EEA2 applying visa where as my wife already married Non-EU

[cdyz5]

Hi.

I obtain my post study work visa in 29th Nov 2010. Mean while I met Lithuania girl and we start dating. she moved into my house where i was sharing a house so she and I shared room. On 10 Jan 2011 we rented our own flat, since from that time we are together and have a 10 month old baby boy. and second baby is on the way some time in March next year 2013.

we have the tenancy agreement since we start living together, bills on our name, council tax, baby birth certificate, and few month ago about 6 month now we both open a joint bank account. Our Islamic marriage certificate as my wife convert into Islam.

now the twist in my story is. My wife got married in Albania in 2006. when they both return to uk after 6 month they break up. with the passage of time she keep asking that guy for diviosore but he never gave her. we wrote a letter to UKBA 17/04/11 and informed them they she's not living with that man and she keep asking for divisoe but he's not giving her. we mention all his details Date of birth, full name, copy of merriage certificate that happened in Albania. UKBA acknowledgment us and said they got all his details and will deal with him. however UKBA said we can not advice us on divorce matter. you we need to discusos with solicitor. however my wife even went to Albania embassy and wrote couple of email we have a record of it as well.

we hire a solicitor some time in sept 2011. but as we dont no where he is living solicitor could not find him. and Judge reject it as judge said we must have to make all the efferts to trace that man. and use the baliffes to trace him. I have all the letter crosspondance that solictor wrote to court and baliffes. and will forward them to UKBA when applying for visa?

now kindly please some one advise what steps shall i take to secure my visa. I spoke few people they said chances are odd and possibility is might i not get a visa. but if UKBA refuse then i have to apply in court on ground of my child basis.

any helpful advise will be much appriciated.

Regards.

[ravii]

Your wife is still legally married with another man as there is no legal procedings for this relation and no court orders so far.it is very strange that how you get Muslim marriage certificate?as your girl friend already in marriage relations with an other man..So your Muslim marriage is illegal according to Muslim law.So if you will apply EEA 2 then it will be refused straight away and will be refused in court as well.

[sheraz7]

I have really great amount of sympathies for you but unfortunately the rules will not allow you until the previous issue has not been resolved as because its intensively complex issue. However, element of discretionary treatment always exist. Besides that generically for unmarried partner visa these proofs are very strong but i am not sure that under your circumstances you can apply it or not. Lets see the perception of other members, gurus, moderators and administrators

[cdyz5]

how about if I wipe out the marriage certificate and apply as living together. The paper i have they cover last 2 year time anyways.

please any help will be much appreciated


regards,

[ravii]

Don't play with fire..this is a legal issue.your girl friend can not sponcer you until she get divorce..once she divorced then you can do any thing.for legal point of view your girl friend is not free,and she is a wife of some one and how UKBA will confirm you as a dependent of EEA national?one women with 2 men at a same time,one is legally husband and other legally boy friend(legally boy friend jf UKBA issue you a Residence card).it is not possible in UK,

[cdyz5]

Thanks ravii for your reply much appreciated. It seems i dont have much option on table. Is there any other way.... i was thinking my son born here can i not get stay on his basis.

solicitors wrote letter and said

"unfortunately, Mr xyz has failed to return their acknowledgement of service to the court.

as such, the next step in your Divorce is to submit a Request for Bailiff sercive so that Mr xyz is personally served with the Divorce Petition and supporting documents by the court Bailiff"

Kind please put me in right direction. could go back home but now i am father so i have to look this situation more carefully.

Regards.

[ravii]

Which nationality your son holds?

[sheraz7]

The only problem with these european and uk laws is that they always need the relevant backup evidence/document for each certain issue. I believe that only albanian authorities can help you in this matter either by tracing this man or under their law issue some notification that your lithuanian girl friend is now free. Still is very confusing because albanian law will involve apart of the ukba normal stupidities.

[cdyz5]

ravii my son born in UK, and we got his birth certificate from UK authorises. my wife/gfriend is Lithuanian. so I class him uk citizen as he born here. if they wont accept (ukba) than i must have to make my son Lithuanian passport. My nationality is Pakistani.

[cdyz5]

sheraz7.... I understand what you saying. we went to Albanian embassy in london last year. they cant help us unless my girl friend husband sign the divorce paper in albanian embassy. I really had stuff time classing him but on luck.

oh yeah forget to tell you once her husband gave her a paper on that paper it says he gave divorce but there is no credibility of the paper its just A4 paper not an official paper of court from Albania. however he wrote office manner.

now stuck middle of no where to go. I dont no what to do.....

[sheraz7]

For being classified british either of the partner should have already got pr (normally after 5 years excercising treaty by eea national). But under lithuanian law either of the partner must be lithuanian for the grant of lithuanian nationality to newly born baby.
One of my friend encounter same issue about its baby nationality and later he knew same truth that i mentioned above.

[cdyz5]

sheraz7.... I am just completely lost. I am sorry so much pressure on me as i have to forward my case on 29th nov this month. My wife/gfriend here in uk since 2002.

my understanding is my son is eligible for Lithuanian passport or either british passport please correct me if i am wrong.

Much appreciated for your time.

Regards,

[sheraz7]

Oh 2002 then yes. She must have received/applied her pr.

[cdyz5]

sheraz7.
she only had e Worker Registration Scheme (WRS) that it. never applied any other application. and already work part time 24 a week.

[ravii]

I fully understand your situation but I don't understand that how UKBA or court can give you a relief..your baby is a steel sold proof of your relation but if court accept your relation then it means that it is legal for women/men to make relations in the presences of marriage(adultery).i believe no court wants to abolish uk family system.No body will like this!So it's better for you to wait until your girl friend get divorced.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

sheraz7.... I am just completely lost. I am sorry so much pressure on me as i have to forward my case on 29th nov this month. My wife/gfriend here in uk since 2002. ,

Has your wife been working in the UK since 2002? Was there any period in which she was not working?

I would recommend professional help in making sure she is finishes getting fully divorced.

I would also suggest you think very carefully before ever considering leaving the country voluntarily, and get professional advice if you ever consider it. If you leave the UK, you may face a long time away from your children and wife until the mess is sorted out. Find a good solicitor who has experience in European free movement cases like this.

[cdyz5]

Yes she is working since 2002. There is no gap when she not worked.
we have a solicitor. Recently solicitor advise that she need to sent a "Request for Personal Service by a Court Bailiff" earlier Manchester County Court District Judge has questioned why we have requested Court Bailiff Service at the same address where your Divorce Petition was sent and returned by Royal mail marked not at this address.

The problem with us is we dont no where he lives. we only have his two addresses. and the other thing I dont understand if he get married in 2006 than must get five year EEA visa. how he extended his visa in 2011?

after your beneficial advice I shall not leave the conunty as I was considering it.

the other last thing is My visa will expire on 29th Nov. dont you thing i am late to find a good solicitor who has experience in European free movement cases.

Waiting for your reply.

Kind Regards.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Yes she is working since 2002. There is no gap when she not worked.

That means you wife has PR. Has she applied for a PR card do you know?

we have a solicitor. Recently solicitor advise that she need to sent a "Request for Personal Service by a Court Bailiff" earlier Manchester County Court District Judge has questioned why we have requested Court Bailiff Service at the same address where your Divorce Petition was sent and returned by Royal mail marked not at this address.

The problem with us is we dont no where he lives. we only have his two addresses. and the other thing I dont understand if he get married in 2006 than must get five year EEA visa. how he extended his visa in 2011?

Good question. Maybe he has left the country? He likely has PR, though he may not yet have applied for it. But it does not matter. And I am sure that you can divorce even if he has disappeared, though it likely takes a bit longer than if he was present and agreed to everything.

after your beneficial advice I shall not leave the conunty as I was considering it.

the other last thing is My visa will expire on 29th Nov. dont you thing i am late to find a good solicitor who has experience in European free movement cases.

How long have you been living together with you wife? When was the first child born? When is the next due?

[cdyz5]

Guru Thanks for quick reply

My wife only had a registration work scheme document. I remember she asked me last year to apply her PR and I didn’t let her do it. Make a great mistake. Even though she came in UK 2002, she still has the ticket when she came first time in UK. Please do advise on this.


Maybe he has left the country? He likely has PR, though he may not yet have applied for it. But it does not matter. And I am sure that you can divorce even if he has disappeared, though it likely takes a bit longer than if he was present and agreed to everything.

No. he hasn't left the country. My wife/gfriend has his number. we rung many time to asked him for divorse. he says he will do that but he never do. just playing with us. Even our Solicitor wrote him email on his facebook. but he's not responding at all. only problem with us as i mention earlier we don't no where he lives. He say one thing and do the others.



How long have you been living together with you wife? When was the first child born? When is the next due?
We met 12 Oct 2010, I have proof of Tenancy agreement, council tax, Bills since 2010 to until this time. My first baby was born 17th Jan 2012. And next is due in early dates in March 2013.
Guru one thing I want to mention. We wrote letter to UKBA on 17/03/2011 and informed that she my wife is not living with his husband and mention clearly that after 6 month he and she broke up. we gave his full name and date of brith to UKBA. And UKBA sent us an acknowledgement letter

[Obie]

Well is the guy in the UK, and is the marriage still subsisting.

The ammended Regulation 2 does not recognise a durable relationship, where those two conditions above are met.

I believe you can argue that the marriage is not subsisting but showing the proof of the divorce proceedings and the attempts that have been made to serve it on him.
With regards to the presence in the UK, you will need to find proof that he is not.

With Durable relationship all factors will need to be considered, including your child , the length of time you have spent together and the best interest of the child.

Even if you fail on the durable partner aspect, they will have to consider the child seperately and if the reject the application, they will give you a right of appeal, which i believe you have a good prospect of winning.

[cdyz5]

Yes I believe he is still in UK. The marriage took place in Albania and from there is got his visa from UK embassy in Albania. Before that he was living UK illegally.
All proves we have is that we made a lot of efforts to trace this man. But unfortunately we couldn’t find him. Even though I believe he’s somewhere in UK.

What i am getting you is that its going to be a very long process. Once i apply my visa they will refuse as the time scale on each individual application is 6 month. According to you they will give me a appeal of right. So i have to fight on the basis of my children.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

My wife only had a registration work scheme document. I remember she asked me last year to apply her PR and I didn’t let her do it. Make a great mistake. Even though she came in UK 2002, she still has the ticket when she came first time in UK. Please do advise on this.

No big deal if she did not apply. She has PR already, she just does not have a card to prove it. Tell her not to throw out anything that she presently has that shows she was working during this time, though there are also other ways of proving it. She should keep the old ticket for a scrap book!

No. he hasn't left the country. My wife/gfriend has his number. we rung many time to asked him for divorse. he says he will do that but he never do. just playing with us. Even our Solicitor wrote him email on his facebook. but he's not responding at all. only problem with us as i mention earlier we don't no where he lives. He say one thing and do the others.

That is so annoying. But it sounds like it just slows things down. You should check with your lawyer before offering, but you could offer to cooperate with his PR application if he assists in fast-tracking the divorce. Without your wife's cooperation, his application will be difficult to do. It might be something which motivates him.

How long have you been living together with you wife? When was the first child born? When is the next due?
We met 12 Oct 2010, I have proof of Tenancy agreement, council tax, Bills since 2010 to until this time. My first baby was born 17th Jan 2012. And next is due in early dates in March 2013.

Since she had PR at the time the children were born, they are British at birth. Have you applied for a British passport already?

Guru one thing I want to mention. We wrote letter to UKBA on 17/03/2011 and informed that she my wife is not living with his husband and mention clearly that after 6 month he and she broke up. we gave his full name and date of brith to UKBA. And UKBA sent us an acknowledgement letter

Actually this likely had no impact on his status in the UK and was probably not useful. But no big down side.

[cdyz5]

@Guru thanks for the replay.
I decided to show/attached her new job contract she started in 28/03/2012 to present time, and her previous job from 30/03/2011 onwards.



That is so annoying. But it sounds like it just slows things down. You should check with your lawyer before offering, but you could offer to cooperate with his PR application if he assists in fast-tracking the divorce. Without your wife's cooperation, his application will be difficult to do. It might be something which motivates him.

Yeah actually it does things down us, we filled divroce case last year sept (2011) and its still in progress. This time lawyer said it wont take more than 6month we are nearly at the final stage. But who know what happen. I did offer him to cooperate for his PR and thing sort out for him so it will be easier for me to secure a visa but as said earlier he just keep playing and always turn us down. I never understand his motivates



Since she had PR at the time the children were born, they are British at birth. Have you applied for a British passport already?

I only had my baby boy birth certificate. Which prove he’s british? But no I haven’t apply for his british passport.


Actually this likely had no impact on his status in the UK and was probably not useful. But no big down side.
Just for our safe side we informed UKBA

The way i am making my case is attaching
Her Job contract letters
Tenancy agreement on both names mine and her
Utility bills mine and her name
Council tax
Baby boy birth certificate
New born baby NHS letter for scan and mid wife appoinments
Solicitors Letters including Request for personal service by a court bailiff, District Judge Court bailiff service.
UKBA letter that we informed and their acknowledgment. Albanian embassy london acknowledgment about Divorce her (my wife) husband not show up to signed the power of attorney.
A letter from her husband he gave her that he gave divorvce to her. But that letter is just in plain A4 paper. And I think there is no creditability however he signed on it and it wrote in official manner. Even I translated into English on Google Translation. Please advise shall i attach his and mention just for safe side I filled my divorce in UK court as he entered in this country on my passport as I am EU citizen?


Republic of Albania
civil office Ballsh
ndermet Mrs. xyz
Mr. Xyz
personate the above demanded gykates / county court Viloria
dated 23/08/2010 to deteriorate in the marital relationship between the type
marital Ballsh reports that two persons mentioned are divorced under
court decision dated 23/08/2010
we can not issue the divorce certificate under section N128881 because personate the above mentioned are not resident in the Republic of Albania




xyz Albanian citizens
xyz Lithuanian citizen
may apply for divorce marriage in the UK
civil branch Ballsh may issue any ID that can be
needed above mentioned citizens
certificate east
certificate family
certificate wedding
civil branch Ballsh under Article 123 of the Penal Code recognizes the court judgment in the UK
date of issue of ID card 16/09/2010



Your advise will be very beneficial and thanks for your time in advance.
Much obliged.
Regards

[sheraz7]

Obie is saying right that you can give evidence of divorce proceedings from your eea g/f side but if you get some kind of notification from albania authorities that every effort has been made to find this person and there is no clue about him dead or alive along with your relationship proofs with eea national can justify that your eea g/f has no link with that albania man. Marriage register office always ask proof about marital status to give marriage permission. UKBA will never help you for searching this man and acknowledgement letter just means that they receive your document/post.
JUST FOCUS ON CONTACTING THE ALBANIA AUTHORITIES AND IF THEY NOT HELP THEN FIND THEIR COMPALINT DEPARTMENT. IF THEY ISSUE YOU ANY NOTIFICATION UNDER THEIR LAW THAT THEY CANNOT FIND THIS MAN AFTER ALL EFFORTS AND REMINDERS AND THEREFORE, THIS MARRIAGE IS INVALID AND NOT EXIST.
THIS MARRIAGE WAS CONDUCTED IN ALBANIA WITHOUT ITS REGISTRATION IN UK SO THE ONLY ESCAPE FOR YOU IS ALBANIAN AUTHORITIES NOTIFICATION.

[Obie]

Yes I believe he is still in UK. The marriage took place in Albania and from there is got his visa from UK embassy in Albania. Before that he was living UK illegally.
All proves we have is that we made a lot of efforts to trace this man. But unfortunately we couldn’t find him. Even though I believe he’s somewhere in UK.

What i am getting you is that its going to be a very long process. Once i apply my visa they will refuse as the time scale on each individual application is 6 month. According to you they will give me a appeal of right. So i have to fight on the basis of my children.

How long ago did they married, and how long have they lost contact.

I suspect the guy is trying to secure his residency, which is why he is avoiding the divorce.

Yes you can apply under durable relationship, and include evidence of your child, and see how this go. Bearing in mind that in applying community law, regards has to be had to the best interest of your child and the treaty rights and human rights of both your child and your partner. This essentially means they will have to consider your child who is an EEA national "interest" as the primary issue.

Your case is not one that can be said to be hopeless, although it would have helped for the divorce to have been in place.