5 years for ILR rule implemented

[olisun]

people who already got the 3-4 yr extension and who will be able to complete the 5yrs for ILR, will not be effected in terms of having to resubmit the application.

But whether they will be allowed to apply for ILR after 5yrs is another question

[jayj]

But whether they will be allowed to apply for ILR after 5yrs is another question

This is what I'm querying or whinging about cos if we live here law abiding follwoing the rules of the WP/HSMP waiting for ILR and they decline on what bounds?

1.Bounds on a restrospective rule HO implement for existing WP/HSMP holders.
2.Bounds on rules like the point system for existing holders.

How can faith be put into HO when it puts in rules so belligerent and they wonder why people live here illegal , why fraud gets done, why illegal immigrants were working for HO....makes you think....doesn't it...The fish rots from the head !

[alfabeta]

I said it before, there is nothing that we can do to change the situation....by the time any judicial review ends and we get a result it would be too late anyway.....but mark my words: I will meet them in the voting polls in two years.....no one linked with this government will ever get my vote, nor my wife's vote not anyone of my descendants...plain and simple if we all do this this will change the whole balance of power...
Look at the US where the immigrants from mexico and latin america are now the ones who provide the desicion and provide the last points to make or break a new government...
The beauty of a democracy is that my voice may not be heard, MPs may not do anything about my complains, ministers may dismiss my plead and laugh when I stand in front of the parliament with a few HSMPs....but one day my vote will cost them their job, my vote will keep them out of office and my vote will ensure that they will never commit this abuse against defenseless people.... any migrant abused by this government should remember this: WHO WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR YOU LOSING ONE YEAR OF YOUR LIFE? TEACH THAT TO YOUR CHILDREN AND MAKE THE CURRENT GOVERNMENT PAY FOR THEIR ACTIONS TROUGH YOUR VOTE!

The VBSI should sponsor a more political approach, legal, open, democratic....lets never forget what they did, let's ensure they are removed from office using the democratic tools provided to us....then, they will listen!

[tvt]

This is just a piece of cake compared to the new changes that will apply to settlement. As I wrote in this forum eight months ago many migrants currently on WP / HSMP would not qualify for settlement.

[t4m52]

" Indefinite leave to remain for a work permit holder


134. Indefinite leave to remain may be granted, on application, to a person admitted as a work permit holder provided:

(i) he has spent a continuous period of 5 years in the United Kingdom in this capacity; and

(ii) he has met the requirements of paragraph 128 (i) to (v) throughout the 5 year period; and

(iii) he is still required for the employment in question, as certified by his employer. "

I think the changes do not apply yet to apply for ILR ( the point based system)

The above is taken from the ind website for full rules see below link

http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/lawand ... ules/part5

[jayj]

This is just a piece of cake compared to the new changes that will apply to settlement. As I wrote in this forum eight months ago many migrants currently on WP / HSMP would not qualify for settlement.

TVT, when do you think thes rules will be in place asI was chatting to a solicitor and he said that the point system for ILR , Naturalisation shall be in 2008. Are you making reference to this change in 2008?
What are the new changes expected , if you know? What about 2007 , any rules we should be aware of?

[rg1]

The HO simply wants to suck the youths of developing world!

Many young people from India and similar countries will qualify under new HSMP rule. BUT, when it comes to renewing their FLR, their age will increase and unless they earned a fortune in UK, they won't qualify again. So, they will have to leave UK.

Because of huge population in Asia/Africa, this trend will continue....

UK will continue to get very cheap young labours from developing world who will come with a dream, then will work for peanuts and will leave empty handed.

Home Office is liar.... UK govt. is liar. They are dearly beloved... why not implement point criteria for EU countries??? (because they are white) They don't want highly skilled migrants
HSMP = Horrible Slavery & Misery program!

Now don't ask the stupid question that "why did you come here?" The answer is "because you promised something good."

Ask those people how will they feel when...

...they take their car to manufacturer for repair and were told "if you don't like our car why did you buy it?" (forgetting the warranty they offered while selling)
... if their insurance refuses to pay after fire destroys their home, "well, I told you we shall pay for damage for accidents, but now we changed our policy, so we won't pay anymore".
... your son scored B grade in exam, but pass mark was raised to grade A, so your son receives a Failed grade, won't you cry then?

A PROMISE NOT KEPT IS CALLED CHEATING.

[first2last4]

Now don't ask the stupid question that "why did you come here?" The answer is "because you promised something good."

Ask those people how will they feel when...

...they take their car to manufacturer for repair and were told "if you don't like our car why did you buy it?" (forgetting the warranty they offered while selling)
... if their insurance refuses to pay after fire destroys their home, "well, I told you we shall pay for damage for accidents, but now we changed our policy, so we won't pay anymore".
... your son scored B grade in exam, but pass mark was raised to grade A, so your son receives a Failed grade, won't you cry then?

A PROMISE NOT KEPT IS CALLED CHEATING.

Very well phrased. Unfortunately supporter of this 1 sided HO policy will turn a blind eye because eventually they ONLY care what are they benefiting from irrespective of the fact that they acheive this by CHEATING.

[hvac2006]

" Indefinite leave to remain for a work permit holder


134. Indefinite leave to remain may be granted, on application, to a person admitted as a work permit holder provided:

(i) he has spent a continuous period of 5 years in the United Kingdom in this capacity; and

(ii) he has met the requirements of paragraph 128 (i) to (v) throughout the 5 year period; and

(iii) he is still required for the employment in question, as certified by his employer. "

I think the changes do not apply yet to apply for ILR ( the point based system)

The above is taken from the ind website for full rules see below link

http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/lawand ... ules/part5

This misunderstanding is not new amongst our friends as some of our friends were of the view that it is only one year and by the time some decision will come we may have completed one year so we dont need to bother about it. Similarly now we think that we are not affected by these latest changes as it only applies for extension and not for ILR, if they can apply this for extension they can apply it for ILR. Again we are misunderstanding HO intensions, Look at timing HSMP was started in Jan 2002 so till Apr 2006 hardly anybody qualified for ILR, than they extended one year the intention is same nobody must be able to qualify for ILR, this one year is transitional period in which they will ensure that most of us must not qualify for ILR. This change in extension is only second step, the real change for which this one year was taken is ILR which I think will be enforced before Apr 2007 and most of us will not be able to qualify for it. This looks the actual government plan behind all this, and if still we want to close our eyes like pigeon done who saw the cat, than nobody will be able to save us from real trouble. We must be united and should fully support legal battle as we exhausted all other means i.e. negotiation, this time we should not waste even a single day in thinking.

[badhorse]

Highly skilled Slave Trading Scheme?!

For those who think they can just wait for one more year and get ILR. Stop dreaming! You are likely to be once again hit if you don't act now! Support the JR and you may keep the right to apply for ILR after 5 years' hard working.

Voting power is nothing. Tories just announced their immigrantion plan. They are not any better. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6130080.stm

After all, it is UK people's government acting in UK people's interest!

Democracy does NOT help immigrants, because they are the minority.

Like it or not, this is how democracy works. Democracy is not perfect, and it can be very ugly for some people like us, and people who suffer even worse in the middle east!

Wake up!

[t4m52]

hvac2006 wrote

Quote................

This misunderstanding is not new amongst our friends as some of our friends were of the view that it is only one year and by the time some decision will come we may have completed one year so we dont need to bother about it. Similarly now we think that we are not affected by these latest changes as it only applies for extension and not for ILR, if they can apply this for extension they can apply it for ILR. Again we are misunderstanding HO intensions, Look at timing HSMP was started in Jan 2002 so till Apr 2006 hardly anybody qualified for ILR, than they extended one year the intention is same nobody must be able to qualify for ILR, this one year is transitional period in which they will ensure that most of us must not qualify for ILR. This change in extension is only second step, the real change for which this one year was taken is ILR which I think will be enforced before Apr 2007 and most of us will not be able to qualify for it. This looks the actual government plan behind all this, and if still we want to close our eyes like pigeon done who saw the cat, than nobody will be able to save us from real trouble. We must be united and should fully support legal battle as we exhausted all other means i.e. negotiation, this time we should not waste even a single day in thinking.

Unquote................
Why dont somebody from VBSI OR Honorable MP Mr Andrew Dismore confirm this with immigration minister or home office if they have any hidden agenda like this or are we being unnecessarly thinking that way.

[badhorse]

hvac2006 wrote

Why dont somebody from VBSI OR Honorable MP Mr Andres D. confirm this with immigration minister or home office if they have any hidden agenda like this or are we being unnecessarly thinking that way.

Why don't you do it?

"somebody from VBSI" is in no difference from you apart from the fact that they have ALREADY input a lot of their time and effort into it!

It is the time to take your own action!

[jayj]

I've just spoken to a solicitor and he says that the point system can be implemented in a WP/HSMP scheme but not in obtaining ILR as it would be far too complicated to get this going. What are thye going to measure you on when obtaining ILR?

1. Currently employed
2.Taxes
3. Criminal offences
4. 5 years on your permit
5. Continued employment with company

If we can provide these things then we can apply for ILR.

This whole thing with HO is really ruining lives and dreams.

I called HO and they don't want to comment on anything or hidden agendas.
All they do is refer to website....

We need a coup!

[badhorse]

No doubt the solicitor can always give you an answer based on this own opinion. You can trust his words by 50%.

But his/her opinion is not the government's opinion as indicated by a series of extreamly rapid actions to date.

[badhorse]

2002 - you get your HSMP;

2006 - you should get your ILR;

2006 March - rules changed to make sure you don't get ILR, and you MUST apply for extension to 2007 March.

2006 Nov - new rules come to make sure a lot of you lose one month's time and have more difficulties in getting an extension;

2007 March - what do you think will happen logically?

The above sequence is just a coincidence? Or,

HO is working hard to ensure as many of us as possible to be kicked out empty-handed.

[jayj]

So badhorse and the rest of you, what do you want to do...it's good informing everyone and gathering views here...but I think it's time for us to form a coup or something....else we've gona be sent back cos HO will not honour their side of teh deal....
HO bloody criminals

[badhorse]

Participate the JR, send our cases to the court, send some money to the lawyer who fight for the case.

Keep smiling when walking on the streets and be nice to your colleagues. Pretent nothing has happened and enjoy the democracy, human rights, fair play and civilisation.

Meanwhile, be very clear: you are an immigrant! Yes, you are. So, you are descriminated until you get your citizenship!

[badhorse]

http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/lawand ... /appendix4

new point system for EXTENSION

Appendix 4
Points criteria needed to succeed under paragraph 135D(ii) of these Rules

QUALIFICATIONS

Points Qualifications (can include equivalent level professional qualifications) Applicants may claim points for only one qualification.
50 PhD
35 Masters degree
30 Bachelors degree

PREVIOUS EARNINGS

Points Applicants whose previous grant of leave to enter/remain under HSMP was for a period of more than 12 months:

Previous Earnings from 12 out of the 15 months preceding the application.

5 16 – 17,999 Pounds Sterling (£)
10 18 – 19,999
15 20 – 22,999
20 23 – 25,999
25 26 – 28,999
30 29 – 31,999
35 32 – 34,999
40 35 – 39,999
45 40 +

UK EXPERIENCE

Points 5 Applicants whose previous grant of leave to enter/remain under HSMP was for a period of more than 12 months:

At least £16,000 of the past earnings for which points have been claimed under the previous points scoring section, have been earned in the United Kingdom.

Points 5 Applicants whose previous grant of leave to enter/remain under HSMP was for a period of 12 months or less:
At least £10,650 of the past earnings for which points have been claimed under the previous points scoring section, have been earned in the United Kingdom.

AGE

Points Age (as at date of posting of application)
20 29 or under
10 30 or 31
5 32 or 33

[rg1]

So, you are descriminated until you get your citizenship!

But under current sets of rules, you will unlikely to qualify for ILR/citizenship ever!

So, discriminated FOREVER.....

[rg1]

Bank of England raised the interest rate to 5%.

Now calculate how much your monthly mortgage payment will go up.

Who do think that if you got ILR or citizenship govt. can't suck you?

[dnicky]

Even the JR route is not yet confirmed in the light of the outstanding decission from High Court. We still are not sure whether the JR proceeding will go through; it is possible that we may keep on relying on JR proceedings and end up in not getting a decission from High Court even to proceed with a legal action. What then?

Is there no other way to defend our rights?

[djbabyboom]

people who already got the 3-4 yr extension and who will be able to complete the 5yrs for ILR, will not be effected in terms of having to resubmit the application.

But whether they will be allowed to apply for ILR after 5yrs is another question

Unfortunately this is wrong. See #19 in HSMP FAQ:

19. I have been working in the UK for 4 years and my HSMP visa is about to expire, can I apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain?

No, the minimum requirement for Indefinite Leave to Remain is now 5 years. You should apply for Further Leave to Remain, which is normally granted for 3 years. You can then apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain as soon as you reach the 5-year qualifying period.

http://www.workingintheuk.gov.uk/workin ... p_faq.html?

Whilst this is, so far, not a problem for me to qualify for yet another FLR, further changes that are yet to come are quite alarming.

[hvac2006]

Today I rang work permit Sheffield office regarding application of these recent changes to the people who are about to complete their four year and need extension for the fifth year. They replied that you we to apply as per new forms and new rules, mean we have to qualify under new point base system to be successful for extension for fifth years. It mean any body whose earning for the past 12 month is less than £32000 will not be able to earn 75 points and his application for extension will be rejected. This is the worst condition that we spend 4 years under HSMP and go back to our home countries as we could not qualify for the fifth year of our HSMP which was not in our initial terms and conditions. This is the worst effect on us due to both the changes in immigrations i.e. Apr 2006 and Nov 2006 which we were not taking seriously initially by saying that it is only one year more to be spend under same conditions.

[Smit]

This is one of the grounds that the Home Office used when implementing the 4 to 5 years ILR requirement:

The change is not regarded as controversial. In order to qualify for settlement after 4 years applicants were required to show that they will remain in employment or viable self supporting activity for the foreseeable future. We are simply asking this state of affairs to continue and to be marked after 5 years instead of four.

I don't see how the above fits in for people on the HSMP scheme applying for a second extension i.e. 1+3+? to get to the 5 years ILR mark, being scored against the new points system.

[tobiashomer]

Smit, I think you are missing the point. The post-7 November Rules do not have to "fit in with" the post-4-to-5 (April 2006) situation. What they have to fit in with is the overall task that Messrs. Reid and Byrne have obviously taken to heart: dramatically and quickly reduce the number of migrants admitted before the political weather turned sour who are granted ILR. If the latest blow does not produce the desired results within the relevant electoral timetable, be prepared for more, and worse. What's to hinder them?

Simple as that. The only constituency caring about whether all this is even remotely fair is us, and we do not even appear as a blip on the radar screen of party politics, jockeying for position, bureaucratic "Yes, Ministering" and spin. All we can do is lie back and think of England..