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Got HSMP but might leave UK - loss of trust in UK!

Archived UK Tier 1 (General) points system forum. This route no longer exists.

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gulgon
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Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2004 11:33 am

Got HSMP but might leave UK - loss of trust in UK!

Post by gulgon » Sat Jan 27, 2007 1:23 pm

I got my HSMP extension for 4 years, but since I had so much stress on these very unfair restrospective changes and tougher immigration procedures for skilled people like us, I am considering to leave this country where illegal immigrants are able to stay as long as they want unless they plan a terrorist attack, and where unskilled migrants can get citizenship without problem with their marriage or dodgey visas and where refugees (all know most of them come here with lies) get full benefits with wrong claims, and where skilled people like us must pay full taxes without any right to claim benefits and always insecure with the stress of further tougher rules on skilled migrants....

I easily got a great job offer from Germany, as I was tackling to prepare my documents for extension. My reason for looking for a job in another country was surely these retrospective rules and the increase of ILR time from 4 to 5 years, so the feeling of insecurity in this country.

I have no more trust in the UK immigration rules. so I might leave the UK soon.

And during my stay here, I can confirm that English are the most ignorant nation I have ever seen. They think they are above-humanity, they are superior than all others, they are snobbish (especially ones in London). If you watched how Jade and her friends have treated Shilpa (Indian girl) in the Big Brothers in Channel 4, you might agree with me. So to speak, I also think social life sucks here.

aj_sp_007
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Posts: 295
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:52 am

hii

Post by aj_sp_007 » Sat Jan 27, 2007 1:38 pm

can you please detail about the illegal ways of entry to uk...it might help lot of people...im from india...ure kind effort could make future of loads of people....may be im wrong but this is the way i think....my emai...ashish_jain27@hotmail.com

aj_sp_007
________
MEXICO CITY HOTEL
Last edited by aj_sp_007 on Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

shockboy2000
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Posts: 291
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:11 pm
Location: wolverhampton

Post by shockboy2000 » Sat Jan 27, 2007 2:26 pm

I find them to be just as friendly as any other nation - YOU just need to make an effort to socialise with them, instead of sitting home watching rubbish like Big Brother.
Its no surprise people might be more snobby/rude in London - it happens in any big tourist city around the world - differences in cultures - more foreign people living there - i would not call the people in London indicative of British people...thats why i chose to live outside of London, to experience the real England.

And what are you whining about anyway? your application was payment exempt. I don't think the Brit govt could do much more to help you...
:roll:

olisun
Diamond Member
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 2:01 am

Re: hii

Post by olisun » Sat Jan 27, 2007 7:48 pm

aj_sp_007 wrote:can you please detail about the illegal ways of entry to uk...it might help lot of people...im from india...ure kind effort could make future of loads of people....may be im wrong but this is the way i think....my emai...ashish_jain27@hotmail.com

aj_sp_007
are you serious? :shock: :shock: :shock:

docitduo
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Posts: 190
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 3:11 pm

Re: Got HSMP but might leave UK - loss of trust in UK!

Post by docitduo » Sat Jan 27, 2007 8:45 pm

gulgon wrote:I got my HSMP extension for 4 years, but since I had so much stress on these very unfair restrospective changes and tougher immigration procedures for skilled people like us, I am considering to leave this country where illegal immigrants are able to stay as long as they want unless they plan a terrorist attack, and where unskilled migrants can get citizenship without problem with their marriage or dodgey visas and where refugees (all know most of them come here with lies) get full benefits with wrong claims, and where skilled people like us must pay full taxes without any right to claim benefits and always insecure with the stress of further tougher rules on skilled migrants....

I easily got a great job offer from Germany, as I was tackling to prepare my documents for extension. My reason for looking for a job in another country was surely these retrospective rules and the increase of ILR time from 4 to 5 years, so the feeling of insecurity in this country.

I have no more trust in the UK immigration rules. so I might leave the UK soon.

And during my stay here, I can confirm that English are the most ignorant nation I have ever seen. They think they are above-humanity, they are superior than all others, they are snobbish (especially ones in London). If you watched how Jade and her friends have treated Shilpa (Indian girl) in the Big Brothers in Channel 4, you might agree with me. So to speak, I also think social life sucks here.
Spend some years in Germany, and you'll have similar words to say for that country as well. :shock:

jagacharaja
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Posts: 140
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:49 pm
Location: UK

Re: Got HSMP but might leave UK - loss of trust in UK!

Post by jagacharaja » Sat Jan 27, 2007 9:08 pm

gulgon wrote:I got my HSMP extension for 4 years, but since I had so much stress on these very unfair restrospective changes and tougher immigration procedures for skilled people like us, I am considering to leave this country where illegal immigrants are able to stay as long as they want unless they plan a terrorist attack, and where unskilled migrants can get citizenship without problem with their marriage or dodgey visas and where refugees (all know most of them come here with lies) get full benefits with wrong claims, and where skilled people like us must pay full taxes without any right to claim benefits and always insecure with the stress of further tougher rules on skilled migrants....

I easily got a great job offer from Germany, as I was tackling to prepare my documents for extension. My reason for looking for a job in another country was surely these retrospective rules and the increase of ILR time from 4 to 5 years, so the feeling of insecurity in this country.

I have no more trust in the UK immigration rules. so I might leave the UK soon.

And during my stay here, I can confirm that English are the most ignorant nation I have ever seen. They think they are above-humanity, they are superior than all others, they are snobbish (especially ones in London). If you watched how Jade and her friends have treated Shilpa (Indian girl) in the Big Brothers in Channel 4, you might agree with me. So to speak, I also think social life sucks here.
While I see what you're trying to say, I have to disagree w/you. People usually leave their home countries for a better life. What they don't realize is that it's not exactly a walk in the park (I'm not saying this specifically for you, you may or may not be one of these ppl.) It's easy for us to say that ppl in the western world have a very narrow perspective, because unlike us, they've never really felt the need to look out of their environment. Of course globalization is changing that, but changes are not to be seen everywhere, because ppl in western world are not exactly keen to see jobs being outsourced to other countries. While this may not be directly related to your post, it certainly does reflect on some of the "snobbishness" you're referring to in your post. Yes, there're all kinds of ppl everywhere on this planet.

As for you pointing out that the ILR time being increased from 4-5 yrs not being fair, I must say, in my opinion the HSMP seems to be quite an easy way of gaining permanent residentship in a western country. When anyone is on any visa there's always uncertainty abt such things. You might feel a bit better by knowing that in the US the same process will take easily double the time it takes in UK. As for illegal aliens getting it easy, well, that's a worldwide problem, not just a UK problem.

While I'm not in UK myself as yet so I certainly can't speak for the rest of what you're taking abt in your post, I can certainly say that what you've written is not exactly specific only to UK. There's all kind of stuff everywhere, all kind of ppl everywhere. And if you're highly skilled enuf to get approved for HSMP *AND* get the extension, I certainly hope you're not naive enuf to make a generalized opinion of a particular country by watching a reality tv show. I'm sure, even if you go to Germany, you'll find yourself finding the same "complaints" abt that country. I'm in fact willing to bet that you might start liking UK more after you go to Germany :-) (No offense for Germans) Good luck to you, whatever decision you make for yourself.

gulgon
Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2004 11:33 am

Post by gulgon » Sun Jan 28, 2007 12:40 am

I think some of wording of my observations about UK was not perfect; I do not hate UK or English people. Of course, it is always socially more challenging to live abroad. What I am saying is that English are ignorant when it comes socialising with you... You are very "other" for them.

Look, I am not stupid to make such an observation just because of a TV show. I made these observations after socialising (and trying to socialise) with 100s of English people and watching/listening many other foreigners.

And shockboy, I am not watching Tv all day like rubbish big brother house, but if u have been here u would not miss that. All the UK discussed if Shilpa's case (when 3 english girls kept bullying and swearing at Shilpa due to her cultural difference in the house) was representative of English outlook to foreigners. If you were here, you cant have missed that. At least, you might have watched a documentary by Channel 4 titled 'Bloody Foreigners' (yes the title is correct)!

I am a very social person, and I am very initiative and interactive with people. But if you are not a native English foreigner like Aussi, kiwi, or american, socialising gets more difficult, as English just don't feel u r one of them. So I suppose u r an aussi, kiwi or american? am I right?

Ok the grass on the other side of the fence is always greener, that is right. But, what I am trying to point out is that UK is socially not as great as the way perceived by foreigners! People especially coming from Eastern countries should keep that in mind, they should know that not a great socially accepting society is waiting for them.

shockboy2000
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Posts: 291
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:11 pm
Location: wolverhampton

Post by shockboy2000 » Sun Jan 28, 2007 7:15 am

yes i am aussie.
and i see two type of people coming to UK: those who come over here and participate in the community, and those who only socialise with people from their home country. And this has nothing to do with what that home country was.

Like i said, if you're going to believe everything you watch on tv (big brother [bullying, not beloved remember] or documentaries called "bloody foreigners"), you are going to have a hard time moving anywhere.

Sure that program wasnt about australia ? aussies love the word "bloody".

UKbound
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Posts: 183
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2006 3:30 pm
Location: London

Post by UKbound » Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:45 am

Inequality does exist in the UK.. but it exists everywhere else too.. When they were installing the satellite TV (shall remain nameless) after I got here, it was right after the issue with liquids on planes, so it was all over the news. The technician made a comment that all the foreigners should just go home. It made me wonder what he thought of me!!! (I'm American).. Funny comment though, since the people involved were born in the UK..

I understand your perspective.. I have also faced some difficulties here, but it's like everywhere else, people have preconceptions, and you need to get past them. In a job a few years ago, I spent a year in Japan, and faced much more overt beloved there. Outside Tokyo there were bars and restaraunts that had signs that said "No Foreigners" and "Japanese only".. Here, it's more hidden, like in most of the US..

Big Brother is an example of the way some people think.. but you also have to think about BB as an example of how the media has manipulated the situation to gain viewers, etc.. They chose to show certain things to emphasize their points and stir up controversy.. And the bottom line is that you can't paint everyone with the same brush.. I know many people in the US that think the same way, but they're not my friends because of their views..

I have friends in the UK, but I also have noticed that it's harder to make friends here.. Of course, it's London.. New York would be the same too... So it's not just the UK.. It's everywhere..

I agree with the earlier comment though.. The UK is very open in terms of their immigration rights, and in allowing people to come here from other nations. It's much more difficult than other places (including the US).. An example - if you overstay in the US and you leave (of your own free will), you will be subject to a 3 or 10 year bar, and you will not be allowed to return until the bar is up.. if you try to return before that, you will be prohibited from returning to the US forever.. Now, that's not legal immigration, the ways to immigrate to the US legally are very limited, requiring sponsorship, family ties, etc.. But the UK has HSMP and other ways to allow people to come to the UK without sponsorship.. I agree that changing the rules without grandfathering in the people here was not the right decision.. but we have to look at the positives and the negatives, and not just concentrate on the bad things..

Germany for immigration might be a solution for you, but it is much harder to get permanent residency in Germany, and citizenship is near impossible (if that's your goal).. The UK still provides a better option..

gulgon
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Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2004 11:33 am

Post by gulgon » Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:24 pm

Shockboy says "i see two type of people coming to UK: those who come over here and participate in the community, and those who only socialise with people from their home country"...

Good observation, I totally agree with you. However, I would like to divide those who only socialise with people from their home country into two groups; one who doesnt make effort (mainly older or very traditional asian women) and the other who makes great effort (young people like me) but face English ignorance. Personally, I have made lots of effort to interact with English people, but almost all of the time, I have not been welcomed.

To give a better example, I want to compare my experience in other countries. When I was in Belgium and Holland, I never felt this kind of ignorance, it was much easier to socialise with Belgians, and even in French, although my French was just intermediate.

And just today my Spanish girlfriend (who is a cabin crew) was complaining how her English colleagues are closed to have friendship with her and why she was dragged to make friends with Spanish or Italians only...

So the point is that young people like us who are making great effort to integrate to English social life are not welcomed by English, so we turn to our nationals or other foreigners.

UKbound, yes you are right UK provides maybe relatively easier immigration paths, and German permanent residence is not easy to get. But I have stopped worrying about residence/work permit isssues, because I am planning to work max 2-3 years more in Europe and go back home when I find a high level position. And I already made a huge progress in 1 year and have been offered a senior position for which work permit issues are just formalities anywhere in the world...

Lastly, dont forget that the EU is planning an EU wide green card scheme and most probably UK will be out. Someone working in Germany might more likely benefit from such EU directives, as UK is always an outsider to the EU immigration policies.

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