1.
This would have been okay until when in June 2011 I was made redundant.
I am still out of work.
Employment history
Jan 07 - Dec 09 worked for a company, role function transferred to another part of the country so made redudant.
Took time out to spend with 2 dependants.
Sept 10 - Jun 11 worked for a company until made redundant.
Last pay received June 11 (payslip)
Holiday pay taxed and payout not taxed received July 11. I received a Payslip.

I am looking for advice as to what evidence I can provide to support that I am economically active, although not working. Which I know sounds like a contradiction.
I have a good amount of savings and earnings potential is above £40k once I have work.
I am registered with job agencies.

Any advice/ ideas welcome.
I am inteding to do a same day application.

Thank you in advance for your time.

You could show the job applications that you have sent out and interview calls if you have received any. But I am guessing that it shouldn't be much of a problem, in worse case it would goto the policy team or SEO for a decision, any interview calls would help at that stage.

[ptdee]

contact the Inland Revenue and ask for your last 5 years earnings history called i think, SA302 slips.
They will send them out and they prove you are econimically active. YOu don't need to prove that you earn greater than 40K.
I did this last week and got my ILR.

[daisysdream2]

Thanks Ptdee. The HRMC tell me that the form number you quoted is only for those people who do self assessments. Which I do not have to do.

HMRC are going to send me a letter for a couple of pieces of information that I am missing.

In my mind the objective of economically active should be to show that the applicant has/can provide for themselves/dependants and has been/intends to work. Not whether someone is working at the moment of their application, because when the applicant arrived under HSMP they more than likely do not have a job. However I fear that it is not interpreted the way, hence my concern.

If I have P60 and P45's for the periods I was working do others on the forum think this will help indicate economic activity sufficiently,even though I am not working at the moment?

Thanks.

[khalidmirza]

In JR of Apr 2008 (detailed judgement) judge acknowledged that economic activity is employed/self employed or TRYING FOR JOB(several job applications/interviews/refusals etc).
But to be on safe side you should immediately register with HMRC for self employment and can do so 3 months backdated, means pay class 2 insurance which is 10 pounds a month. This will help you. Keep genuinely trying for employment or getting some small contracts showing economic activity. Under JR you do not have to meet income criteria but preferably be earning something either as employee or self employed

[daisysdream2]

Thank you kahlidmirza. Is the JR of April 2008 detailed judgement a different document to the detailed policy document?
If so, is there a link to this detailed judgement anywhere that I have overlooked?

[khalidmirza]

Thank you kahlidmirza. Is the JR of April 2008 detailed judgement a different document to the detailed policy document?
If so, is there a link to this detailed judgement anywhere that I have overlooked?

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2008/664.html

Item 12
In connection with an extension application, the 2003 guidance stated as follows:
"You will be expected to have been economically active in the UK in employment, self-employment or a combination of the two for at least some of the time within the twelve month period before you apply for further leave to remain. If you have been unable to put your business or employment plans into operation we will expect you to provide evidence (e.g. several completed job application forms or a business plan) that you have taken all reasonable steps to become economically active in the UK and what steps you are currently taking".
It can be seen that, despite the hope and expectation and intent on both sides that the chosen field of employment would be taken up, it was accepted also that circumstances might prevent that occurring within the first 12 months and, so long as reasonable steps had been taken, that would not prevent an extension being granted.

[daisysdream2]

i have just olcated that judgement document on the internet not long before you posted.

My interpretation of point 12 is for those applying for FLR - ie an extension. However I am due to apply for ILR in a couple of weeks when my visa expires. This judgement appears to reiterate that for ILR the applicant must be economically active at the time of applying.


Point 14 states
From April 2003, the HSMP was enshrined in the Immigration Rules (see HC 583, rules 135 A-H). The rules made clear that the entry criteria were appraised once and for all. The general requirements needed to be satisfied on an ongoing or continuing basis. Both an extension of leave and settlement required ongoing satisfaction of self-sufficiency and migrational intent. But it is to be noted that to obtain settlement there were additional requirements in connection with the lawful economic activity.

Whereas for an extension of leave to remain to be granted the applicant needed to have taken "all reasonable steps to become lawfully economically active" (rule 135D(ii)), [/b]
for the ultimate indefinite leave to remain the applicant needed to be at the time lawfully economically active (rule 135G(iv)).
I can't believe it I have done nothing wrong throughout my five years and have adhered to all points of the law. It appears I will not be eligible just because I was made redundant with 3 months to go. If I could apply under Tier 1 I would be fine. Which seems to be a mockery of the system as it is supposed to be easier under HSMP.

I have 2 children I can't believe this is happening .I suppose I can be thankful I discovered this last week before I applied.

I am considering setting up a limited company. Do you think that I could say I ws selfemployed that way as a director? Although I have no work lined up and not likely to within the next couple of weeks.

I appreciate you taking the time so any ideas welcome.

[khalidmirza]

i have just olcated that judgement document on the internet not long before you posted.

My interpretation of point 12 is for those applying for FLR - ie an extension. However I am due to apply for ILR in a couple of weeks when my visa expires. This judgement appears to reiterate that for ILR the applicant must be economically active at the time of applying.


Point 14 states
From April 2003, the HSMP was enshrined in the Immigration Rules (see HC 583, rules 135 A-H). The rules made clear that the entry criteria were appraised once and for all. The general requirements needed to be satisfied on an ongoing or continuing basis. Both an extension of leave and settlement required ongoing satisfaction of self-sufficiency and migrational intent. But it is to be noted that to obtain settlement there were additional requirements in connection with the lawful economic activity.

Whereas for an extension of leave to remain to be granted the applicant needed to have taken "all reasonable steps to become lawfully economically active" (rule 135D(ii)), [/b]
for the ultimate indefinite leave to remain the applicant needed to be at the time lawfully economically active (rule 135G(iv)).
I can't believe it I have done nothing wrong throughout my five years and have adhered to all points of the law. It appears I will not be eligible just because I was made redundant with 3 months to go. If I could apply under Tier 1 I would be fine. Which seems to be a mockery of the system as it is supposed to be easier under HSMP.

I have 2 children I can't believe this is happening .I suppose I can be thankful I discovered this last week before I applied.

I am considering setting up a limited company. Do you think that I could say I ws selfemployed that way as a director? Although I have no work lined up and not likely to within the next couple of weeks.

I appreciate you taking the time so any ideas welcome.

Thank you for hard work to point out clauses of judgement. Under the circumstances I will suggest that you become a contractor for which the only requirement is registration as self employment and that too back dated three months. Contractor are self employed and can do any kind of job and you need a letter from accountant saying that he would be dealing your taxes and accountants and you need to show 2 proof of your income.
In my opinion ILR under JR is more preferable than on Tier 1 as JR cannot be changed where as Tier I is not very reliable. Who knows tomorrow there are further restriction on Tier 1. Limited company is a long procedure and needs detailed accounts of company and need contracts you undertaken etc etc

[fora]

Setting limited company u will not be a self-employed.U will be an employee.
If u register yourself as a sole - trader u will be a self employed.
I remember when i registered myself as a sole-trader,it was a very easy and quick,just ring to HMRC and they will send u a welcome letter,nothing else.u will have to pay IN class2-10-11 pounds monthly

[daisysdream2]

I was deemed ineligible for ILR as I was not working at the time of my application. I spoke to an advisor about this and they received confirmation from the UKBA.

Instead I was able to apply for and was granted a two year extension. So my eligibility to apply for ILR will begin once I am in work again. Although I think I will wait a few months in order to show payslips.

[fin36]

Was your ILR application rejected at the PEO which prompted you to apply for FLR?

[daisysdream2]

No, I got clarifiation from the advisor and the UKBA that to be economically active I had to be working or self employed. I didn't have time to show that I was economically active through self employment, ie clients invoices, receipts etc.
Additionally I work in a profession that is bound by a code of ethics and I am not prepared to do anything that might suggest anything unethical and risk being unable to work in that type of work.

I paid the advisor a lot for what in the end was a straightforward extension. However I did get a definitive answer, finally. There was contradictory advice which really is all over the net once you start googling, if the correct phrasing is used. The first lawyer I spoke to had informed me I was ok not working and thus I took it easy over the school holidays only for me to question what I was told just a few weeks before I had to apply. I just didn't have enough time to find the right work. I am glad I trusted my instincts, but regret perhaps speaking to the first advisor as maybe I would have found something if I had not had that advice.
In the end it was better than applying and paying for ILR at PEO only to have it rejected and then have to pay again for FLR and perhaps lose out on time and risk my visa expiring (only 1 week) and now I can say I am able to work. Once I am working again I can then apply for ILR.

An expensive exercise but the alternative.........