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Updates on Zambrano applications

Use this section for any queries concerning the EU Settlement Scheme, for applicants holding pre-settled and settled status.

Moderators: Casa, Amber, archigabe, batleykhan, ca.funke, ChetanOjha, EUsmileWEallsmile, JAJ, John, Obie, push, geriatrix, vinny, CR001, zimba, meself2

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Prince74
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Posts: 150
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:36 pm
Location: London

Post by Prince74 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:02 pm

kiss300 wrote:@price74

did you add a bank statement?
Yes I did. In terms of documentation, nothing was missing.

wiggsy
Senior Member
Posts: 849
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:59 pm
Location: Warwickshire, UK

Post by wiggsy » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:04 pm

Not required to work... She is the spouse of eea national...

Actions of eea is all that counts... Note 5 years to pr began on dATE OF MARRIAGE IF IN UK WORKING

wiggsy
Senior Member
Posts: 849
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Location: Warwickshire, UK

Post by wiggsy » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:05 pm

Did u include photos etc prince...

Prince74
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Posts: 150
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:36 pm
Location: London

Post by Prince74 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:08 pm

wiggsy wrote:Did u include photos etc prince...
Yes. I've been dealing with the UKBA since 28 May 2010 when an FLR(O) application was submitted to them. In nearly 3 years of my dealing with them, the amount of paperwork that we've provided to them can fill a library.

wiggsy
Senior Member
Posts: 849
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:59 pm
Location: Warwickshire, UK

Post by wiggsy » Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:44 pm

i understand... with our first application we sent about six DVD's of picture files (jpegs) with the application, along with some prints of some of them.

Seriously though, We need some clear guidance as what proves "Dependancy" as I see it: Dependancy is Emotional, physical, financial. the fact that Milik been refused on the basis of not prooving being able to support the children financially its wrong, because they say "purely financial support is not enough" - this means lack of it cant be basis for refusal...

Eddy Montgomery called me, his no for his sheffield office is 0114 207 1434 < took about six listenings of voice mail to get to it... his no is engaged constantly though...

Just actually got through to his office this time...

right, after a short 20 minute conversation... I realise that this man is pretty useless... - Not worth bothering with...

HOWEVER: I do know that Ollie chasing him up on Friday ensured that my wifes passport is now in the post (so thats sorted)...

hes not "sure of the process for finger printing"... (finger prints require IS81 to be issued first. (regardless of if the person is already in the country... failing to issue IS81 renders the action unlawful!)
Suprisingly, the document I gained this information from has been removed from UKBA website, but i have a copy on my PC still (isnt it nice being able to save PDF files...))
it was on this page (cache'd by bing)http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx?q=form+i ... 9LSPJwCAMM
is initiated by issue of form IS 81.
3. What are the procedures when a passenger is informed by
a Border Force Officer that they are required to submit to a
further examination?
A Border Force Officer should advise the passenger that he is required to
submit to further examination by serving the passenger with form IS81. The
form also states to a passenger with continuing leave that this leave has been
suspended and the reasons for examination. Once the IS81 form has been
served to the passenger the Border Force Officer may resume his
examination at any time without further notice being issued. If the examination
is not completed at a subsequent interview the Border Force Officer should
advise the passenger verbally that the requirement still stands. A Border
Force Officer should serve a passenger with form IS81 under the following
circumstances:
1. When the initial examination is interrupted
2. When it is necessary to refer the passenger to the port medical inspector
3. When the examination is commenced during passage (on board a ship or
on a channel tunnel train journey) and is to be resumed ashore/on arrival
in the UK
4. when detention or temporary admission is necessary before a decision to
admit or refuse is reached
5. when a passenger requires fingerprinting
6. when a passenger’s travel document requires examination by a Forgery
Officer
7. when an IO needs to make a back office check.
Failure to issue an IS81 renders the activities listed above unlawful. Every
IS81 issued should be recorded by ports. This information must be captured
in order to accurately reflect the level of work undertaken at ports.
(NOTE: UKBA staff who do house calls are "port staff" and their port is the centre they are from [in our case West Mids]).

I've told the guy in no uncertain terms I want to know the name of the "Arresting officer" as my wife was not informed that she was "detained" or that she was "under arrest" when they called.
- and this goes to reitterate that my wife was unlawfully "examined". I also reitterated that when the guy barged into my home, he broke the law as no warrant had been issued. - (at this point he said he needed to consult with Rob again ... )

He is the head of enforcement for northern england and wales... yet it looks like he is useless in his job? lol...
Last edited by wiggsy on Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mikilo2008
Junior Member
Posts: 96
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Post by mikilo2008 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:45 pm

Hmmm prince that's a long wait. I pray you laugh last in Jesus name amen. Yes I got the refusal letter today. A lot of stories and then in support of your application you submitted ............ There is however insufficient evidence to show that the British citizen child would be unable to remain in the uk or another EEa state if you are forced to leave. You have failed to provide evidence as to why her father is not in the position to care for the child. She appears to have obtained British nationality on the basis that her father is a British citizen and registered her birth with you on .......... And by your own admission had some contact with the child. An unwillingness to assume care responsibility is not by itself sufficient for the claimed primary carer to assert that another direct relative or guardian is unable to care for the British citizen.
.............. Having reviewed your application you have not provided enough evidence to demostrate how you are financially responsible for the child.............stories and then this department is therefore not satisfied that if you we're forced to leave the uk miss ......... Would be unable to remain here another EEa member state. However should you wish to rely on private life established in the uk under article 8 of ECHR. The immigration rules now include provisions for applicants wishing to remain in the uk on the basis of their family private life. It you wish the UK Boarder agency to consider an application on this basis you must make a separate charged application using form FLR(M) for five years partner route or FLR(O) for the 5year parent or 10 year partner or parent route. For more info pls consult our website.............

As you appear to have no alternative basis to stay in the uk you should now make arrangements to leave if you fail to do so voluntarily your departure may be enforced. Your passport is therefore being retained however, should you wish to leave the Uk contact your local immigration team the passport you submitted would be returned when you are leaving the Uk. The local immigration team responsible for your case can be contacted on ...... That's a summary of it. The letter is like 5 pages.

mikilo2008
Junior Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:06 pm

Post by mikilo2008 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:51 pm

I wouldn't be appealing I have being advised by my noble forum members to apply as a spouse of an EEa national so I would be moving to the EEa2 section to seek for help will be doing it myself this time around without the help of a solicitor just wasted my money he did nothing. I believe with the help of my forum members I will get it right this time. Wishing everyone the best. It is well.

Prince74
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Posts: 150
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:36 pm
Location: London

Post by Prince74 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:11 pm

mikilo2008 wrote:Hmmm prince that's a long wait. I pray you laugh last in Jesus name amen. Yes I got the refusal letter today. A lot of stories and then in support of your application you submitted ............ There is however insufficient evidence to show that the British citizen child would be unable to remain in the uk or another EEa state if you are forced to leave. You have failed to provide evidence as to why her father is not in the position to care for the child. She appears to have obtained British nationality on the basis that her father is a British citizen and registered her birth with you on .......... And by your own admission had some contact with the child. An unwillingness to assume care responsibility is not by itself sufficient for the claimed primary carer to assert that another direct relative or guardian is unable to care for the British citizen.
.............. Having reviewed your application you have not provided enough evidence to demostrate how you are financially responsible for the child.............stories and then this department is therefore not satisfied that if you we're forced to leave the uk miss ......... Would be unable to remain here another EEa member state. However should you wish to rely on private life established in the uk under article 8 of ECHR. The immigration rules now include provisions for applicants wishing to remain in the uk on the basis of their family private life. It you wish the UK Boarder agency to consider an application on this basis you must make a separate charged application using form FLR(M) for five years partner route or FLR(O) for the 5year parent or 10 year partner or parent route. For more info pls consult our website.............

As you appear to have no alternative basis to stay in the uk you should now make arrangements to leave if you fail to do so voluntarily your departure may be enforced. Your passport is therefore being retained however, should you wish to leave the Uk contact your local immigration team the passport you submitted would be returned when you are leaving the Uk. The local immigration team responsible for your case can be contacted on ...... That's a summary of it. The letter is like 5 pages.
What a contradiction. Initially they said that financial dependence alone is not sufficient to meet the Zambrano criteria, now they are asking about financial dependence.

wiggsy
Senior Member
Posts: 849
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:59 pm
Location: Warwickshire, UK

Post by wiggsy » Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:32 pm

Prince74 wrote:
What a contradiction. Initially they said that financial dependence alone is not sufficient to meet the Zambrano criteria, now they are asking about financial dependence.
i noticed that before too :)

takes the michael doesnt it;

Well, on this basis, I don't think there is much point in wasting time. I am writing to my Landlord to give notice to quit... and then will begin prep for moving to Ireland. - Getting a tow bar fitted on my car for the caravan next week.

Just need to wait for passport, then apply for new one. - then apply for Irish visa... I doubt that they will say i cant remain in the UK without my wife... despite the obvious facts... so time for a work around... (if anybody knows of any jobs in Ireland, lemme know :P)

mam2
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Posts: 163
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:42 pm

Post by mam2 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:23 pm

Mikilo,
I'm speechless. For a father's name to be in birth cert, he should be present at registration if you are not married. That does not mean he had contact with the child in my case.
Did you state that he had contact with the child but cannot take care of him?
Well,I can only hope and wait. It's sad,very sad. How they support estranged parents to suddenly take of their children,I can't understand.
papa2

kiss300
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Location: United Kingdom
Mood:
Ghana

Post by kiss300 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:30 pm

today i was able to speak to one of ROB'S sec. and the lady was nice to me. i told him abt the refusal of the zambrano and how scarry it is for alot of pple. looking at how long pple will wait only to be refused is dishearten. so she said she will talk to the person dealing with my case to contact me.

mikilo2008
Junior Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:06 pm

Post by mikilo2008 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:37 pm

mam2 wrote:Mikilo,
I'm speechless. For a father's name to be in birth cert, he should be present at registration if you are not married. That does not mean he had contact with the child in my case.
Did you state that he had contact with the child but cannot take care of him?
Well,I can only hope and wait. It's sad,very sad. How they support estranged parents to suddenly take of their children,I can't understand.
All the reasons are dump excuses that are challenge able and will end up in issuance of the card when it gets to court. It's just that has I was advised EEa2 is better so I'm backing off zambrano. The lawyer wrote the covering letter I didn't know what he wrote in it but their response obviously reflected that he made mention about the child's father.

mam2
Member
Posts: 163
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:42 pm

Post by mam2 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:50 pm

He should have given you a copy of the cover letter so you know what's is wriuteb. He wrote in your behalf and not for you. Anyway, EEA2, better. Did u get married iat registry /church here or it was a customary marriage? Proxy as we call it.
papa2

mikilo2008
Junior Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:06 pm

Post by mikilo2008 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:23 pm

mam2 wrote:He should have given you a copy of the cover letter so you know what's is wriuteb. He wrote in your behalf and not for you. Anyway, EEA2, better. Did u get married iat registry /church here or it was a customary marriage? Proxy as we call it.
We got married in the registry with my Coa they called the ukba to verify my identity because i presented the photocopy of my passport and told them that the original is with the home office

Babz
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Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 12:22 pm
Location: UK
United Kingdom

Post by Babz » Tue Apr 23, 2013 3:57 am

mam2 wrote:
sarahassy wrote:
wiggsy wrote:
sarahassy wrote:so sorry to hear this,I have lost energy and become spNo one on this forum has got DRC dIrectly from UKBA.This means their is some thing wrong.eg if your teach students how to work out compound interest, at the end of the year no one pass any question abt compound interest, it means they didn't understand you.If all Zambrano applications are failing there is a prob!
None that I know of. Someone said two people but he did not get back to give their circumstances when we asked him to. We can count on that. We will wait and see.
I believe most of the people working for UKBA at the moment are contract temps they pay £6.50..
I believe what they give them is tick sheet,so if your application/documents don't tick all the boxes, it's a no no...applying discretion has varnished these days..If you watched the Dispatch Immigration Undercover documentary, remember one of the senior staff was telling the new recruits that 'family doesn't exist anymore'..So I'm thinking they are making it difficult for anyone applying for any family related visa.

evie233
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Mood:
United Kingdom

Post by evie233 » Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:01 am

Babz wrote:
mam2 wrote:
sarahassy wrote:
wiggsy wrote: None that I know of. Someone said two people but he did not get back to give their circumstances when we asked him to. We can count on that. We will wait and see.
I believe most of the people working for UKBA at the moment are contract temps they pay £6.50..
I believe what they give them is tick sheet,so if your application/documents don't tick all the boxes, it's a no no...applying discretion has varnished these days..If you watched the Dispatch Immigration Undercover documentary, remember one of the senior staff was telling the new recruits that 'family doesn't exist anymore'..So I'm thinking they are making it difficult for anyone applying for any family related visa.
Exactly babz, this was why I mentioned earlier if anyone watched the programme on BBC 1 last week Monday.. These decisions made on zambrano doesn't make sense to me at all... And if they carry on like this, no one will get the DRC card directly from them , because incompetent temps are now dealing with our cases.. :cry:

kiss300
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Location: United Kingdom
Mood:
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Post by kiss300 » Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:09 pm

anything new going on? any news?

sarahassy
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Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 7:15 pm

Post by sarahassy » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:30 pm

kiss300 wrote:anything new going on? any news?
I don't understand this, people who made applications in 2013 got COA and decisions of refusal are being made. some of us applied in 2011 our applications are put in safe.

sarahassy
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Post by sarahassy » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:35 pm

How long does it take for Rob to reply e-mails?

mam2
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Post by mam2 » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:55 pm

The Secretary told me today that there is no time limit on when to reply to our emails. But once they hear back from the caseworker, they will reply.
papa2

kiss300
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Post by kiss300 » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:18 pm

really it is surprising how pple who made application this year have receive their decisions but pple who made theirs 2 and 1 year ago have not heard anything only if you have to call or send email to ROB before you hear anything. its absurd and its not fair at all

kiss300
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Location: United Kingdom
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Post by kiss300 » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:27 pm

@babz

what reason did they give for refusing you ? if you can share. thanks

wiggsy
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Post by wiggsy » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:29 am

i agree, remember: ALL CASES ARE DEALT WITH IN A STRICT DATE ORDER

(except when the applicant/spouse/etc begins to bother us, and we decide to amend that policy as we see fit)

I dare say that they realise my wifes case is going to cause extensive amounts of extra work by not expediating it... I do intend to leave a little treasure trove of info - once UKBA pull their finger out and respond promptly though... (I do believe that I'm asking some of the correct questions on my FOI requests though... because they are either being ignored entirely, or cancelled or well... not replied to...
I've got about eight complaints with the ICO going on, but from what Ive read, complaints can take 3 or 4 years to resolve via the ICO... :S

kiss300
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Post by kiss300 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:29 am

still havent heard from them still after the caseworker contacted me that it will be ready in a few days time.

wow is hard to wait sometime

Babz
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Location: UK
United Kingdom

Post by Babz » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:46 am

kiss300 wrote:@babz

what reason did they give for refusing you ? if you can share. thanks
Mine was EEA2 application.The reasons given were;

1.I need to submit an INDEPENDENTLY AUDITED BUSINESS BANK ACCOUNT detailing the trading activity of the company.
2.Evidence of NI 2 contribution not sent even though HMRC documentation was provided.
3.Invoices are not printed out on professional documentation and cannot be verified by any bank account statements.

Anyway,Im sending my appeal(paper) today. Should also reapply by end of next week...

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