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Home Office asked for Further Documents plz help

Archived UK Tier 1 (Post-Study Work) points system forum. This route no longer exists.

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luckylondon
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Home Office asked for Further Documents plz help

Post by luckylondon » Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:02 pm

Recntly i had applied for PSW and successfully did my Biometric as well but today i received letter from Home office requesting further documents as P60.

In 2007 i applied for HSMP and it was refused bcz they were not able to verify the company. so i keep on extending my student visa but when now i applied for PSW they asked me about P60 for that time period. which i dont have and cant even provide them.

so could you please suggest me what should i do now...

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:27 pm

Please someone help ...wht would be result iif i dnt have P60 or if say them that i not able to provide them...would they return my application back....any guess guys

geriatrix
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Post by geriatrix » Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:41 pm

Perhaps P60 is being asked for because they suspect you of "overworking" while in UK as a student?

Post what the letter exactly states, for others to understand what all documents are being asked for, and why?
Life isn't fair, but you can be!

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:50 pm

Home Office letter states...

Thank you for your Tier 1 Post study work application, which is currently under consideration. However before a decision can be reached on this case, I require some further information. Please provide your P60s for the tax year 2006/2007 and 2007/2008 showing your earnings from xxxx(company).

geriatrix
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Post by geriatrix » Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:01 pm

Looks like it could either be overworking on student leave or use of deception in the earlier HSMP application. But that's just me guessing!

If you do not have P60, you may enquire from HMRC if they can provide you with statement of earnings for the two financial years in question. If they can and when you have them, send them to UKBA with a cover letter that you are providing alternate documentary evidence(s) from HMRC as you no longer have P60s in question in your possession.
Life isn't fair, but you can be!

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:08 pm

I really cant provide them bcz i was not working for that company..it was just to get an Hsmp for that period...even i was refused bcz they were not able to verify the company.....so i keep on extending my student visa...

So whats the altenative way for this problem ..plz help i am so tensed

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Post by geriatrix » Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:16 pm

luckylondon wrote:I really cant provide them bcz i was not working for that company..it was just to get an Hsmp for that period
So you did use deception!! ... that, it seems, UKBA now wants to get to the bottom of.

There is no solution for deception ... other than being ready to face the consequences. So, inform them that you do not have the said documents in your possession ... and wait for their response / outcome of your application.
Life isn't fair, but you can be!

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:24 pm

I have alrdy repplied them that i dnt have desired documtns asked by them.
But what kind of consequences could be there....

1. could they inquire the HRM
2. Could they send my application back
3. or what else

But what the link between that time HSMP application and now PSW...even if i had fulfill all the required points for PSW.

bobobo
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Post by bobobo » Sat Oct 01, 2011 1:06 am

HO will conduct checks on the document you send them to check validity. If this is deception, then the application for PSW will be refused, even if you tried to deceive the HO on earlier occassions they can always refuse the application.

If HO have the NI Number they can always check the tax and NI contributions with HMRC anyways,just makes it a lot easier if you send p60 or wageslips. They verified my information when i didnt have payslips for 6 months, but just a letter from the Employer

luckylondon wrote:I have alrdy repplied them that i dnt have desired documtns asked by them.
But what kind of consequences could be there....

1. could they inquire the HRM
2. Could they send my application back
3. or what else

But what the link between that time HSMP application and now PSW...even if i had fulfill all the required points for PSW.

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Post by Greenie » Sat Oct 01, 2011 8:42 am

luckylondon wrote:I have alrdy repplied them that i dnt have desired documtns asked by them.
But what kind of consequences could be there....

1. could they inquire the HRM
2. Could they send my application back
3. or what else

But what the link between that time HSMP application and now PSW...even if i had fulfill all the required points for PSW.
see general grounds of refusal particularly para 322(2)

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Sat Oct 01, 2011 10:32 am

But there could be some way...some ray oh hope

Greenie
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Post by Greenie » Sat Oct 01, 2011 12:31 pm

luckylondon wrote:But there could be some way...some ray oh hope
not likely.

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:33 am

Home_Office Replied as

However I am unable to complete this case without some further information. As on xxx date applied for HSMP and claiming earnings of £29,860 from xxx company while on student visa.

Now i wish to verify those earnings and check that he has not in breech of his student visa which limited his employment. Therefore please provide the following .....P60 for tax year 2006-2007 and 2007-2008 showing earnings and tax paid.

Your client should request copies from HRMC or statement of earnings for those tax years.

Could you please suggest me..now what next ? what should I do ?
Please help me out...

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Post by madona587 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:20 pm

I don't think you have many options. Maybe you should come out clean and tell HO what happened and hope for the best ? I know this is not the best advice, Clearly you tried to deceive HO now you're caught and then now you're asking how to further "cheat" the system in this forum ? I don't think you will get any ideas from anyone here. Maybe speak to a solicitor ?

Also I know someone who got into TIER1 General via PSW but he deceived HO with his PSW application. Later HO discovered this and they revoked his TIER1 Status, He had to go back and he also face a ban I think :? I'm not trying to scare you but you're most likely in trouble.
In three words I can sum up everything I've learned about life: it goes on :)

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Post by Greenie » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:39 pm

there is nothing that anyone can suggest that it going to get you out of this mess you have got yourself in.

You can either

1) tell the truth and be refused on general grounds due to previous use of deception
2) tell them you can't provide the evidence in which case they may refuse you for the same reason if they find out for themselves that you previously lied, or alternatively, they may refuse you due to failing to provide them with evidence to establish your claim.

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Post by ScopeD » Thu Oct 20, 2011 10:00 pm

luckylondon wrote:But what the link between that time HSMP application and now PSW...even if i had fulfill all the required points for PSW.
I am very concerned that you do not see the connection between PSW and HSMP, and obviously that is how you ended up in this situation. If you look at Sushmehta's initial responses even before you explained the case in full, he was already showing signs of suspicion because something was looking not very straight with your PSW. It was just obvious that something was not adding up.

The problem is; you seem to think that your PSW should not suffer as a result of your fraudulent HSMP simply because the other is HSMP (and is a few years old) and the other is PSW. No, the system is linked. The point is that
1. everything you said 4 years ago should still be verifiable and that anyone checking your records should be able to see the audit trail from your past to your present circumstances. Obviously UKBA have not been able to connect your past to your present, hence the questions by caseworker

2. you should never ever ever ever lie with anything, especially if you want to be professional. Tomorrow you will wake up and forget how you lied, and then you will be found out (and as a verifiable fact, you have been found out by UKBA).

Whatever application you lodge with them, whatever information you provide them with, every entry to the UK, information about who your dependants are, their ages etc, it is all on record. Should there be discrepancies, a caseworker is bound to question such discrepancies. So there is your connection. Otherwise if they did not connect all the dots, the whole system would be meaningless.

Whatever the outcome of your situation, I hope you will learn from this experience to never repeat this again wherever you go in the world, otherwise you will always be in a mess due to use of fraudulent documents.

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:42 am

Thx scope D...for your kind information.

But 2006-2007 was a time for HSMP...who evr applied most probably got it..even many of my friends got approval within weeks but unfortunately i was rejceted. Even many got extension after that.

Settling here not easy task...everyone had got through different situations and procedures. Anyways...now how shuld i handle this problem, i cant smiply giveup or tell them truth..they dont have mercy.

1. shuld i tell them i worked only in my holidyas or summer vocations.
2. Student visa breach is only if they found evidence that i worked more then 20hrs.
3. Nowhere it is written that student cant earn above this particular amount.

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Post by Greenie » Fri Oct 21, 2011 7:48 am

So you are going to continue to lie in this application and thus use deception again?
They are not interested in you telling them you only worked 20 hours a week during term time. They want evidence which you can't provide. To be honest they have probably worked out that you lied before and are trying to get evidence of this.

There are not many people on this forum who are going to try to help you to lie. Why don't you speak to your friends who all managed to get hsmp?

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Post by geriatrix » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:24 am

There is no doubt that there is use of deception in this case, even if it is assumed that we (the people responding to your queries) are the fools here - that you earned close to 30K in a year when working only 20hours a week, and that those are the only earnings that you based your HSMP application on! Wake up - it's time!!!

The only advice possible - to provide UKBA with evidences that they are asking for to verify your claims or admitting use of deception - has already been provided!

There is no further advice that can be offered on the forum. If you wish further advice on the matter, consult a solicitor.
Life isn't fair, but you can be!

ScopeD
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Post by ScopeD » Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:30 pm

But 2006-2007 was a time for HSMP...who evr applied most probably got it..even many of my friends got approval within weeks but unfortunately i was rejceted. Even many got extension after that.
I disagree with you. Two of my friends got approved in this period, but that was also because they had submitted genuine information which was easily verified as true by UKBA. But to say "everyone" who applied got HSMP is an over-statement. I didn't waste time trying to apply with fake documentation at that time because I simply did not qualify. So I concentrated on doing what I was capable of - I worked on convincing one employer in the UK that I could add value to their company, and they applied for a work permit for me.
Settling here not easy task...everyone had got through different situations and procedures.


Probably the only statement I agree with. I too have had a fair share of settling up problems. Came in under a one year's work permit, and at the end of that one year, i was made redundant (credit crunch). Switched to Student for a few months but fortunately my one year had given me enough earnings to claim sufficient points under Tier 1. So while attending my MSc course (which I religiously attended in order to compy with my Student Visa conditions, but mainly because I personally wanted to obtain both my degree and a better immigration status in the correct way), I lodged an application for Tier 1 (General). My previous employer who had made me redundant was able to verify everything. Things were tight, but I got through by making honest representations to the UKBA. I was granted my Tier 1 after being on a student visa for 3 months. I still completed my MSc 10 months later. Even if the UKBA asks me to prove whether I was a genuine student at that time, I have the degree certificate to show them (even though this came after I was now on Tier 1)
Anyways...now how shuld i handle this problem, i cant smiply giveup or tell them truth..they dont have mercy.
I suggest that you start by accepting that your deceit was wrong and cannot be justified. If you continue to justify this unprofessional approach, you will give the British public an excuse to lable every other hard-working, honest, and progressive immigrant professionals/students who have shown good track records as dishonest people. This is not true.

The second thing you need to do is to stop soliciting for more ideas to further deceive the UKBA. No straight-forward professional/students will know how to help with this plan. Personally, if I were in your situation, I would either own up or approach a solicitor with my story. Covering up is the worst sin you can ever commit, and personally in my own heart, I would not feel comfortable so doing. However, the choice is yours to make.
1. shuld i tell them i worked only in my holidyas or summer vocations.
I have already explained to you in my first post how everything is easily traceable. If you worked on holidays only, how would you justify earning over £29k as a student??? In 2007 when I was a newly qualified accountant (before I went for my MSc course), the company that did the work permit for me paid me £28k as a full time employee. My friend, also newly qualified at that time earned £32k, and a third friend earned £26k. How will a student justify earning £29k over the holidays only??? Either you are over-working as suggested by Sushmehta above, or you really must have a special skill for which an employer is willing to pay high wages. I think not. I would go by Sushmehta's assumption that the caseworker will suspect that you over-worked. This is because they are not fools, they will use the formula 1+1=2 and again, they will find you out.

2. Student visa breach is only if they found evidence that i worked more then 20hrs.
With the lies you are planning to contort, they will eventually find this evidence, and they are likely to find more than just the over-working. You really don't wanna be found with a printing press that churns out fake payslips and company letter-heads etc.
3. Nowhere it is written that student cant earn above this particular amount
Yes, true - it is not written anywhere, but how are you going to justify your earnings in light of my comment above, that as a newly qualified accountant, I earned only £28k in 2007, and you as a student earned 29k??? Are you a Highly Skilled Student???

luckylondon
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Post by luckylondon » Fri Nov 04, 2011 3:30 pm

With God grace....i got approval letter today, Biometric card will come in next few days.

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Post by geriatrix » Fri Nov 04, 2011 4:20 pm

The question then is - did you lie / deceive again ..... or told the truth for a change?
Life isn't fair, but you can be!

sparta
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Hi Lucky London,

Post by sparta » Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:51 am

You really is a lucky guy! lol..by the way how did you solve your problem. I saw your posts previously and I thought that was the worst situation every student can have. A suspicion of overworking whilst you are on your student visa, by declaring you had an annual salary of £20K plus to qualify for the HSMP. So, how did you do it? Personally I thought you were on a dead end at that moment. Please satisfy my curiosity. Thank you.

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