Frequent and successive visits and "de facto residence&

[hiteshtuteja]

Recent changes to the immigration policy says that a general visitor - "does not intend to live for extended periods in the United Kingdom through frequent or successive visits". This has been introduced to "guard against abuse by those whose repeat visits amount to de facto residence".

I would like to know what is the definition of freuent - what frequency will be considered good or bad, successive - what is the measure for this and also what is the meaning of "de facto residence".

Reason I ask is that my mother has a 2 yr multiple entry general visitor visa which she got in November 2012 (valid till 2014). She came to UK in the end of Nov 2012 and stayed here for 80 days and has been in India since then. I am planning for her to come over here in the beginning of June and stay with us for 5 months or so. Based on the definitions of frequent and successive, I can then decide how much time will she have to spend in India before she can come here again. Will 3-4 months break be enough?

[MPH80]

The general rule of thumb is no more than 180 days present in the UK in any one rolling year period.

E.g. if you were here for 6 months continuously, wait 6 months before returning.

Based on what you've put - you'll probably be ok.

M.

[hiteshtuteja]

Another thing I would like to add is that this is the first time my mother has got a 2 yr visa. Prior to this since end of 2010, she would get a 6 months visa, come over here for 5 months, go back to India for at least 3 months and then get a fresh 6 months visa.

Is all this history taken into account at the port of entry?

[MPH80]

Only if they are otherwise concerned.

[hiteshtuteja]

Thanks M. Do you know what is "de facto residence" exactly? I tried to lookup on the web but couldn't find any specific definition.

[The Station Agent]

It means really living mainly here.

[MPH80]

The Station Agent is right ... but an expanded explanation (and to explain why you couldn't google it) is that it's actually two elements. If you just google 'de facto' - you get:

In law, it often means "in practice but not necessarily ordained by law" or "in practice or actuality, but not officially established."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_facto

So in other words it means 'the person is really living in the UK even if they are only on a visitor visa and are covering it by doing lots of short visits or long visits with short gaps and are claiming residence somewhere else'.

M.

[hiteshtuteja]

/Thanks guys. Sorry if my questions are getting boring but I really want to get this right.

So if my mother comes over for a 5 months' visit followed by a 3.5 months break and if the cycle is repeated, is there any chance of this pattern being considered as amounting to de facto residence?

[MPH80]

It is down to the opinion of the ECO.

You're asking, in a 13.5 month period, to spend 10 months here. Which is above the 6 in 12 recommendation.

It will, probably, be ok if it's a one-off - but it also might come down to the kind of day the person on the border is having.

[ban.s]

**the guideline says not more than 6 months in a 12 month period.** edit: this guideline has now been updated with revised texts.

ultimately it's the discretion of the immigration officer at the UK border and if a pattern is found then he may do nothing/warn/refuse entry/cancel visa depending on the nature / frequency of violation.

[hiteshtuteja]

Thanks for the immediate response. I think its more to do with the mood of the ECO.

However, I just found a link which says that there is no such a guidance. This link. This page has information and guidance for the immigration officers.
The link http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... 1/#header5 clearly says "There is no Rule that states a visitor can only remain in the UK for 6 out of any 12 months, but an ECO must examine the pattern and frequency of visits to see that it does not amount to de facto residence" and also says that there is no minimum stipulated time gap between 2 successive visits.

Just adds to the confusion.

[ban.s]

I was also looking for the above link in my mailbox and it seems they have recently changed the policy guidance. The same link had the below guidance until few weeks ago:

Section - VAT1.5 Frequency and duration of visits

It is reasonable, however, for the ECO to consider the stated purpose of the visit in the light of the length of time that has elapsed since previous visits. A visitor should not, for example, normally spend more that 6 out of any 12 months in the UK (but see guidance relating to visitors for private medical treatment).


As the 6 of 12 months guidance has now been removed, so I stand corrected. No such guidance exists as we speak.

[hiteshtuteja]

Ok...so now that we know that there is no such guidance as not more than 6 in 12 months, it looks like we are at the mercy of the immigration guy at the port who is going to judge the pattern as there is no objective definition of "successive" and "frequent". This is so weird.

[MPH80]

Which is precisely why 6 in 12 is probably still the best way to think about it and why I mentioned it.

You need a rule of thumb to work by - so use that. It's no guarantee - but it's better than nothing.

[Diana1234]

My parents in law have a 2 year visitor visa (both are retired).

There is no specific maximum period that an individual can spend in the UK in any period such as '6 months in 12 months'.
Https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... nce-v6.pdf

What is the cumulative period of time (per 2 year visa) a person can stay in the UK in order not to qualify as a 'de-facto' resident? Do you have any law, say, a visitor must not exceed 500 days, if he/she has a 2 year visa ? Say, 5 year visa - do not exceed 1250 days in total?

Say, parents in law will stay 5 months in the UK, then 2 months in their home country, then 5 months in the UK and then, 4 weeks in the UK, 5 months in the home country etc. So pattern is more frequent to see them in 1st year (10 months in the UK / 2 months in the home country) and more rare in 2nd year (2 months in the UK/ 10 months in the home country). In average will be 50% in the UK and 50% in the home country. Duration of 1 stay will not exceed 180 days. Will it be too frequent or is it all right in order to get a visa after 2 years?

To qualify for a permanent resident you should be 270 days in the UK. Can we relate a permanent resident rule of 270 days to be in the UK and 'de - facto' resident not to exceed 270 days a year?

Will the time spending with a grandchild be classified as unpaid job (feeding, walking, put sleeping)?


Regards,

Diana

[Casa]

This thread is over 4 years old I suggest that you open your own topic and post your question there.