does simple police caution will effect ILR under new rules

[sherjan]

I am on a 5-year work permit. I doubt I can apply for Tier 1 extension.
I also think that the criminality threshold applies to any kind of leave to remain, does not it?
What do you think?

Well.....I do not have much knowledge about WP but I think you would be able to extend you WP if your employer wants you for another 5 years. May be someone else would be able to answer this question.

Yes, it applies to all leave to remain. As it mentioned in the rules.

Do not worry...Worry kills...be positive and think alternatives if it doesn't work out. Every thing is on purpose, look at me rules have changed just 20 days before I apply. Rules could change after one month or two. But what is in your fate you get it, despite all efforts to avoid the undesired results you get into it. So look at brighter side.

[alanwong]

Well.....I do not have much knowledge about WP but I think you would be able to extend you WP if your employer wants you for another 5 years. May be someone else would be able to answer this question.

Yes, it applies to all leave to remain. As it mentioned in the rules.

Do not worry...Worry kills...be positive and think alternatives if it doesn't work out. Every thing is on purpose, look at me rules have changed just 20 days before I apply. Rules could change after one month or two. But what is in your fate you get it, despite all efforts to avoid the undesired results you get into it. So look at brighter side.

Hi Sherjan
You are a very positve man. I totally agree with you and will try to do what as you said.

[alanwong]

I was also Misled by police provided lawyer.

There is message for everyone, please do not accept caution if you are innocent, go to court and prove you are innocent.

Do not worry at all. I will apply with a cover letter for that caution explaining the situation etc. I will let you know very very soon.

Hello, sherjan
How are you? Have you gone through your ILR application?
I am waiting for your good news.

[londener]

Alan,

I am here with a similar problem with yours.
I also got a simple caution on criminal damage.I asked so many solicitors,friends,organisation etc and concluded that they may take this into consideration but there is no law that they can refuse without giving a appeal right so there is less a chance of refusal.
Please be sure the caution I am talking is no court involvement at all.
I am also going to apply very soon but still getting advices .
I am now thinking to get police certificate as per this thread.
I called on this number 08706067766 or 08003898289 asked for immigration information and a lady advised me a simple caution without a court involvement is immediately spent .
Please write here or PM me if you have any information.
Londoner

[alanwong]

Alan,

I am here with a similar problem with yours.
I also got a simple caution on criminal damage.I asked so many solicitors,friends,organisation etc and concluded that they may take this into consideration but there is no law that they can refuse without giving a appeal right so there is less a chance of refusal.
Please be sure the caution I am talking is no court involvement at all.
I am also going to apply very soon but still getting advices .
I am now thinking to get police certificate as per this thread.
I called on this number 08706067766 or 08003898289 asked for immigration information and a lady advised me a simple caution without a court involvement is immediately spent .
Please write here or PM me if you have any information.
Londoner

Dear londener, your message comforts me.
immigration rule 322-1C states
(1C) where the person is seeking indefinite leave to enter or remain:

(i) they have been convicted of an offence for which they have been sentenced to imprisonment for at least 4 years; or

(ii) they have been convicted of an offence for which they have been sentenced to imprisonment for at least 12 months but less than 4 years, unless a period of 15 years has passed since the end of the sentence; or

(iii) they have been convicted of an offence for which they have been sentenced to imprisonment for less than 12 months, unless a period of 7 years has passed since the end of the sentence; or

(iv) they have, within the 24 months preceding the date of the application, been convicted of or admitted an offence for which they have received a non-custodial sentence or other out of court disposal that is recorded on their criminal record.


A simple caution is a kind of out of court disposal that is recorded on a criminal record.


pages 38 and 39 of the link
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary
states that a non-custodial offence will lead to a mandatory refusal.
Note the word mandatory, it is not even discretionary if the offense is less than 2 years old.

Do you not think they can refuse according this immigration rule. Is this rule as effective as law?

I got my police certificate which shows the simple caution (offense is battery). My caution did not involve court and was issued by police directly at the local police station. When it was issued, I was told that it would not affect my indefinite leave to remain application. It was not at that time.

Londener, for your case, when did you get the caution? If it is not within 2 years proceeding to your ilr application date, then it will be OK.
I got my caution by a series of mistakes. I was emotional when i was taken to the police station.
Now I am considering making an exceptional case request to have the simple caution removed. Do you have any idea of it?

[alanwong]

Alan,

I am here with a similar problem with yours.
I also got a simple caution on criminal damage.I asked so many solicitors,friends,organisation etc and concluded that they may take this into consideration but there is no law that they can refuse without giving a appeal right so there is less a chance of refusal.
Please be sure the caution I am talking is no court involvement at all.
I am also going to apply very soon but still getting advices .
I am now thinking to get police certificate as per this thread.
I called on this number 08706067766 or 08003898289 asked for immigration information and a lady advised me a simple caution without a court involvement is immediately spent .
Please write here or PM me if you have any information.
Londoner

Hi, Londoner, before 13th December 2013, a simple caution was not even considered in the assessment of one's good character, conduct and association, however on and after this date, it leads to mandatory refusal of ilr application. This change is too much and is not fair to those who accepted cautions before the rules were introduced.

[alanwong]

Alan,

I am here with a similar problem with yours.
I also got a simple caution on criminal damage.I asked so many solicitors,friends,organisation etc and concluded that they may take this into consideration but there is no law that they can refuse without giving a appeal right so there is less a chance of refusal.
Please be sure the caution I am talking is no court involvement at all.
I am also going to apply very soon but still getting advices .
I am now thinking to get police certificate as per this thread.
I called on this number 08706067766 or 08003898289 asked for immigration information and a lady advised me a simple caution without a court involvement is immediately spent .
Please write here or PM me if you have any information.
Londoner

Hi, Londener, when you say you asked so many solicitors,friends,organisation etc and concluded that they may take this into consideration but there is no law that they can refuse without giving a appeal right so there is less a chance of refusal. When did you asked? If it is before 13th Dec 2012, then it is not valid any more.
You also said you called on this number 08706067766 or 08003898289 asked for immigration information and a lady advised me a simple caution without a court involvement is immediately spent . Did the lady say a simple caution will not lead to mandatory refusal of ilr application if the caution is within 24 months proceeding to the application date?

[londener]

Hi Alan,
Everything were done before the 13th December 2012 .So may be we should call again to the following numbers .
or study further and ask solicitors.
I hope someone senior or fellow who has better knowledge with law interpretation would come here to comfort us.
Thanks
Londener

[londener]

Alan,



A simple caution is a kind of out of court disposal that is recorded on a criminal record.
Do you or anyone here know a better clarification of out of court disposal please ? .



pages 38 and 39 of the link
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary
states that a non-custodial offence will lead to a mandatory refusal.
Note the word mandatory, it is not even discretionary if the offense is less than 2 years old.

Do you not think they can refuse according this immigration rule. Is this rule as effective as law?

I got my police certificate which shows the simple caution (offense is battery). My caution did not involve court and was issued by police directly at the local police station. When it was issued, I was told that it would not affect my indefinite leave to remain application. It was not at that time.

Londener, for your case, when did you get the caution? If it is not within 2 years proceeding to your ilr application date, then it will be OK.
I got my caution by a series of mistakes. I was emotional when i was taken to the police station.
Now I am considering making an exceptional case request to have the simple caution removed. Do you have any idea of it?

In my case it will be just over two years when I will apply for ILR,but any criminal offence if taken into account last for five years to be spent ,as far I know.Could you guide me where does it say a simple caution will be spent after 24 months.May be any other offence rather than a criminal one ??

I had also asked someone solicitors try to remove the caution and he was advised me no one can do it .But I will try to find the information about it further and let you know.
In my case it comes into CRB report but still I am working with CRB related job but providing them the a couple of character references from the community ,so feeling comfortable.
Obviously,caseworker take this into consideration while assesing our application a couple of character reference letter showing that is one off incident along-with CRB report and what action have you taken to address the problem would certainly help case worker not to refuse unless it is clearly defined in the law.
Londener

[alanwong]

In my case it will be just over two years when I will apply for ILR,but any criminal offence if taken into account last for five years to be spent ,as far I know.Could you guide me where does it say a simple caution will be spent after 24 months.May be any other offence rather than a criminal one ??

I had also asked someone solicitors try to remove the caution and he was advised me no one can do it .But I will try to find the information about it further and let you know.
In my case it comes into CRB report but still I am working with CRB related job but providing them the a couple of character references from the community ,so feeling comfortable.
Obviously,caseworker take this into consideration while assesing our application a couple of character reference letter showing that is one off incident along-with CRB report and what action have you taken to address the problem would certainly help case worker not to refuse unless it is clearly defined in the law.
Londener

Hi, Londener, I am quite confident that you are OK with your caution.
The immigration rule regarding 24 months time frame is provided by immigration rule paragraph 322(1C-iv).
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... les/part9/
Now it does not talk about spent. for a simple caution, it is spent immediately.
I did a little research regarding removing the caution, now I realize it is highly impossible. Nevertheless I may try to talk to a police officer.