Spouse VISA for Peruvian marrying Irish citizen in UK

[PAVA10]

Hi,

I was born in the UK and live in the UK. My father is Irish and I have dual nationality. At present I hold only an Irish Passport.

My fiance is peruvian and lives in Peru. I will be going to Peru to marry her and then she will apply for a VISA to come back with me to the UK.

1) Reading the regulations I understand that, as an Irish Citizen, we cannot apply EEA treaty rights beacuse my fiance has never lived in an EEA country before. Is this correct?

2) If we cannot apply for an EEA family permit then we need to apply for a UK spouse VISA. To obtain a UK spouse VISA however I need a British Passport, which I dont currently have (I do not believe I can hold both an irish and british passport at the same time although I may be wrong)

Could anybody please provide advice on our case?

Thanks in advance

[yankeegirl]

To your question #1

You absolutely can apply EEA treaty rights and apply for an EEA Family Permit. There is no requirement for the non-EEA spouse to have lived in a EU member state prior to application. (That is currently a requirement in the ROI, but not the UK). The application is free and the family permit would be valid for six months. The next step would be for your wife (after arriving in the UK)to apply for a residence card, which is valid for 5 years. Permanent residence is obtained after that 5 years. All EU application processes are free.

#2) You can also make an application under the UK Immigration Rules. You can make this application with your Irish passport, as Irish citizens are considered to have a settled status. You could also apply for and use a British passport if you so desired. You can have both passports as both countries recognize dual citizenship. The UK spousal visa costs £500 and is valid for two years. After that two years, the next step (after passing a Life in the UK test) is to apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain, in essence permanent residence, which the current fee is £750.

Your wife will be able to work and access healthcare under either route. Option #1 is free, but would take longer for your wife to obtain citizenship.
Option #2 is expensive but she would be able to apply for British citizenship after 3 years if she wanted.

[PAVA10]

Thank- you very much for a quick reply. It is appreciated.

Please forgive my ignorance but what does ROI signify? Also I have read (all across Yahoo - just type in Akrich + EEA) that the ruling in the case of Akrich in the European Court of Justice resulted in a change to the immigration rules. The rules now state that, in order to be issued with an EEA family permit, the non EEA spouse/partner must have been lawfully resident in the other EEA country before applying to enter the UK.

Were you aware of this case? Am I simply mis-interpreting the message given or do my fiance and I need to apply for the more expensice UK spouse VISA?

Thanks to confirm

[yankeegirl]

ROI=Republic of Ireland

The rules now state that, in order to be issued with an EEA family permit, the non EEA spouse/partner must have been lawfully resident in the other EEA country before applying to enter the UK.

That applies to non-EEA family members applying from within the EU. For example: you(Irish) and your Peruvian wife live in France, and wish to apply for the Family Permit and relocate to the UK. In order to make the application from France, she would have to prove that she was lawfully resident in France. Since she is applying from her own country outside the EU, that wouldn't apply to her.

Congrats on your upcoming wedding! I must say I'm jealous; Peru is my dream place to go on vacation...I'll make it there someday

[Docterror]

Option #2 is expensive but she would be able to apply for British citizenship after 3 years if she wanted

Just to add...If the spouse visa was granted on the basis of the Irish passport, the wife will have to wait for 5 years to get naturalised. The 3 years would only be applicable if made on the basis of the British citizenship.

[JAJ]

Just to add...If the spouse visa was granted on the basis of the Irish passport, the wife will have to wait for 5 years to get naturalised. The 3 years would only be applicable if made on the basis of the British citizenship.

That's not quite true. If spouse is a British citizen then the 3 year waiting time for naturalisation always applies, irrespective of how the person obtained UK immigration.

That said, if coming in by the EEA route, permanent residence is not available until 5 years has passed, which normally delays a naturalisation application.

But - if spouse (legally married or a civil partner) is a British citizen, the work-around is to use the "ppron method" to apply for naturalisation after 3 years legal UK residence on an EEA family permit. The "ppron method" does require more intellectual effort and travel costs to somewhere like Dublin - so not for everyone.

If the "ppron method" is not a workable option, then one should think very hard about using the UK-rules option rather than the EEA option, to get a quicker path to British citizenship.

[Docterror]

If spouse is a British citizen then the 3 year waiting time for naturalisation always applies, irrespective of how the person obtained UK immigration.

That's quite nice to know. So, in this case, the OP's wife can apply for the EEAFP on the basis of the OP's Irish citizenship and after 3 years use the "ppron method" and get naturalised using the OP's British citizenship? Amazing!

[PAVA10]

Thanks once again for you advice.

As a second (and I guess, now 3rd opinion) you all confirm that my understanding of the Akrich case is wrong and that we can indeed apply for the EEA Family Permit? Thanks to confirm.

Clearly our main objective is to be together after having married in Peru. I understand that under the EEA VISA my wife would also be able to work straight away and would be able to use NHS etc..

Some additional questions:-

1) If I am to go over to be married and the following day we submit our VAF 1 form to the UK embassy, how long on average would it take for the EEA family permit to be granted?

2) Is VAF 1 the only form required for this application or are there more? If so, which ones? I understand a marriage certificate, proof of funds to keep us both in UK (without public funds) and a proof of our own residence would by and large be sufficient information to support the application. A letter of application, proof of ongoing relationship, photos, phone bills etc.....is not required for the EEA family permit route. Thanks to confirm.

3) Our primary objective once married is to be together. The fact the EEA route is less of a burden and even costs nothing more than far outweighs the fact that my wife would likely need to wait 5 years before calling herself a British Citizen. What, if any, are the other practical day to day disadvantages of the 5 year wait?

Best Regards to all

[JAJ]

That's quite nice to know. So, in this case, the OP's wife can apply for the EEAFP on the basis of the OP's Irish citizenship and after 3 years use the "ppron method" and get naturalised using the OP's British citizenship? Amazing!

Yes. It's not possible to "switch track" to the domestic UK Immigration rules (other than leaving the UK and applying from scratch) but the nationality rules are structured differently.

[JAJ]

3) Our primary objective once married is to be together. The fact the EEA route is less of a burden and even costs nothing more than far outweighs the fact that my wife would likely need to wait 5 years before calling herself a British Citizen. What, if any, are the other practical day to day disadvantages of the 5 year wait?

One big disadvantage will be waiting longer for a British passport. In the meantime she'll likely need visas to travel pretty much anywhere with her Peruvian passport.

Other disadvantages include not being able to vote, restricted rights to work in the Civil Service, no right to live in other European countries, and if you left the UK you would have to re-start the whole visa process to return.

You really should investigate the "ppron method" to become naturalised British after 3 years, although bear in mind your wife will need an Irish visa to go to Dublin. She could always lodge the citizenship application in Lima if she returned there. Look carefully at this method - it's do-able, but not simple.

Also bear in mind you still need to prove a genuine relationship in order to get an EEA Family Permit. They do have the right to refuse if they suspect a marriage of convenience.

[PAVA10]

OK thanks. I understand the issues more now.

With regards to the necessity of proving a genuine relationship for the EEA family permit.........does this mean writing a supporting letter including photos, phone bills, letters, contact with families, flight tickets etc etc (as with the UK spouse VISA) or does the embassy decide this during an interview.

I had understood that for the EEA family permit it is for the embassy to find a reason as to why the marriage may be a marriage of convenience whereas for the Spouse VISA it is for the applicant to prove why the relationship is genuine.

I have known my fiance since Jan 2006, have had daily contact (phone calls, emails), have visited twice, have visited her family in Spain. My fiance contacts my parents regularly and I have started to learn spanish etc etc...We also have letters of support from family friend and employers. Is all of this evidence necessary for an EEA family permit?

Final question. Whilst I need a certificate of no impediment to marry from the Irish consular (and this needs a stamp from the Peruvian consular) does anybody know if Peru also requires an apostille stamp from the Irish embassy?

Thanks once again

[JR]

PAVA10, my wife is Peruvian and we applied for her visa through the British Embassy in Lima. The Embassy was very helpful and the visa application was easier than either of us expected. They check all of your documents to make sure you've got everything they need before taking your money, which is nice. My wife's interview was approximately one and a half weeks after she submitted her application, with the visa issued the next day.

The certificate of no impediment must be legalised against by the Peruvian equivalent of the foreign office in Lima Centro when you get it back from the Peruvian Consulate in London. The certificate of no impediment AND your birth certificate must be translated into Spanish by an official translator in Peru. I sent them both via Parcelforce Datapost to my wife a couple of weeks beforehand to make sure that was all in place.

You'll probably both have a take a blood test in Peru and also place an advert in a newspaper announcing your marriage before you can finish opening the marriage file and set a date for the ceremony. They're both easy to sort out, though. The exact requirements vary slightly between municipalities.

Proving our relationship to the embassy was painless. We printed out all our emails and MSN Messenger chat-logs and I took evidence of my previous trips to Peru (KLM e-ticket, hotel receipts, photographs etc) along with a couple of letters of support which satisfied them. We didn't submit this with the application, they asked her to bring the evidence to her interview.

Aside from that, all we needed was proof of funds (they just wanted (and wouldn't take any more than) three months of bank statements and payslips) and proof of accomodation.

After reading some horror stories on this board, both of us came away very impressed at how helpful the embassy were and how easy they made it for us.