If one team member applies in UK and other overseas

[Ahmediqbal]

I formed an entreprenural team with my brother in Pakistan and demonstrated access to over £200K in our separate personal bank accounts. I have access to over £25K in a UK bank account, whereas, the second party has access to over £175K in a Pak Bank. Both of us applied in Pakistan and UK on the same day well before 13-12-2012.

Recently, application of my brother in Pakistan has been refused on grounds that he did not provide documents to support his access to third party funding i.e.my share of funds (25K). The refusal surprised us as there was no third part involved and for first and second party there is no need of documentation to support the access to each other as is the case with third party funding. We filed a review and await a decision.

May I request your kind guidence and views on how to handle his refusal even if the review is turned down, how this refusal will impact my case and what is the best course of action for us now?

Thanks

[entreprenuer11]

Although you both are related to each other by blood and are brothers. But the money was held in two different accounts and NOT in a joint account. Therefore, you both are treated as a different party. You both should have included a third party declaration stating that these funds are available to each other. Clearly you havent done that and hence UKBA refuused the application.

I dont think you will win the admin review as there is no error in law. You should make a fresh application with the right documents.

[rehan01]

I formed an entreprenural team with my brother in Pakistan and demonstrated access to over £200K in our separate personal bank accounts. I have access to over £25K in a UK bank account, whereas, the second party has access to over £175K in a Pak Bank. Both of us applied in Pakistan and UK on the same day well before 13-12-2012.

Recently, application of my brother in Pakistan has been refused on grounds that he did not provide documents to support his access to third party funding i.e.my share of funds (25K). The refusal surprised us as there was no third part involved and for first and second party there is no need of documentation to support the access to each other as is the case with third party funding. We filed a review and await a decision.

May I request your kind guidence and views on how to handle his refusal even if the review is turned down, how this refusal will impact my case and what is the best course of action for us now?


Thanks

totally agreed with entrepreneur11 reply to your question this is the only solution in my opinion too.

regards

[rizwan567]

Agree with above answers. Your brother do not stand any chance at all.

For you it is suggested that you supply to UKBA in support of application, a third party letter and lawyer letter as soon as possible to get your application approved. Otherwise you will get a similar refusal.

[esic_sonia]

You should make yourself aware of one thing first of all. In business documentations (as per UK Laws),

Even your family members are THIRD PARTIES. Even if it's your own father, the accord or agreement will be between two different parties. That's how it is. I believe you have made a mistake on this part.

[Sar78]

Don't challenge the judgement; you are unlikely to succeed. Instead, you should reapply and provide the third party documents to fulfill the criteria set by the UKBA.

[esic_sonia]

Don't challenge the judgement; you are unlikely to succeed. Instead, you should reapply and provide the third party documents to fulfill the criteria set by the UKBA.

Yes. @Sar78 is right. Make a new application and make sure you provide proper legal documentations in regards to your new application. And do not rely on your own logic because that indicate over-confidence.

I had one case where one applicant argued with me that if he's using his father's bank statement, he wouldn't need to show birth certificate and affidavit, because passport also show father's name (according to his logic). Now, when it comes to laws and requirements, put your logic aside and follow the pathway of their logic.

[rehan01]

Don't challenge the judgement; you are unlikely to succeed. Instead, you should reapply and provide the third party documents to fulfill the criteria set by the UKBA.

Totally agree with Sar78 and esic_sonia.

Guys I applied psw to tier 1 route and have my funds in joint bank account with my team member (who is my younger brother) and I didn't provide any declaration or any other legal document as per my understanding and discussion with other I been told if money is in joint bank account than you both have equal access to funds and you meet this requirement and you don't need any declaration as no third party involved.

As funds are held in UK bank so I just submitted the bank statement only.

please advise if you think I missed something.

regards

[esic_sonia]

Don't challenge the judgement; you are unlikely to succeed. Instead, you should reapply and provide the third party documents to fulfill the criteria set by the UKBA.

Totally agree with Sar78 and esic_sonia.

Guys I applied psw to tier 1 route and have my funds in joint bank account with my team member (who is my younger brother) and I didn't provide any declaration or any other legal document as per my understanding and discussion with other I been told if money is in joint bank account than you both have equal access to funds and you meet this requirement and you don't need any declaration as no third party involved.

As funds are held in UK bank so I just submitted the bank statement only.

please advise if you think I missed something.

regards

Hi rehan1,

I can assist you in this query.

First of all, refer to Tier 1 - Entrepreneur Policy Guidelines (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... dance1.pdf)

Now, there are two types of funds which you need to provide evidence of, seperately:

1. Maintenance Funds
2. Sponsor Funds (Third-Party funding)

----------------------------------------------------------
1. In Maintenance funds, even if you have a joint account with anyone, as long as you are member of that joint bank account, you do not need third-party signing or documentation

2. Now, refer to point # 96 in Policy Guideline (at page 1 8 ) which state as follow:

Third parties (other contributors of money) may include family members, as well as other investors or corporate bodies

Now, family members are also considered 3rd party. However, in your case, you have sponsor funds in a joint account with equal access and share (in a UK bank) between you and your team member (your brother). Therefore, no legal documentation is required. Generally, Joint account holders have equal access to bank account in the UK.

If, for example, your brother have an account and money in it (alone), and he was sponsoring you, only then you would need documented legal proof.

[rehan01]

Don't challenge the judgement; you are unlikely to succeed. Instead, you should reapply and provide the third party documents to fulfill the criteria set by the UKBA.

Totally agree with Sar78 and esic_sonia.

Guys I applied psw to tier 1 route and have my funds in joint bank account with my team member (who is my younger brother) and I didn't provide any declaration or any other legal document as per my understanding and discussion with other I been told if money is in joint bank account than you both have equal access to funds and you meet this requirement and you don't need any declaration as no third party involved.

As funds are held in UK bank so I just submitted the bank statement only.

please advise if you think I missed something.

regards

Hi rehan1,

I can assist you in this query.

First of all, refer to Tier 1 - Entrepreneur Policy Guidelines (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... dance1.pdf)

Now, there are two types of funds which you need to provide evidence of, seperately:

1. Maintenance Funds
2. Sponsor Funds (Third-Party funding)

----------------------------------------------------------
1. In Maintenance funds, even if you have a joint account with anyone, as long as you are member of that joint bank account, you do not need third-party signing or documentation

2. Now, refer to point # 96 in Policy Guideline (at page 1 8 ) which state as follow:

Third parties (other contributors of money) may include family members, as well as other investors or corporate bodies

Now, family members are also considered 3rd party. However, in your case, you have sponsor funds in a joint account with equal access and share (in a UK bank) between you and your team member (your brother). Therefore, no legal documentation is required. Generally, Joint account holders have equal access to bank account in the UK.

If, for example, your brother have an account and money in it (alone), and he was sponsoring you, only then you would need documented legal proof.

Thanks esic_sonia for your explanation, As I mention before I have followed the policy guidance me and my brother found entrepreneur team and we opened new joint bank account and I transferred funds from my personal account to newly opened joint bank account so we meet the requirement of equal access and save additional documentation. (As you have explained the same thing so I did ok

for my funds I used separate account which is joint account with my wife and I have submitted 2 page 44 of application form as both account I used for maintenance and business funds are joint account one with brother and another one with wife so I signed both pages with one my wife and second one with my brother.

so hopefuly wont be any issue there.

thanks once again

regards

[esic_sonia]

That's good. Don't worry, your application process will be smooth (by the grace of God) You had money in your own account, so no issues as no third-party is involved.

By the way, not many people have access to funds which is why they turn to agents (who charge interest rates on monthly basis)

[rehan01]

That's good. Don't worry, your application process will be smooth (by the grace of God) You had money in your own account, so no issues as no third-party is involved.

By the way, not many people have access to funds which is why they turn to agents (who charge interest rates on monthly basis)

yes you are absolutely correct and they also provide third party funds statement and charge there fees for it. (don't want to go in details about this)

regards